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Post by learnedaboutgrace on Oct 5, 2007 12:48:22 GMT -5
How do we know that the overseer/past overseers/past companions didn't know of previous "problems"? If I remember right, I read somewhere here, Tim had been out of the work awhile back for quite a length of time. A few years, I believe. What was the reason? Anyone know the details of that? If it was anything even remotely connected to this present issue, there is definitely a responsiblity held by those who knew but allowed him to return.
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Post by Wondering on Oct 5, 2007 15:57:30 GMT -5
They should be looking at the liability of the 2x2 ministry for placing children at risk. But, I guess the "ministry" gets a free pass on that one since they aren't "organized," which is a farce! The safety of the children, given their ages, are the responsibility of the parents. While the parents didn't know what danger they were placing their children in, it does not mean that the organization to which Tim belonged is responsible. Had he been a member of a union would you blame the union? The responsibility of protecting children lies with the parents. I can only imagine how they must feel after making such an error in character judgment. But at least they did the right thing and went to the proper authorities preventing this from happening to other people. I think that if a union (or the 2x2's or the Cath Ch) knowingly and deliberately sent a known (to them) sex offender into another unsuspecting community without warning then, yes, I think they bear at least part of the responsibility. Apparently the legal system sees it that way too. But to your main point, since the "responsibility of protecting children lies with the parents", then all parents, including 2x2 parents MUST assume that any and all workers are potential molesters who must not be allowed to be alone with children. So if Head Worker Joe wants to grab the fishing poles and one of the young boys and head out after meeting, the parents need to grab the kid and say no as long as one of them isn't able to chapperone. Is that about how you see it? I actually agree with this and I would never let a kid alone with a worker, priest or politician no matter how the social structure exalted them. And doesn't that bring the entire house of cards known as the 2x2's crashing down? After all, if you can't entrust your children with the very men and women that you claim to trust your eternity with, then you pretty much have nothing but vapor. It's all just smoke and socializing. And by the way, why can't workers really work? I mean, why can't they get jobs and pay for their own housing, clothing, cars, laptops, food, etc., etc? After all, they aren't actually homeless penniless itinerant preachers are they? They don't actually rely on the mercy of strangers to get out of the rain at night. Nor do they spend much, if any, time actively recruiting from the community at large all day, do they? In actual practice they preach, virtually and literally, to the choir. Can I get an AMEN?
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ex2x2
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Post by ex2x2 on Oct 5, 2007 16:09:56 GMT -5
AMEN
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Post by To Wondering on Oct 5, 2007 17:49:57 GMT -5
The workers don't need to work or evangelize or anything.
This religion was founded BY a worker and it remains to this day FOR the workers.
It's their club. They make the rules. They do as they wish and people can choose to join the club or not to join the club. It is not a church. It is a club of and by and for workers. All for the workers' benefit.
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Post by Wondering on Oct 5, 2007 18:25:19 GMT -5
The workers don't need to work or evangelize or anything. This religion was founded BY a worker and it remains to this day FOR the workers. It's their club. They make the rules. They do as they wish and people can choose to join the club or not to join the club. It is not a church. It is a club of and by and for workers. All for the workers' benefit. AMEN
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Post by friend1 on Oct 5, 2007 20:04:03 GMT -5
If being in the work is such a good deal, why haven't you offered for the work?
Just think, you could enjoy much of a lifetime in worker-Nirvana, than in your later years get a chance at capping it all off as an overseer!
Such a deal!
