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Post by Scott Ross on Sept 22, 2008 22:30:39 GMT -5
Hey Scott, the crazy biker dude..... You can't be to much of a crazy biker dude until you ride a HARLEY! I've ridden a few of them..... unfortunately, they just didn't have the 'oomph' of my Honda. A couple of my friends are getting married this Friday, and he asked me to bring their Harley home for him afterward. (I think he's going to be busy or something...) I'm the only one he trusts to ride it...... kinda freaky huh? Maybe I should wear my dreads while I'm riding it..... Scott
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Post by ilylo on Sept 22, 2008 22:52:56 GMT -5
Introducing the next thing in serial Barbie dolls... it's Rastafarian Scott!
With sincere apologies to that most litigious of corporations, Mattel.
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Post by Scott Ross on Sept 22, 2008 22:58:02 GMT -5
Not sure about marketing that look. How about this one??? Scott
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Post by ilylo on Sept 22, 2008 23:38:07 GMT -5
Hmmm... how about Hannibal Lecter/Achmed the Dead Terrorist Barbie?
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Post by harpsichord on Sept 23, 2008 5:55:43 GMT -5
Bandtroll--I must take exception to this:
PTSD is not a mental illness contrary to your link---While PTSD presents itself with many side effects it was only listed in DSM-IV for reasons of descriptive understanding. PTSD is a normal response to a very abnormal experience--For any health care professional to say one has a mental illness because of PTSD is causing secondary wounding to a victim of trauma.
That is what happened to many war veterans suffering from shell shock (PTSD)- They were deemed mentally ill when they were not.
Are you saying that women who have been raped and suffer from PTSD which would include depression and say panic disorder as a direct result of their being raped are mentally Ill? They have problems yes but by definition they are Normal and not repeat not mentally Ill. Maybe you should have someone throw Hand Gernades at you for a year and see what PTSD really is.
Further, people with diabetes do have conditions which effect their thinking, moods and function in every day life. Are they mentally ill? This blanket label of mental illness is getting carried away to extremes. According your lists everybody is mentally ill.
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Post by bandtroll on Sept 23, 2008 6:36:36 GMT -5
Bandtroll--I must take exception to this: PTSD is not a mental illness contrary to your link---While PTSD presents itself with many side effects it was only listed in DSM-IV for reasons of descriptive understanding. PTSD is a normal response to a very abnormal experience--For any health care professional to say one has a mental illness because of PTSD is causing secondary wounding to a victim of trauma.That is what happened to many war veterans suffering from shell shock (PTSD)- They were deemed mentally ill when they were not. Are you saying that women who have been raped and suffer from PTSD which would include depression and say panic disorder as a direct result of their being raped are mentally Ill? They have problems yes but by definition they are Normal and not repeat not mentally Ill. Maybe you should have someone throw Hand Gernades at you for a year and see what PTSD really is. Further, people with diabetes do have conditions which effect their thinking, moods and function in every day life. Are they mentally ill? This blanket label of mental illness is getting carried away to extremes. According your lists everybody is mentally ill. Both quotes were linked to, and take from, NAMI. National Alliance on Mental Illness. Feel free to contact them with your suggestions and corrections.
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dchaplin
New Member
Innocent until proven guilty. Liberty and justice for all. Let forgiveness prevail!!!!
Posts: 34
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Post by dchaplin on Sept 23, 2008 8:08:16 GMT -5
Scott Ross Moderator
member is offline
Ride free
Joined: Jan 2007 Gender: Male Posts: 1,798 Location: Ramsey, Minnesota Re: Michigan « Reply #81 on Sept 19, 2008, 1:28pm »
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hey Dave,
If you go back and look at the original posting by me, you will notice that I edited it a few days ago concerning the wording.
I have edited it as information came my way. I try to be as fair as possible concerning what has been posted here, and certainly did not post all the 'stuff' that I heard. The names came my way AFTER they were reported to the authorities. Yours was in the first group reported, and so I heard of it pretty quick.
