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Post by learnedaboutgrace on Aug 3, 2008 17:09:36 GMT -5
I think maybe we need to define "revelation". When you say, "God gave me a "revelation"' do you mean He "opened your eyes of understanding" in a way so you could understand a passage or do you mean He "gave you further enlightenment independant of the Bible"? Kind of an outside source of knowledge?
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Post by Jesse_Lackman on Aug 3, 2008 20:08:00 GMT -5
For what it's worth my attempt is -->> here <<. take care, Jesse
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shushy
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Post by shushy on Aug 4, 2008 20:12:22 GMT -5
Am I allowed to answer here?
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Post by learnedaboutgrace on Aug 5, 2008 1:01:52 GMT -5
please do...kinda quiet around here!
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Post by shushy on Aug 5, 2008 2:59:41 GMT -5
The spirit of revelation is a direct impartation from Jesus Christ given to apostles and prophets. It includes hearing from God in one way or another. The most common is 'to see.' The prophets all recieved revelation from God. Some were caught up in their spirit. They might see an angel, see the Lord. Some had dreams..Daniel. Other ways are when the Lord would enlighten a scripture to you. It might come as an audible voice, a thought, you might recieve insight on a situation, a knowing, a sense, a feeling( although we should not go on feelings) every revelation is subject to the person recieving it. For example the person is not entitled to /obligated to reveal what they have recieved. God trains you himself in this gift. It is also subject to judgement. It is for the extention of his Kingdom. For the church. Other christians can recieve revelation through spiritual gifts, but would not have the full extent of variety(as in ways God communicates) that a prophet or apostle would have. The prophet and apostle are supposed to work together with this gift. God shows the prophet what he wants to do, he shares with the apostle and there would be equal agreement bz God would confirm, and then the Apostles gifting is able to insititute what the Lord wants. It includes words of knowledge, words of wisdom, faith,encouragment, edification and impartation, direction, and correction. All kinds of things relating to the Kingdom of God. Gifts of the Holy Spirit: Heb2:4 1 Cor 12 This scripture is worth reading about spiritual gifts. It goes on to speak about the body of christ and how each one because we are a part of it, has a gift. "the eye cannot say to the hand I dont need you or the head to the feet I dont need you." There shouldnt be any division in the body. It says we should eagerly desire the spiritual gifts...
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shushy
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Post by shushy on Aug 5, 2008 12:36:43 GMT -5
Hi Nathan, Spiritual revelation comes easily by "reason of use". I will share this. I had been attending a church for a while(approx a yr) it was during the yrs of God training me as a visionary. Every wk during worship the Lord would open my inner eyes to see what was happening in/with that church. Each week out of respect and also because I am a woman. (women seer's are not easily accepted in those days) I would write down the vision and hand it to the Pastor afterwards.(the visions or dreams were quite specific, ie I'd see angels ministering to the people and tell what they were doing or a dream about the youth group and how one leader was illtreating some children etc) After 6 months of this. One day the Lord spoke very clearly into my spirit. He said" The revelation is NOT for the Pastors own private interpretation. " I was stunned. Then I thought about it. It was for the people. After that I no longer shared what God showed me. Consequently left that Church.
~~~ God wants us to share with others what He has revealed to us. Sorry Nathan I cant agree .It all depends on what the revelation is.In the begining after I was baptised in the Holy SPirit I shared with one friend all that was happening to me, and discovered later she was repeating it to all and sundry. I wondered why some of the people were not friendly towards me. Not that I cared at the time. This gift causes a lot of jealousy so it is better to keep quiet. This gift got people burnt at the stake in the old days. When we recieve revelation God needs to be able to trust us with it. Some of it are his secrets. He trains us with it. This takes time. I'm still sitting on things he showed me 10yrs or more ago almost 20yrs. Of course some is for the time you recieve it like the one I just shared.
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Post by shushy on Aug 5, 2008 13:01:49 GMT -5
Nathan,
I wasnt referring to your dream. Yes obvioulsy yours was too be shared.
[Some of the friends and workers are very skeptical of dreams and visions. I wondered because they haven't had them so it made them skeptical of these things. ]
No different to most leaders........until it happens to them. Although I will say that Pastor did recognise it.
