Closing of Apopka, Florida Convention

[openingact34]

Aug 12, 2018 22:07:24 GMT -5 mr42 said:

As an "innie" (we're all belly buttons, no?) the convention "thing" has gotten absolutely ridiculous. New barns, new kitchens, new sleeping quarters...perhaps we don't have church buildings per se, but we sure build a lot slightly multi purpose other things. Some (most?) aren't even on farms anymore...good luck with the multi-purpose on that. I don't remember that bake sale for funds, just saying. Rented fairgrounds or some such is a marvelous idea IMO. As society gets further and further from an agrarian life to more urban/suburban, the effort to hold on to a traditional at extreme costs and endeavors that HAD rhyme and reason at one point has become borderline foolish. If we can't examine why we do what we do and separate tradition from scripture we are fools. But then most of you are "outties", I think, so I am preaching to the (ex) choir. Convention land is NOT holy ground, any worker who says that is misguided at best (a scriptural idiot at worst) and any friendly who believes that flat out stupid. That is about 2 degrees from seeing George Walkers image in your toast at the breakfast table. My family's convention later became corn and soybeans where the dining tent and meeting tent use to be. Boy you should have seen the size of those crops...just kidding...they were just like all the other plants! Do you think God puts any value on religious relics? Maybe I can find the holy chalice of George Walkers first communion! Eternal youth will be mine! But it might make me bald...decisions...argh!

Apologies for the rant...I think I can get by with it with you all...I shared my opinion in a conversation at convention once...I was looked at like I had a pitchfork and horns!

Some of you other Innies that want to refute my opinion in multi colored bold face text quoting some OT chapter and verse, don't bother. It's not about tithes of cumin and anise. Go Pharisee your nut-jobbery somewhere else.

The central focus of the group has always been on convention.  This is not a recent development; but rather a core foundational belief.

Just look at the name that they chose to register with governments: "Christian Conventions".  That name is so old it was selected back when George Walker and Jack Carroll still got along, so it is the same in East and West.  I remember while growing up, asking where convention was specified in the bible....got the same icy "pitchfork and horns" response.

Convention is so sacred that it cannot be questioned.  I think any true friend or worker would look at your post and be horrified by the "bad spirit".

[Get off of TMB]

Will there be any crowd restriction at the fairgrounds??

[Dennis J]

Say, all us excommunicates likely could attend!

What a witness that would be, if they tried to have us denied entry there!  Workers, beware!

Dennis Jacobsen

[howitis]

I know I was brought up a little different to most, as in my parents did not do the worker worship thing or really push anything at all that could not be backed up by scripture. In the late 70's here it was common for visitors to NSW to do a convention crawling 'tour' and then these visitors would show pics of these convention grounds here and there as they went about their holidays. To me and many others they were just a pile of sheds and buildings.....thank goodness most of that has changed, or maybe those people died or became unable to travel, don't get me wrong I love going to convention though as my dad used to say 'wouldn't matter if they held it in a park, paddock or palace, its not the place we go for'

[Get off of TMB]

I heard that a highway is going through the grounds?

[BobWilliston]

Aug 15, 2018 10:02:13 GMT -5 Get off of TMB said:

Will there be any crowd restriction at the fairgrounds??

Interesting question. I suspect if they rent the whole facility for private usage
that they would legally be able to restrict entry. But that could all depend on
the local rules for rented facilities. For normal usage of such facilities
everyone has to pass through a ticket booth for entry.

[CherieKropp]

Aug 16, 2018 5:30:01 GMT -5 mr42 said:

Aug 16, 2018 0:05:28 GMT -5 BobWilliston said:

If I am not mistaken, in Hawaii, before there was a private grounds to hold convention, it was held in a civic location for 2 or 3 days. Perhaps someone can enlighten (that actually knows)?

This is true.  The first conv grounds in Hawaii was built around 2005-06 on John Twelker's property, per Alan Vandermyden.  
Funny thing is all the conv lists show Honolulu as the location, but neither conv, was actually held in Honolulu 

[Get off of TMB]

The fairgrounds thing would probably be cheaper. And not put so much stress on one or two families.

[CherieKropp]

I read some notes today written by a U.S. sister worker about her 1997 tour abroad to conventions.  Confirming what some have written about conv. locations in other countries, she wrote:
 

Conv in Vienna:  "Vienna is held in the Youth Center in town and we stayed with friends some miles away and went out to the meetings via train in the mornings.  Meals were served there in the Center so we all ate lunch there.  Those who rented rooms from the Center also ate other meals there."

Conv in Poland:  "They rent a couple of large 'bed and breakfast' houses to accommodate the friends and workers. Meetings are held in a hall in town and everyone goes there, returning for meals and the nights. That works very satisfactorily."

"I could not help but thank God for those who came to use from the British isles and gave us so much. Over and over, I was reminded that we are debtors to that land--and that people."