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Post by rational on Oct 5, 2007 20:12:30 GMT -5
Rational, it may be convenient to you to take this one case in isolation, but I think this "one" case in itself has every thinking and concerned person wondering about all other cases and how to prevent re-occurrence. I am addressing the subject of this thread. If you wish to expand it into a general discussion I would be glad to join in. But for this thread it is information about Tim. With the information that I have seen regarding this case there was no information available that would have required anyone to issue a warning regarding Tim and his possible danger to children. I do understand this. I was B&R in the 2x2 way. So I do not support the idea of indoctrination. People have brains. They have the ability to reason. How many time have you heard Exes say that they knew for a long time that something was not right but continued to go along? I do understand the background. But I do understand the aspect of free will and for people taking responsibility for their actions. If you elect to stay in a group that if your choice. No one is forcing people to stay. People stay because it is the easiest route. They do not want to upset the family. They fear, and rightly so, that they will lose their circle of friends. While these factors do make the decision more difficult, it is still a decision that rests in the hands of the individual. I am not calling you fools I am just saying that you cannot blame others for your decisions. People are responsible for their actions. Everyone makes mistakes. You learn from them. Background checks are a good thing but considering the closeness of the group workers are drawn from, I doubt there will be anything in the vast majority of the checks. I mean, you can hardly break wind without having every saint in a 200 mile radius know within the week! The solution is educating parents, workers, and children as to the dangers. There is a young boy in our neighborhood that likes me. We build things and work outside together often. But I would never think of having him work with me in my house, even with my wife home, because of the possibility that he might say something that would be misconstrued and could cause problems. He knows he is to check with his parents before he visits and I encourage them to check in frequently just to make sure they understand what is happening. The workers need to be just as careful as the parents. And when one is not willing to take those steps that is a danger signal.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2007 10:34:27 GMT -5
I am addressing the subject of this thread. If you wish to expand it into a general discussion I would be glad to join in. But for this thread it is information about Tim.
I have made contributions in similar vein on this board, TMB II and the 2x2 Doctrine boards. Please feel free to respond to any of these.
With the information that I have seen regarding this case there was no information available that would have required anyone to issue a warning regarding Tim and his possible danger to children.
What reasonable actions did those who allowed Tim into the work take to establish he was as far as could be established not a risk ? What reasonable actions and procedures and practices did those in authority take to limit opportunities for abuse to take place and to protect the vulnerable as well as their fellow workers ? If questioned about what safety procedures were followed to try and prevent such instances from occurring, what could they answer beyond "he had a good suitcase ?"
I do understand this. I was B&R in the 2x2 way. So I do not support the idea of indoctrination. People have brains. They have the ability to reason. How many time have you heard Exes say that they knew for a long time that something was not right but continued to go along? I do understand the background. But I do understand the aspect of free will and for people taking responsibility for their actions. If you elect to stay in a group that if your choice. No one is forcing people to stay. People stay because it is the easiest route. They do not want to upset the family. They fear, and rightly so, that they will lose their circle of friends. While these factors do make the decision more difficult, it is still a decision that rests in the hands of the individual.
Do you really understand the idea of indoctrination ? Indoctrination in many cases is actually a very good thing. It can be very healthy and provide for the safety of both the individual and masses. We are subject to indoctrination each and every day in lives. People do indoctrinate their children, largely for their education, safety and understanding. Consider how much we indoctrinate our children (often against their will) with such things as road safety. Indoctrination is about education. It is prescribed in the Bible. Parents are instructed to bring their children up in the ways of the Lord so that they will not depart from it.
The problem arises when indoctrination graduates into brain-washing or involves false teachings and practices. If we believe that only through Jesus Christ and no other can salvation be gained, then consider the countless millions of moslems who have been indoctrinated from their youth up by a false religion. Is it your position that the Prophet Mohammed and his mullahs are not responsible for spreading a false faith which has deceived many and all the problems that go with it, but rather it is the sole responsibility of those who have been indoctrinated into that faith ?
As for the rest of your answer, I am glad you appear to have escaped that which many others of us have been less fortunate with and found ourselves indoctrinated or beguiled into believing. If we have individual responsibility, as in the blind leading the blind, then surely it is woe unto those who do the leading ?
I am not calling you fools I am just saying that you cannot blame others for your decisions. People are responsible for their actions.