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Post by shushy unlogged on Aug 5, 2008 18:32:19 GMT -5
31yrs in the meetings. Traumatic exit. My life changed dramaticly when I was baptised in the Holy SPirit, approx 5yr later. I was thust into ministry and ministered for over 10yrs from sunday school through to pastoring for a couple of yrs. I worked with prophets for 7yrs, helping with prayer teams and presbytary, organising conferences around the countries locally. Then circumstances changed. God has hidden me since. Other things happened and I went off the rails a bit in my personal life but gradually getting healed of some nasty stuff. He has never left me nor forsaken me in all my trials. Each yr he taught me something new. I liken my life to moses in the sense that I spent almost 40yrs learning about God and now I have been learning from pharohs court. Im not a theologian most of what I speak about here is experiencal.
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Post by shushy on Aug 6, 2008 1:42:46 GMT -5
Baptism in the Holy Spirit? We had a friend who was a Pastor Alan who attended the same church. Asked us if we had been Baptised in the Holy Ghost. No. I said "whats that" is it bible? Hubby was more easliy accepting than me. He had read and understood more than I did. Alan took us to scriptures eg:(Math 3:11, Mk1:8,Luke3:16,) and told us that when this happens you become empowered from on high, and can recieve gifts from the Holy Spirit. I was hessitant and a bit afraid of the unknown. He laughed ( he was a fun person anyway). Said there was absolutely nothing to be afraid of. The week before we had gone up the front of the new church for prayer for our family, while they laid their hands on my husband, I closed my eyes, next I knew I was prostate on the floor. Noone had touched me. I didnt know what the power of God was like, hadnt seen it happen before then. Opened my eyes got up and later discovered my back was healed. I had been going for chiro every month for a yr. Back is still ok. I/we became excited about God. I guess that is why Alan told us about the Baptism. We had also been questioning him about hte laying on of hands because they were doing at the new church. Our hearts we very open. So I finally agreed with much sceptisim. At the same time I wanted all that God had for me.Alan laid hands on each of our shoulders and prayed for us in the name of Jesus Christ for the Holy spirit to baptise us according to those scriptures. I didnt feel anything in particular but we both opend our mouths and I began to speak in another tongue about 6 words. He encourged us to keep praying like this out loud at home. Sure enough everytime I decided pray those same words came out. A few wks later. I listened to a teaching tape in my room one evening on Tongues and interpetation of tongues. At the end there was another prayer, and I recived another tongue, and that kept changing every few moments. My tongue was making sounds like an asian person, and changed to sound like russian. I felt excited that God had done this for me. What happend in my prayer life after the Baptism of the Holy Spirit. I just loved to pray. I became hungry for God and then enpassioned to hear his voice. I cried out to him, called out to him, learned about fasting, also my inner eye began to open. I would be going to sleep at night, and it would open and I would be looking at a scene or a picture for about 30 seconds, then it would close...then open again about 30 seconds later and I would be looking at something else. Also when I thanked praised and worshiped I began to see into....the heavens. It blew my mind. It had not happened to me ever in my life before. It came so frequently I would run to my Pastor to share with him. He would help me understand what was happening to me. In those early days Im sure there was a lot I was recieving that wasnt necessarily the lord speaking to me. It excited me, I wasnt afraid. Over time I had seasons of different types of visions for a number of yrs. I journaled a lot according to Habbakuk 2. I saw many many things from looking at an apple to trance like visions that were like being in a movie. I learned to hear from God. He wants to speak to all of us individually. I was truly blessed the day I agreed to recieve baptism of the Holy Ghost. The Holy SPirit himself taught me how to pray. Others taught me ways to pray. But he taught me how to find him in the secret place, he also taught me how to endure in prayer. How to enter into his presence and abide there and wait upon him. How to wait upon the Lord. Looking back he was preparing me for those yrs of ministry. Man cant teach you. Man can only take you so far. Nathan, I have been very open and honest with you. We have already discussed the gift of tongues at some length on another thread somewhere and I know most are disbelieving. My advice about giftings is that it is bible. My professing family are ignorant of what I have just written and some do come here sometimes. I have not shared my testimony with them except my bro some of what happened. They do not know this side of my life. they just think I went around different churches. Yes, in case you ask I have also laid hands on people and prayed for the baptism of the holy spirit and also for spiritual gifts and yes it happend to those people too. About spiritual gifts, tongues is the only one where there is a manifestation at the time of prayer. All the other gifts become evident over time. Interesting? You think? ....Naaaa the word is completely fasinating..LOL joke @ least my friends think so but hey they love me. With this gift u gain enemies you dont know about.
