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Post by Roselyn T on Sept 28, 2014 0:01:11 GMT -5
How many people grew up being told that the F&W fellowship was the only true way ? That all other Churches were wrong and of the "World". That if you left the F&W fellowship that you were lost?
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Post by dmmichgood on Sept 28, 2014 0:19:43 GMT -5
How many people grew up being told that the F&W fellowship was the only true way ? That all other Churches were wrong and of the "World". That if you left the F&W fellowship that you were lost? I certainly grew up (born in 1932) being told that the "F&W fellowship," -the TRUTH, the WAY, we didn't call it the "fellowship," -was the only TRUE way & that all other Churches were "false" & the their preachers were "false" preachers and we had to keep "apart" from the "World!"
With that kind of conditioning, we didn't even THINK about leaving! What a heretical thought!
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Post by Mary on Sept 28, 2014 1:16:30 GMT -5
How many people grew up being told that the F&W fellowship was the only true way ? That all other Churches were wrong and of the "World". That if you left the F&W fellowship that you were lost? Me
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Post by Mary on Sept 28, 2014 1:16:58 GMT -5
How many people grew up being told that the F&W fellowship was the only true way ? That all other Churches were wrong and of the "World". That if you left the F&W fellowship that you were lost? I certainly grew up (born in 1932) being told that the "F&W fellowship," -the TRUTH, the WAY, we didn't call it the "fellowship," -was the only TRUE way & that all other Churches were "false" & the their preachers were "false" preachers and we had to keep "apart" from the "World!"
With that kind of conditioning, we didn't even THINK about leaving! What a heretical thought!
Ditto....
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Post by bubbles on Sept 28, 2014 1:29:38 GMT -5
Me too. We are the only ones going to heaven. The preachers are gods own servants who have given up everything (jobs, money, marriage to preach the gospel.)
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Post by Roselyn T on Sept 28, 2014 2:19:18 GMT -5
So where did we get this belief from ? Was it what we heard preached or what our parents told us ?
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Sept 28, 2014 2:40:21 GMT -5
I also grew up hearing this. What puzzles me now is that I read on TMB on another thread that some people who I think are about my age say that they have never heard this. Although only being in the same field briefly as this other dude that has never heard this we would have listened to the same workers and most likely have mutual friends through out the country. So are the F&W's not claiming this only way doctrine now or some people having selective memory loss or just plain ol lying.
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Post by Roselyn T on Sept 28, 2014 3:06:39 GMT -5
That is the reason I started this thread to try & find out !
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2014 3:24:26 GMT -5
I also grew up hearing this. What puzzles me now is that I read on TMB on another thread that some people who I think are about my age say that they have never heard this. Although only being in the same field briefly as this other dude that has never heard this we would have listened to the same workers and most likely have mutual friends through out the country. So are the F&W's not claiming this only way doctrine now or some people having selective memory loss or just plain ol lying. Just because people say they never heard it, doesn't mean they never heard it. As you rightly say, they could be suffering from selective memory loss or just plain old lying. Or they could be suffering from complete memory loss. Or delusion. Or disingenuousness. Or deafness. Or an acute form of madness. Or they could be involved in a futile attempt to re-write history or a PR exercise to paint the fellowship in a more positive light. Or they could be attempting to deflect criticism of a claim which clearly no longer stacks up. Whatever their reasons they are clearly and categorically wrong about this. It is interesting to note that those making such claims rarely provide anything of substance to back them up. They don't address the Living Witness Doctrine. Or deal with Willie Pollock's stump theory. They don't explain the endless subtle references in 2x2 preaching or the oft recited God's only true servants hogwash. They really have very little to offer up. Of course many believers here often make claims which simply do not stack up and which they cannot back up. Some even end up leaving over it. But as we all now know, believing something to be true or stating it as true doesn't make it so. Matt10
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2014 3:27:48 GMT -5
Roselyn, hi You are left with two choices in this matter 1 - the foundation church in the New Testament is to be obeyed literally, or 2 - you can add, change, paste and copy, append, redact, twist or plain ignore to your heart's desire.