Incidentally, for those who haven't heard, The girls have been referred for further treatment at the forensic center. They have been found not competent to stand trial at this time.
Not sure which direction this will take now, but that is the latest I have heard.
Scott
« Last Edit: Sept 19, 2008, 1:29pm by Scott Ross » Report Post - Link to Post - Back to Top Logged Hey Scott, thanks for the reply it helps to clarify a few of the questions that are lingering in some of our minds, the ones of us that want the complete truth to be known and the innocent names to be cleared. I truly believe you have a noble cause and try to be fair as you stated here in your reply. However I wonder if you can give me a definition of what you consider fair to be? I noticed in your reply you stated you edited your original post ( regarding the twins parents ) a few days ago. Do you consider it fair, to falsely accuse these people and post it on this web site for approximately 7 months for all the world to see? Do you consider it fair to compile a list of suspects of which many are innocent on your W.I.N.G.S. web site? I question the legality of your form you have people fill out to submit peoples names and personal information, since some forms of child abuse are considered mental illness by those that inflict it, does your web site comply with the Federal Governments Guidelines for (HIPAA) THE HEALTH INSURANCE PORTABILITY AND ACCOUNTABILITY ACT OF 1996. It seems to me you are violating the law your self by deseminating confidential information about people that you don't even know. Just wondering???!!! Sincerely, David K. Chaplin
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Post by degem on Sept 23, 2008 9:52:29 GMT -5
I may be putting my neck on the line but I have/dealt with3 of the illnesses that bandtroll mentions in his/her post #115. Without going into personal details, I have been to hell and back. I have had some people , when told what I "have", say that they never would have "guessed". Believe me people it was/has been no "picnic in the park." I am doing 150% better now. Please,no demeaning or bashing remarks. Gem
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Post by Scott Ross on Sept 23, 2008 11:44:57 GMT -5
Dave, Hey Scott, thanks for the reply it helps to clarify a few of the questions that are lingering in some of our minds, the ones of us that want the complete truth to be known and the innocent names to be cleared.You're welcome. I truly believe you have a noble cause and try to be fair as you stated here in your reply. Thank you. I wonder if you can give me a definition of what you consider to be fair is? Only posting information which is in the public domain in regards to ongoing court issues, information from other public sources such as newspapers or television news sources. Records held by school system counselors which are made available to the public regarding reports turned in. Information given by public officials. I noticed in your reply you stated you edited your original post ( regarding the twins parents ) a few days ago. Yes, I hadn't read what I originally posted there for some time. This is what I edited the other day, it was information from a public official I had talked to: The girls haven't actually been saying the word "prostitution", tho that is an accurate description of what was happening edited due to this being an unproven point...Do you consider it fair, to falsely accuse these people and post it on this web site for approximately 7 months for all the world to see? Who did I falsely accuse? The only thing listed on WINGS were the original news articles which was in the newspaper and a link to the ABC news which reported the investigation. Do you consider it fair to compile a list of suspects on your W.I.N.G.S. web site? If you are referring to the names reported in Michigan, those names were not placed in any database because of the involvement in the Michigan case. There were names that came up during the investigation which were linked to other investigations in the past by law enforcement however, but were reported separate of the Michigan case involving the twins. I question the legality of your form you have people fill out to submit peoples names and personal information, since some forms of chid abuse are considered mental illness by those that inflict it, does your web site comply with the Federal Governments Guidelines for (HIPPA) THE HEALTH INSURANCE PORTABILITY AND ACCOUNTABILITY ACT OF 1996Why do you feel it is illegal to submit names of individuals that are suspected of Child Sexual Abuse? These names are not stored on the WINGS site, but rather used to cross reference with other reports involving the same name. For any who wish to read about the HEALTH INSURANCE PORTABILITY AND ACCOUNTABILITY ACT, here is a link to that: www.cms.hhs.gov/HIPAAGenInfo/Downloads/HIPAALaw.pdfIt should be pointed out that at no time did WINGS post the names of the family involved in the child abuse issue. What was reported was in the public domain, and has since been removed from the site. It could also be pointed out that at no time did the family plead NOT GUILTY to the charges against them, but rather entered a no contest plea. They have complied with all court ordered restrictions placed on them and that is why the kids have been reunited with the adoptive parents. I am guessing that after the 90 day follow up hearing in November that most restrictions will be removed. Some of the names linked to the separate child sexual abuse case involving the twins remain under investigation at this time. Thanks for the questions Dave, hope this cleared up a few things for you. For a comparison to our fairly small site at WINGS, here is another site dealing with abuse: www.snapnetwork.org/Scott
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Post by bandtroll on Sept 23, 2008 13:24:20 GMT -5
This is what I edited the other day, it was information from a public official I had talked to: The girls haven't actually been saying the word "prostitution", tho that is an accurate description of what was happening edited due to this being an unproven point...From Russian Twins trial begins next week. 9/19/08FBI International is when the girls claimed the big porno ring involved Russian people. They must have said something to get people to think they were not acting on their own.