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shushy
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Post by shushy on Aug 6, 2008 18:49:09 GMT -5
So, I didn't want whatever in me to stay but I couldn't get rid of it on my own power it was too strong. I seek our pator's help and he couldn't help me either. I prayed to God in desperation for help. A few months later I met the workers and they explained to me the true baptism of the Spirit in the New Testament.
Would you care to explain how the workers explained the true baptism of the Holy Spirit. I would be very interested to know. I also would be interested to know if the people who explained it had experienced it. Fully understood it. Scripture says that the gifts are increased by "reason of use". I also know this from experience.I know when I go into a church my visionary/insight/perception/ etc all are activated very quickly when I worship. Also when I am with my christian friends discussing what I call "God stuff." I remember reading something about you recieved tongues and I also remember what the holy spirit revealed to me about it at the time. I have never known the Holy Spirit to blast people with power or pour power through them where they have no control. He is a gentleman. He is gentle.
After I professed in 1979 speaking in tounges went away and it hasn't returned.
Do you want it back though? That is the question. He tells us we should desire "all the gifts" and I prayed for the lot I was so keen for God to use me for his purposes. I dont think I have them all but I do know the ones I do have. If we ask for bread he wont give us a stone. He also wants us to ask/seek and knock until the door is opened to us.
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Post by how is it on Aug 6, 2008 19:47:29 GMT -5
aren't we getting more input from the workers? Because some of the people on here know more than the workers? or just like to write a great deal?
Let's hear from the workers!!!
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Post by lost worker on Aug 6, 2008 21:46:43 GMT -5
Did we lose the worker? Or Nathan are you a worker? I want to hear from the workers.
I hope they haven't been scared off. We need to hear from the workers.
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Post by shushy unlogged on Aug 6, 2008 23:16:48 GMT -5
Should I shut up?
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Post by learnedaboutgrace on Aug 6, 2008 23:58:35 GMT -5
Yes, I don't mind hearing what you have to say shushy and nathan but I sure wish the worker would come back...maybe she and others are just busy, but I hope we didn't scare her away.
I think she did say on another thread if she wasn't around for awhile not to worry but she also said she would leave if she didn't feel it was profitable.
Maybe if she does decide to leave she would at least let us know ahead of time??
Also, I guess if she was planning on never returning she wouldn't have taken the time to register just a few days ago?
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Post by ooT on Aug 7, 2008 11:27:20 GMT -5
I wouldn't be able to find the post right now, but I THOUGHT I read that the worker would be allowing a time slot for posting on Monday evenings. And I think she was here and posted just a couple answers this past Monday?
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shushy
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Post by shushy on Aug 7, 2008 19:28:20 GMT -5
Dont stress I have confidence she will be back..
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Post by worker83 on Aug 9, 2008 19:48:42 GMT -5
Thanks, Sushy, for your confidence ! ;D I registered due to popular demand, and also I realized that it didn't increase any obligation ! So feel free to PM anytime - Scott posted something quite appropriate on another thread - as to why 'workers' are not identifying themselves as workers - the attitude and demands - btw, I won't be online Monday evening, likely, so I'm on tonight ! I've been wondering why everyone wants the workers to post here, which in essence is annonymous - whether registered or not - unless we declare who we are like Lyle has done. It's like as long as you don't know the worker or don't face them, then you can accept their answers ? Or that you can tear the answers apart . . .(not you personally, just in general, those who enjoy doing that) . . . .what's the advantage of reading what a worker thinks or feels or understands here on TMB - rather than the ones in your area ? Of course, the personality issue - if you don't appreciate the manner of the ones in your area, then here you can have a varied input from others. . . I'd like some input - maybe I should start MY thread of questions ! I can see it now . .a subboard - questions FROM the workers - Whew, that would open a hornet's nest. On to your question - revelation - just a thought that was shared in the mtg last night from my companion - Heb 1:1 - in the past God spoke by various methods (ie. . .dreams, visions, revelations) but hath in these last days spoken to us by Jesus. So Jesus is the last revelation !! Of course, in the sense of our own understanding as a revelation - like Nathan wrote above, "Flesh and blood hath no revealed this unto you, but my Father . ." It seems revelation is the understanding from God - thru others, or the scripture, or whatever other input - or direct. But as I've posted before, it's PRIORITY over the fellowship - in fact, it's the basis OF the fellowship - it's what we have from God that brings us together for fellowship - if we have a living fellowship. . . .