Can all Christian churches be of God? Some Christians say "Do no harm" whilst others march to the Holy Land to slaughter the infidels and Jews. Some say "Jesus only" whilst others believe Mary ascended to heaven in her purity and we can pray to her, too. Some say "God doesn't dwell in temples made with hands" and others build soaring cathedrals.
So what does God stand for if it His word isn't to be taken literally?
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Post by bubbles on Sept 28, 2014 4:31:16 GMT -5
So where did we get this belief from ? Was it what we heard preached or what our parents told us ? Both Relatives too.
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Post by withlove on Sept 28, 2014 4:43:31 GMT -5
Me.
From workers and from parents and from friends.
Not only growing up, but continually, all my life, everywhere I have lived, until present day. In the last year I have heard my overseer be very direct on the matter and he clearly is continuing the story of the status quo. As of a few weeks ago, the workers in my field confirmed they share the same belief.
I personally have never heard any worker in "the truth" say that we are not the only way. They always say the opposite.
Someone must confess that other churches are false and this is the only true and living way or they are not considered to be in the fold. On rare occasions a person will slip through the cracks and be a fully participating member but clearly not believe the party line on this and they are either confronted and told to take some time to go to more gospel meetings before participating again or the workers and friends will allow the person to continue and just talk about him behind his back, the gist being that he doesn't understand yet but with time the Spirit will bring him to the right conclusion.
There are definitely a number of people inside who don't believe it's the only way but are careful who they discuss it with...
I have never heard anyone anywhere say that "the truth" as a group believes that any other Christian church is or could be truly Christian. Virgo is the first person to my knowledge.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2014 4:59:25 GMT -5
So what does God stand for if it His word isn't to be taken literally? This is surely a rather foolish question. It starts with the premise that God stands for something when there isn’t anything at all to indicate that God stands for anything. It isn’t even clear what the term ‘stand for’ in the question means. It also assumes that God has a word. There is nothing independent to indicate that the Bible really is the word of God any more than the Qur’an is the word of God or any other religious book. Even if the original writings that make up the Bible reflected the word of God at one time, these have surely been much translated, mis-translated and misinterpreted by mere and mortal men to the extent that they can no longer be depended upon to be an accurate reflection of anything that God ever said. Even if one accepts that the Bible as it stands is the inerrant word of God, no one takes it literally, least of all those who claim the need to. No one I know refuses to eat shell fish on a Sunday or literally puts to death gay men. Those who hark on most about taking the Bible literally tend to be those who wish to provide support for their own belief system and often a crazy one at that; and the more crazy the belief system the more the need to find scripture to support it that can then be claimed to be required to be taken literally. Claiming to take the bible literally is foolish and taking it literally is more foolish still ..... unless of course you’re prepared never to wear clothes made of two kinds of material and never to trim your beard. Matt10
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Post by xna on Sept 28, 2014 7:47:06 GMT -5
How many people grew up being told that the F&W fellowship was the only true way ? That all other Churches were wrong and of the "World". That if you left the F&W fellowship that you were lost? That was the clear message. FWIW - My impression is that most denominations believe they too are the only right way. The 2x2 was / is just more in your face about the matter. I suspect the common starting point for a new denomination is; someone thinks all the other guys got it wrong.
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cbs
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Post by cbs on Sept 28, 2014 8:17:28 GMT -5
An interesting tidbit taken from John Longs journal:
"JULY, 1903: After that we went to a Convention in Rathmolyon. From that time all the workers began to baptize, and separate their converts; form them into assemblies to meet together on the first day of the week for fellowship, breaking of bread and prayers. Acts 2:42. Also, they appointed bishops, or elders over them. William Irvine emphasized separation but not exclusiveness. However, it was very manifest that while all that was good and Scriptural and a growing necessity; and an improvement on the existing sects; yet there was much need for more tenderness to the Holy Spirit; avoiding extremes hurtful to the tender conscience, and injurious to truth. It was from that conference a few workers including William Irvine, went to America for a gospel tour."