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Post by jdouglas on Sept 23, 2008 14:11:14 GMT -5
Gem, Thanks for sharing. We have mental illness in our fam, too. I just want you to know I understand what you're saying. Unless you've been there, it's hard for people to understand the suffering that patients go through. NAMI is a great organization and helped us out a lot, especially at first. Glad you're doing well now! "We" are too.
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Post by Scott Ross on Sept 23, 2008 14:18:50 GMT -5
I have had some people , when told what I "have", say that they never would have "guessed". Believe me people it was/has been no "picnic in the park." I am doing 150% better now.
Please,no demeaning or bashing remarks.Well.... hmmmm.... wonder if I can manage to say anything to you that won't be considered demeaning.. Anyhow..... demeaning of this post is to point out that what I see you as 'having', is something I wish a lot of the other folks around here had.... In all of our PM's and emails and interaction here on the board I have ONLY seen a side of you that is good and steadfast in your belief in God and what is right for you and your family. In fact someone recently PM'd me and said that they had the opportunity of meeting you at convention a few weeks back, and that you were pretty darn nice. One thing about all of us that have been to hell and back..... We're back!!! Scott
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Post by cheechette on Sept 23, 2008 18:13:02 GMT -5
Not sure about marketing that look. How about this one??? Scott Hey Scott..... I notice you are the President of the Dry Riders in Elk River. Did you ever wear colors since you call yourself the crazy biker dude? In Michigan we have the Clean and Sober Club.
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Post by degem on Sept 23, 2008 18:19:11 GMT -5
I have seen alot of biker dudes in my time but not quite as "unique" as you Scott.
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Post by Scott Ross on Sept 23, 2008 18:50:07 GMT -5
Hey Scott..... I notice you are the President of the Dry Riders in Elk River. Did you ever wear colors since you call yourself the crazy biker dude? In Michigan we have the Clean and Sober Club.
We are one of those sober riding clubs. You can see what our colors look like in this picture. I'm shooting my cap and ball pistol here: Some of our women have some pretty nice tails too.... ;D So Gem.... I have seen alot of biker dudes in my time but not quite as "unique" as you Scott.
Not sure what is so unique about me.......... Scott
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Post by freedonforever on Sept 23, 2008 19:43:36 GMT -5
The article about the child abuse has finally been pulled off after a lot of complaining about it. No good report about that case will ever be posted. But, how come nothing was posted about the trouble with false allegations as much as allegations? Also there are arresting reports that could be posted but they are not. Don't know why fair and fair isn't practiced with everyone.
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Joe Lynn
Senior Member
joerlynn@msn.com
Posts: 257
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Post by Joe Lynn on Sept 23, 2008 21:05:13 GMT -5
Scott, ;D ;D
You've got a fly in your teeth dude... not a good look..........then again .....Scott and "good look" probably aren't used in the same sentence often!!!! ;D ;D ;D
Don't let that Harley get away from ya!