Thank you. This includes Workers. If people are responsible for preaching false doctrine, how can they not be blamed (at least in portion) for the effect it has on others ?
Everyone makes mistakes. You learn from them.
True, but in some environments it can take some quite traumatic circumstances to realise these mistakes and takes quite a bit of courage to do something about it, most especially when such actions go against an indoctrination/brain-washing that such actions are going god's only true way and that there is no salvation outside the way. Basically, to really learn from mistakes can and does in effect cause you to surrender your salvation as far as your belief system is concerned.
Background checks are a good thing but considering the closeness of the group workers are drawn from, I doubt there will be anything in the vast majority of the checks. I mean, you can hardly break wind without having every saint in a 200 mile radius know within the week!
One major reason for carrying out background checks is that it shows the organisation is carrying out reasonable checks to ensure that those they employ are as far as can be reasonably established, of no risk to the operations of that organisation or the people it deals with. Background checks are only the beginning of an ongoing process of measues undertaken and procedures and practices introduced to limit risks and protect the innocent. It is a very strange organisation indeed that knows (within a 200 mile radius no less) when every one of its members breaks wind, yet the vast majority DO NOT know when abuses take place, even within their own households.
Why is flatulence of greater importance within the ranks of the fellowship than occurrences of paedophilia ? Odd isn't it ? Maybe it's harder to sweep under the carpet ?
The solution is educating parents, workers, and children as to the dangers.
And ?
The workers need to be just as careful as the parents.
Now we are getting somewhere. The workers need to be as responsible as the parents ?
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Post by who said on Oct 6, 2007 11:38:45 GMT -5
If being in the work is such a good deal, why haven't you offered for the work? Just think, you could enjoy much of a lifetime in worker-Nirvana, than in your later years get a chance at capping it all off as an overseer! Such a deal! Who said voluntarily subjecting yourself to the whims of a cult is a good deal?
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Post by DITTO on Oct 6, 2007 12:00:24 GMT -5
Who said voluntarily subjecting yourself to the whims of a cult is a good deal? DITTO
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Post by rational on Oct 6, 2007 12:49:25 GMT -5
What reasonable actions did those who allowed Tim into the work take to establish he was as far as could be established not a risk ? I do not know Tim of any details other than what has been presented here. Anything I could add would be a guess.
What reasonable actions and procedures and practices did those in authority take to limit opportunities for abuse to take place and to protect the vulnerable as well as their fellow workers ?
This is where education would play a part.
If questioned about what safety procedures were followed to try and prevent such instances from occurring, what could they answer beyond "he had a good suitcase ?"
Again, these are details that are not part of what has been revealed here.
Do you really understand the idea of indoctrination ? Indoctrination in many cases is actually a very good thing. It can be very healthy and provide for the safety of both the individual and masses. We are subject to indoctrination each and every day in lives. People do indoctrinate their children, largely for their education, safety and understanding. Consider how much we indoctrinate our children (often against their will) with such things as road safety. Indoctrination is about education. It is prescribed in the Bible. Parents are instructed to bring their children up in the ways of the Lord so that they will not depart from it.
Well, it is a pretty big word but I do have an idea of what it means. As far as what we teach our children, I think teaching them to question everything instead of indoctrinating them might be a start.
The problem arises when indoctrination graduates into brain-washing or involves false teachings and practices.
I think that any teaching method that prohibits questioning is wrong. That is the definition of indoctrination and it would be difficult to say where the teaching stops and the brain washing begins.
If we believe that only through Jesus Christ and no other can salvation be gained, then consider the countless millions of moslems who have been indoctrinated from their youth up by a false religion.
If that is what you teach your children and they never question why one's salvation is reduced to the geographic area in which you were born/raised then they have indeed been indoctrinated.
Is it your position that the Prophet Mohammed and his mullahs are not responsible for spreading a false faith which has deceived many and all the problems that go with it, but rather it is the sole responsibility of those who have been indoctrinated into that faith ?