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Post by jamiek8407 on Sept 28, 2014 8:33:34 GMT -5
Yes I too heard this. You hear it spoken both directly and indirectly
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2014 8:52:36 GMT -5
Truth be told, I grew up from childhood hearing that from parent, professing family members, and workers in gospel meetings and at conventions. I also heard it said many time that the fellowship began on the shores of Galilees and had continued ever since then. By the way, my grandfather was an elder, meetings kept in his home. It is said that confession is good for the soul, so why should one deny these things? If mistakes were made, then correct them because we all make mistakes from time to time. The truth is the truth for goodness sake, let us put the records straight and move forward.
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Post by matisse on Sept 28, 2014 9:16:25 GMT -5
I was taught all of that by friends, family and workers. I was taught that in addition to being lost, anyone who left meetings would never find true happiness or peace.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2014 12:07:42 GMT -5
How many people grew up being told that the F&W fellowship was the only true way ? That all other Churches were wrong and of the "World". That if you left the F&W fellowship that you were lost? yes i was raised that way...
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2014 12:09:26 GMT -5
So where did we get this belief from ? Was it what we heard preached or what our parents told us ? misinterpretation of verses....
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Post by Mary on Sept 28, 2014 14:40:27 GMT -5
........and remember it is the same the world over. So yes it was preached around the world. From the workers and our parents. Remember that many of our grand parents joined the group because of being told it was the only true way. More than that - they were told it was a continuation of the New Testament church. They could not have heard it from their parents but directly from the workers mouths.
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Post by dmmichgood on Sept 28, 2014 15:05:55 GMT -5
I also grew up hearing this. What puzzles me now is that I read on TMB on another thread that some people who I think are about my age say that they have never heard this. Although only being in the same field briefly as this other dude that has never heard this we would have listened to the same workers and most likely have mutual friends through out the country. So are the F&W's not claiming this only way doctrine now or some people having selective memory loss or just plain ol lying. Just because people say they never heard it, doesn't mean they never heard it. As you rightly say, they could be suffering from selective memory loss or just plain old lying. Or they could be suffering from complete memory loss. Or delusion. Or disingenuousness. Or deafness. Or an acute form of madness. Or they could be involved in a futile attempt to re-write history or a PR exercise to paint the fellowship in a more positive light. Or they could be attempting to deflect criticism of a claim which clearly no longer stacks up. Whatever their reasons they are clearly and categorically wrong about this. It is interesting to note that those making such claims rarely provide anything of substance to back them up. They don't address the Living Witness Doctrine. Or deal with Willie Pollock's stump theory. They don't explain the endless subtle references in 2x2 preaching or the oft recited God's only true servants hogwash. They really have very little to offer up. Of course many believers here often make claims which simply do not stack up and which they cannot back up. Some even end up leaving over it. But as we all now know, believing something to be true or stating it as true doesn't make it so. Matt10 Thank you once again, Matt10.
You demonstrate the plethora of ways we humans try to make ourselves believe something that unbelievable.
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Post by SharonArnold on Sept 28, 2014 15:49:21 GMT -5
So where did we get this belief from ? Was it what we heard preached or what our parents told us ? Both. Of course.
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Post by déjà vu on Sept 28, 2014 19:06:07 GMT -5
It's been my experience that in most of meetings I attended some one speaks or hints that this is the only right way of worship.
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Post by Mary on Sept 28, 2014 21:59:21 GMT -5
To worship or salvation? I did not hear the word worship in this context in meetings. It was considered the only right way to salvation.
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Post by Roselyn T on Sept 28, 2014 22:02:22 GMT -5
I would say both Mary, that is why we were told all other churches were wrong.
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Post by déjà vu on Sept 28, 2014 22:09:12 GMT -5
I have noticed that in meetings self-abasement is more prevalent than worship
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Post by open mind on Sept 29, 2014 0:13:39 GMT -5
Heard it all my 2x2 life. Still hear it now from my profeessing friends... I am indeed lost! (aparrantly)
But does it really matter? God is God and (if you believe in him/her/it) who cares where or with who you worship him? they is still the same from what ever angle you look at it, is he/her/it not?
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