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White Knight
Senior Member
THE SHADOW KNOWS. In the shadow of the highest is a refuge from all fear.
Posts: 510
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Post by White Knight on Sept 23, 2008 21:31:26 GMT -5
Well hello Dave, bin a while since we talked. Were you not accused four or five times, by the twins? Can't, say as I blame you for being upset. I believe you were in the same group I was, top ten named. The more, of us, that, respond here the better. The other side enjoyed there little time here, now the tide has turned they seem to be hiding. Kind of like a different tune. PM me or give me a call or email me thanks WK.
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peace and joy
Junior Member
For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink, but righteousness, and peace,and joy in the Holy Ghost
Posts: 109
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Post by peace and joy on Sept 24, 2008 10:38:08 GMT -5
Scott wrote - Why do you feel it is illegal to submit names of individuals that are suspected of Child Sexual Abuse? These names are not stored on the WINGS site, but rather used to cross reference with other reports involving the same name.
Are the 200 that were originally SUSPECTED of Child Sexual Abuse in the Michigan case stored in reports that can be cross referenced in case they are falsely accused again?
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peace and joy
Junior Member
For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink, but righteousness, and peace,and joy in the Holy Ghost
Posts: 109
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Post by peace and joy on Sept 24, 2008 10:44:22 GMT -5
To Dave and White Knight - I'm so sorry that both of you, along with many others, have had to go through this horrible mess. I'm so glad that it hasn't prevented either of you from having a good spirit.
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Post by bandtroll on Sept 24, 2008 11:10:23 GMT -5
Are the 200 that were originally SUSPECTED of Child Sexual Abuse in the Michigan case stored in reports that can be cross referenced in case they are falsely accused again? Some of the names linked to the separate child sexual abuse case involving the twins remain under investigation at this time. It sounds like some of them still would be.
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Post by Scott Ross on Sept 24, 2008 11:31:26 GMT -5
Howdy conventioner, Are the 200 that were originally SUSPECTED of Child Sexual Abuse in the Michigan case stored in reports that can be cross referenced in case they are falsely accused again? No. We neither asked for nor received all those names. I probably saw about 30 names on that long list, and some of them were already ones that have been reported for issues unrelated to the Michigan mess involving the twins. I think that perhaps there is some confusion about how we come by names, and what we do with them on the WINGS site. The names we have were mostly PM'd or emailed to us separate of the WINGS site. After getting several that way, we added a reporting section where people could give information and not have to interact with anyone if they didn't want to. We do NOT simply get a name with vague references to abuse, but rather we get statements made concerning when the abuse took place, where it happened, whether the authorities were notified, and the results of that. There is a section on WINGS that lists those who have been convicted of CSA in the past also. We are not on any witch hunt, and in fact in some instances have stopped rumors from being spread concerning some names. We have no desire to harm the truth fellowship by what we do. Our purpose is to have a place where people can turn for information and begin healing. WINGS stands for Working to INform Guide and Support. Here is our objective: WINGS has been created by victims/survivors who have suffered sexual abuse within the "Truth" Fellowship along with individuals who have been both directly and indirectly impacted by CSA.