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Post by learnedaboutgrace on Aug 9, 2008 20:58:08 GMT -5
This is why I believe that God is no longer using dreams and revelations (other than what I would call coming to a deeper understanding) during this dispensation of grace. Dispensation means "house rules" so one of the rules of grace are no more revelations.
I Cor 13:8 ‘love never faileth, but whether there be prophesies (revelations), they shall fail(which means ‘done away with’) and in II Cor 11:13-15 “for such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel, for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore, it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the minister of righteousness…
It is really nice to be able to discuss and even disagree over here without people taking pot shots, wouldn't you agree?
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Post by learnedaboutgrace on Aug 9, 2008 21:00:27 GMT -5
This is why I believe that God is no longer using dreams and revelations (other than what I would call coming to a deeper understanding) during this dispensation of grace. Dispensation means "house rules" so one of the rules of grace are no more revelations.
I Cor 13:8 ‘love never faileth, but whether there be prophesies (revelations), they shall fail(which means ‘done away with’) and in II Cor 11:13-15 “for such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel, for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore, it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the minister of righteousness…
It is really nice to be able to discuss and even disagree over here without people taking pot shots, wouldn't you agree?
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shushy
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Post by shushy on Aug 10, 2008 0:03:47 GMT -5
. Thanks, Sushy, for your confidence . Umm I knew in my spirit you would return. Thats why I said that. ( now that sounds super spiro dont it..sorry) I've been wondering why everyone wants the workers to post here, which in essence is annonymous - whether registered or not - unless we declare who we are like Lyle has done. It's like as long as you don't know the worker or don't face them, then you can accept their answers ? Or that you can tear the answers apart . . .(not you personally, just in general, those who enjoy doing that) . . . .what's the advantage of reading what a worker thinks or feels or understands here on TMB - rather than the ones in your area ? Of course, the personality issue - if you don't appreciate the manner of the ones in your area, then here you can have a varied input from others. . . I'd like some input - maybe I should start MY thread of questions ! I can see it now . .a subboard - questions FROM the workers - Whew, that would open a hornet's nest.To answer from my point of view. I cant speak openly like this with workers at home. (another nation where my professing family are. If I questioned the workers I might be rebuked by family. I do not want to offend my family they are old.)No, I dont want to tear anyone apart at all. I just have questions mostly about biblical stuff that I experinced or was taught after I left meetings. Ive wondered why I never heard these things then. Dont knw any workers in my area. This medium suits me. I do appreciate you responding I mean that most sincerely. Yes, sure ask questions why not. On to your question - revelation - just a thought that was shared in the mtg last night from my companion - Heb 1:1 - in the past God spoke by various methods (ie. . .dreams, visions, revelations) but hath in these last days spoken to us by Jesus. So Jesus is the last revelation !! Of course, in the sense of our own understanding as a revelation - like Nathan wrote above, "Flesh and blood hath no revealed this unto you, but my Father . ." It seems revelation is the understanding from God - thru others, or the scripture, or whatever other input - or direct. But as I've posted before, it's PRIORITY over the fellowship - in fact, it's the basis OF the fellowship - it's what we have from God that brings us together for fellowship - if we have a living fellowship. . . . Ill have to agree to disagree on the dream /vision statement you made. Only last wk a dream I had in april came true literally. To me it is all very real. You and I have been having living fellowship on here..... I have enjoyed it thank you.
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