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Post by Zorro on Jun 29, 2006 9:12:42 GMT -5
lol... good one Zorro.
You understand where I am coming from, but I don't understand where you are coming from. I am trying to do my due diligence here. What kind of Bible do you have? I have a KJV with an Oxford encyclopedic concordance and an NIV study Bible. The Oxford concordance has a ton of help...right under "God". There are whole sections for God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. The NIV study Bible is very helpful, too. The most difficult issue can be just trusting "man's thinking"....but it is very helpful, nonetheless. One thing I'm absolutely certain of is that God wants us to KNOW him. Once the light bulb goes off regarding Jesus' deity it is just amazing what happens, guaranteed If you are truly seeking the answers to this, God will lead you to them.
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Post by need some answers on Jun 29, 2006 15:24:30 GMT -5
and you expect me to find the answers you speak of when it took you 30 years!
So, what did you miss?
The light bulb is on here, not desiring it to go off.
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Posts: 71
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Post by _ on Jun 29, 2006 15:31:02 GMT -5
and you expect me to find the answers you speak of when it took you 30 years! So, what did you miss? The light bulb is on here, not desiring it to go off. What are you trying to understand?
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Post by Zorro on Jun 29, 2006 17:02:33 GMT -5
and you expect me to find the answers you speak of when it took you 30 years!
So, what did you miss?
The light bulb is on here, not desiring it to go off.
Need some answers, Very good point...I'm glad you made it. It didn't take me 30 years to find the answers.....because I wasn't looking for them. I believed dogmatically what I had been taught - which is that Jesus was just a man that was full of the spirit, and completely willing and controlled by the Father through the Spirit. This was why he was sinless. I was told directly by our overseer that Jesus was NOT deity. But the lightbulb had gone off....in year 30. One day I was reading Heb 1 and verse 8 just jumped off the page and instead off just pushing it back into the box, I took it out and held it in my hands, so to speak, and said to myself, "What have we here?!?". Then I noticed that just previous to this verse the Father commands the angels to worship Jesus, and I said to myself, "I thought only God could be worshipped". So I'm scratching my head with one hand and turning to the concordance with the other and I find all this stuff under "God". By now I'm thinking "All this stuff won't fit back into the box, so what do I do now?" The only thing I could think to do was throw the box away. So that's what I did.
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Post by need some answers on Jun 30, 2006 14:53:37 GMT -5
Well, so far no one here has answered my questions.
Just because some one will ask what they were, I will say look @ reply #56. Ignore the stealthy sidestep of Mr. Zorro if you can.
Thanks
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Post by _ on Jun 30, 2006 15:05:51 GMT -5
His ‘sacrifice’ was perfect and satisfied the wrath of God…
Why not?
Why not?
Why not?
It’s about God needing a perfect offering to satisfy his wrath…
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Post by selah on Jun 30, 2006 18:35:04 GMT -5
Okay, I'll give these a go...
Jesus was tempted in every way other human beings are. Luke 4:2, Hebrews 2:18, Hebrews 4:15
Jesus was spotless, until he bore the sins of the world, at which time He became sin for us that we might become the righteousness of God. 2 Corinthians 5:21
Jesus had to be lifted up for all to see, just as Moses lifted up the snake in the desert that men may live. John 3:14-15, John 8:28
One reason would be to fulfill TO.T. prophecy. Isaiah 7:14, Isaiah 9:6
To fulfill O.T. prophecy. Isaiah 49:1, Isaiah 49:5, Jeremiah 31:22
I don't know.
Because it happened the way it did, with all the specific details, there should be no doubt that Jesus Christ is the Messiah, the Savior of the world. He is the one prophesied about in the Old Testament. It would be entirely impossible for one man to fulfill all the prophecies made about the Messiah, unless He was, in fact, the true Messiah....Immanuel, God with us.
Fulfilled prophecy is a powerful to validate the testimony of Jesus Christ. All the details had to be in line for the Jews to recognize their Savior, yet even then they missed Him. But the story isn't over ... yet....
Blessings, Linda
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Post by need some answers on Jul 11, 2006 10:41:44 GMT -5
Selah,
Thanks for your response. I wish I could have gotten back to you sooner, but was on a much needed extended vacation. I agree with you that the reason he came the way he did was to fulfill prophecies from the O.T.. My real question was, why was it that it had to be that way. If the fleshly side of his life means nothing and had no power, why did he not just come as a grown person to be nailed on the cross?
I have been thinking about the history of worshiping. Many if not all of the old cultures worshiped objects. ie... sun, moon, animals. After Christ came, some started worshiping people who held themselves up as messengers from a god, ie.. Buddast, Mormans.
As for Jesus, I find it interesting that I found a people that hold him in high regard because of his teachings, suffering and sacrifice, then in doing research into who and what this is all about I find a people who want to take away the human element, and put more of an importance on the fact that he was divine.
I agree that he was from the Father, was a divine being, and had a power far greater than we have because of what it says in John 3:34. The Spirit he had within was whole and complete. The power of it was as if he was only a divine being, but he still had the human flesh to deal with. He learned obedience by the things he suffered.
Do I think we need works to obtain salvation? NO. But Jesus' teachings lead me to believe there is a certain standard to live by. I think this is very confusing to many, and also the fact that many of the early worshipers of this era came from very strict backgrounds to begin with, and kept much of their belief of how a person should be living. I know my grandparents lived by a strict religious code that we don't see today. From what I read here, there seems to be resistance to this change. This makes it hard to know the depth of our spiritual relationship that needs to be outwardly visible.
I am learning and enjoy the discussions here that are meaningful.
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Post by McYes on Jul 12, 2006 21:07:23 GMT -5
One day I was reading Heb 1 and verse 8 just jumped off the page and instead off just pushing it back into the box, I took it out and held it in my hands, so to speak, and said to myself, "What have we here?!?". Then I noticed that just previous to this verse the Father commands the angels to worship Jesus, and I said to myself, "I thought only God could be worshipped". The only thing I could think to do was throw the box This is one of the MANY places that I can see agreement.
We immediately are informed that it was God, that gave the ''instructions''. This makes the instruction stand out.
It seems quite simple to understand that the father and son are ''one'' but are NOT the same person. God is God, and Jesus is Jesus.
When we cross them by saying Jesus is God, it gets way confusing like someone is trying to turn off the light. It seems that those who understand the impossibility of them conversing with each other, when their would be no point in conversing within their own mind unless it was to show us that we are not made after their image after all, whew, I cannot buy that. It is so much easier to see that they are different, yet one/harmony.
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Post by alright on Jul 20, 2006 20:09:19 GMT -5
One day I was reading Heb 1 and verse 8 just jumped off the page and instead off just pushing it back into the box, I took it out and held it in my hands, so to speak, and said to myself, "What have we here?!?". Then I noticed that just previous to this verse the Father commands the angels to worship Jesus, and I said to myself, "I thought only God could be worshipped". The only thing I could think to do was throw the box This is one of the MANY places that I can see agreement.
We immediately are informed that it was God, that gave the ''instructions''. This makes the instruction stand out.
It seems quite simple to understand that the father and son are ''one'' but are NOT the same person. God is God, and Jesus is Jesus.
When we cross them by saying Jesus is God, it gets way confusing like someone is trying to turn off the light. It seems that those who understand the impossibility of them conversing with each other, when their would be no point in conversing within their own mind unless it was to show us that we are not made after their image after all, whew, I cannot buy that. It is so much easier to see that they are different, yet one/harmony.ok.
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