Our objective is to provide information, support and guidance to every individual on every aspect of Child Sexual Abuse (CSA), and to shed light on the prevalence of these abuses within the fellowship. Our ultimate hope is to encourage change within the group in order to protect others from the devastation that occurs when CSA is minimized and or ultimately ignored. wingsfortruth.info/As a relatively new site, we have had our share of 'growing pains', and have altered what was posted on our site accordingly. I am sure that there will be changes in the future. Scott
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Post by Scott Ross on Sept 24, 2008 11:49:08 GMT -5
Hey freedonforever, The article about the child abuse has finally been pulled off after a lot of complaining about it. No good report about that case will ever be posted. But, how come nothing was posted about the trouble with false allegations as much as allegations? Also there are arresting reports that could be posted but they are not. Don't know why fair and fair isn't practiced with everyone.I meant to respond to this yesterday... sorry. The article was pulled off not so much because of the complaints about it, as it appears that what was in the news was incorrect in some of what was reported. The reason it was there in the first place was because of the allegations of Child Sexual Abuse. As to arresting reports, I am assuming you are referring to what is posted on this thread by White Knight. Those will NOT be posted on WINGS because they do not pertain to CSA. In all fairness to all involved, it was perhaps inappropriate for us to have allegations posted on WINGS. They were posted here on the TMB and on other web sites, but may have been inappropriate to be on the WINGS site. It should also be pointed out that the case was known about for quite some time before being posted about here on the TMB, the news articles were posted on another thread by a different person, and then I posted the same articles. I tried to limit what was put here in the public eye as much as possible, and through PM's and emails and phone calls was able to get some things removed that were posted in regards to names and false/misleading information. I will admit that I also made mistakes during this investigation in regards to things posted, and tried to correct any mistakes and correct them as soon as I was aware of them. Scott
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Post by greenthumb on Sept 24, 2008 16:56:09 GMT -5
To Dave and White Knight - I'm so sorry that both of you, along with many others, have had to go through this horrible mess. I'm so glad that it hasn't prevented either of you from having a good spirit. White Knight, I'm glad you've had second thoughts about suing the twins and sister workers for false accusations.
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Post by bandtroll on Sept 24, 2008 18:39:39 GMT -5
I'm glad you've had second thoughts about suing the twins and sister workers for false accusations. First of all I think we in this country are way to 'sue' happy. Beyond that, here are reasons I think it would be a lost cause in this case. - Neither have any money in their own name (is my guess) - Not sure a lawyer would take a case like this for free, and if they have nothing the state would have to supply their lawyer. - You would have to prove 'harm.' Did you loose your job, house, family? Are you now under a doctors care? And it just drags this thing on that much longer, that much longer before everyone gets on with their life.
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Post by bandtroll on Sept 24, 2008 18:49:08 GMT -5
I'm trying to understand why the twins are in the hospital? "Why now?" Or have they been in the hospital ever since the investigator said 'no more'?
Does anyone have dates on this case?
When did the twins start accusing people? When did they first go to the police? How many times did they go to the police? When did the investigator say 'no more'? When were charges filed against the twins? When did they go into the hospital? And their court date was 9/19?
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dchaplin
New Member
Innocent until proven guilty. Liberty and justice for all. Let forgiveness prevail!!!!
Posts: 34
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Post by dchaplin on Sept 25, 2008 9:03:12 GMT -5
To Dave and White Knight - I'm so sorry that both of you, along with many others, have had to go through this horrible mess. I'm so glad that it hasn't prevented either of you from having a good spirit.
Conventioner, thank you for your kind words, its ones like your self that has been a strength to us through out our ordeal. I know I am not worthy of any praise, any good spirit manifested is not of myself. I think of our hymn, #214 If it had not been the LORD. Verses 3 & 4 especially. If it had not been the Lord When the ruth-less foe assailed, No defence would I have known- If my Lord had not prevailed. It is only he can save: It is only He can keep. His strong arm, and his alone, will defend his trusting sheep. Also the 94th Psalm has been a huge help. I also think of those verses in our Bible that say, Satan walks around as a lion to devour. I am reminded again who the real enemy is, Satan seeks to destroy the kingdom in any manner that he can. I like what Jesus said on the cross, Father forgive them for they know not what they do. It's true they didn't know what they were doing, they were deceived because of the hardness of their hearts. They didn't have the understanding that comes from the Holy Spirit because they weren't feeding on the lamb and we can see that also in all that has unfolded here. Mathew 5, verses 7, 8 & 9 Blessed are the merciful, for they shall obtain mercy. Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see GOD. Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called the children of GOD. Even though there are still issues that need to be resolved, I hope this can be all our portion and forgiveness can prevail and there can be healing through out our kingdom. Sincerely, David K. Chaplin
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Post by degem on Sept 25, 2008 12:46:34 GMT -5
Lovely post David!
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