[Get off of TMB]

Kelvin naef can use this change as an opportunity to remind people not to worship convention grounds.

[Alan Vandermyden]

Aug 16, 2018 5:30:01 GMT -5 mr42 said:

If I am not mistaken, in Hawaii, before there was a private grounds to hold convention, it was held in a civic location for 2 or 3 days. Perhaps someone can enlighten (that actually knows)?

The Hawai'i convention was held at the Kokokahi YWCA for years. Kokokahi is on the windward side of O'ahu, across the mountains from Honolulu, near Kane'ohe. As Cherie mentioned above, construction on the new convention grounds (on the Waianae coast of O'ahu) began in 2004 or 2005. We lived there at the time, but I can't remember exactly when construction began, and exactly which year the first convention was held. Convention in Hawai'i is four days, held over the Thanksgiving weekend.

[snow]

I don't really see the problem. What ever place is large enough to hold a convention should be just fine, no? It shouldn't matter so much where it's held as much as it has enough room to hold the people that want to gather together and listen to the workers like at a regular convention. Things change and we have to be flexible enough to allow that to happen. Bottom line it should focus on finding a place large enough to allow the fellowship of a lot of people. The rest is just 'details' imo.

[Alan Vandermyden]

Aug 16, 2018 8:18:41 GMT -5 CherieKropp said:

This is true.  The first conv grounds in Hawaii was built around 2005-06 on John Twelker's property, per Alan Vandermyden.  
Funny thing is all the conv lists show Honolulu as the location, but neither conv, was actually held in Honolulu 

This is correct regarding the convention not being in Honolulu in a practical sense, but it is technically in Honolulu now, as the City and County of Honolulu are now both coterminous with the island of O'ahu. This was done to save on governmental costs, but it creates issues, such as when someone in a rural part of O'ahu applies for a grant for small farm development, and they are technically in the city of Honolulu.

However, I doubt that this formed the reason for stating the convention as being in Honolulu - I assume this was done, partially because Honolulu is a known name, and in the case of the current convention, the workers don't really want the association of Nanakuli or Waianae Coast, which are known as rougher areas.

I personally love the area, and have no problem walking around and interacting with the locals. Some of the old Hawaiian friends who lived in Nanakuli once told me about a time when Joe Layman stayed with them, and they grew worried when Joe seemed to be gone an extra-long time on his walk. They went searching, and found him playing football with a bunch of Samoan guys, who supposedly would have beat him up!

[Alan Vandermyden]

Nov 2, 2018 16:29:04 GMT -5 snow said:

I don't really see the problem. What ever place is large enough to hold a convention should be just fine, no? It shouldn't matter so much where it's held as much as it has enough room to hold the people that want to gather together and listen to the workers like at a regular convention. Things change and we have to be flexible enough to allow that to happen. Bottom line it should focus on finding a place large enough to allow the fellowship of a lot of people. The rest is just 'details' imo.

Snow, I wholeheartedly agree with you in a practical way, but I did see a very interesting change when the new convention ground were constructed in Hawai'i.

The old grounds, the rented Kokokahi YWCA facility near Kane'ohe, had been used for years, and the Locals (nearly an ethnic group in Hawai'i, comprised of the local Asian-Island mix) knew how to put things together better than the workers, who changed every few years (after the Christies left, of course!). It was their convention, and they loved it, though there were problems with overcrowding by visiting mainlanders. There was a lot of "to-do" over the building of the new grounds, and the brother worker who was there much of the time emphatically stated that they wanted things done "as we do them in California" - this was in regard to meeting times, workers leading the hymns (rather than a local man who had led them for years), and numerous details that were in themselves insignificant, but it made it very obvious who was running things.

The change also included the ability for local friends to stay on the grounds. We were in the midst of the "shunning" that led to our departure from meetings, and we chose to drive home each evening. There are things I like about staying on the grounds, and this was a much-loved part of our childhood conventions, but it also felt much like a control thing at this time. It was often implied that all the friends should be staying at the grounds. The accommodations had very practical implications for those from the neighboring islands, but for some of us living on O'ahu, our own beds, just 30 or 40 minutes away, were much more appealing than the dormitory...

Anyway, I cannot (and do not care to) point to anything "wrong" about the grounds on private property, but there was a perceptible shift in the way it all "felt," in terms of who was "calling the shots" - power play?

[Lowell]

I wonder why they didn't move it back to Lowell? They took it from a great location just so they could have more control.

[Quentin & Tammy Spanicek]

We currently live in CO, but are looking to move near Tampa. We are wondering where & when the FL conventions are.

Thank you.

[Deleted]

Jun 5, 2022 20:59:06 GMT -5 Quentin & Tammy Spanicek said:

We currently live in CO, but are looking to move near Tampa. We are wondering where & when the FL conventions are.

Thank you.

ask cherie kropp she would know professing.proboards.com/user/21