Religious beliefs are a difficult thing. I do not believe the Prophet Mohamed and his mullahs are any more guilty of spreading a false faith than Jesus and his followers. They all taught people what they believed was right and people heard and believed. You live in an area where the story that Jesus told is thought to be true so you see Prophet Mohamed and his mullahs as spreading a false belief. They see somewhat the opposite. Not exactly the opposite because the Muslims do not completely reject the teachings of Jesus out of hand.
As for the rest of your answer, I am glad you appear to have escaped that which many others of us have been less fortunate with and found ourselves indoctrinated or beguiled into believing.
People stay in situations only as long as the benefit outweighs the cost.
If we have individual responsibility, as in the blind leading the blind, then surely it is woe unto those who do the leading ?
Each has to take responsibility for their actions. If you follow the blind, even if you are blind, you have made a grave error in judgment.
Thank you. This includes Workers. If people are responsible for preaching false doctrine, how can they not be blamed (at least in portion) for the effect it has on others ?
Yes, the workers are responsible for their actions and you are responsible for yours. Someone cannot force you to believe them. You make that decision. I might try to convince you so spend $1,000 on a formula that will allow you to drive 10,000 miles on a gallon of sea water but in the end you make the decision to purchase or not. I am perhaps the blame from a commercial point of view for making false claims. I am not the blame for you making the decision to purchase the product.
True, but in some environments it can take some quite traumatic circumstances to realise these mistakes and takes quite a bit of courage to do something about it, most especially when such actions go against an indoctrination/brain-washing that such actions are going god's only true way and that there is no salvation outside the way.
Again, if you believe the way is right why would you want to leave? If you believe it is not right why would you care if they think you are going to hell or not? You have determined they are wrong.
Basically, to really learn from mistakes can and does in effect cause you to surrender your salvation as far as your belief system is concerned.
If you don't believe how can this be surrendering your salvation?
It is a very strange organisation indeed that knows (within a 200 mile radius no less) when every one of its members breaks wind, yet the vast majority DO NOT know when abuses take place, even within their own households.
If no one knows they .. well, no one knows and it is unlikely that someone chosen for the work will have a past that included child molestation.
Why is flatulence of greater importance within the ranks of the fellowship than occurrences of paedophilia ? Odd isn't it ? Maybe it's harder to sweep under the carpet ?
Sweeping wind has always been a difficult chore!
Now we are getting somewhere. The workers need to be as responsible as the parents ?
Everyone is responsible for their actions. Parents need to know what to look for and what to be careful of. Children need to know what is acceptable and what is not. And acceptable from everyone, grandfather, grandmother, uncles, aunts, sisters, brothers, workers, etc., etc. Workers need to realize they hold a special place and make sure they do not put themselves in the position where there could be questions about their behavior.
If the workers are never alone with children (I know mine would never have been alone with them) there will never be a case of a worker molesting a child.
Again, I place the vast majority of the responsibility for the care and safety of children on the parents. Parents need to be taught (indoctrinated?!?) that their children are always above the workers.
If the workers want to gain the trust of the members they will keep themselves above reproach.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2007 14:45:36 GMT -5
Rash,
Yes, with the exception of certain categories of persons, everyone is responsible for their actions. This includes workers, which I think you agree with. This is why protective and preventative measures and checks should in this day and age apply to those applying for and entering the work. This is for their own safety as well and as far as is possible protects the many good workers out their whose image has been tarnished by the few weaker ones. You and I wont resolve this issue. The work should face up to the fact that it is an organised group and seek advise from lawyers and social services about what measures they should employ within the day to day workings, social and domestic contact they have with the lay members and their families.
Workers are not responsible for the children of the members. However, they are very much responsible for their own actions where children and other vulnerable people are involved. This is the crux of the matter. This is where safety checks and measures kick in. Every other organisation has to observe such practices and procedures, even charities, voluntary organisations and traditional churches, so why not workers ? Especially in light of Tim's case or the number of others which have/are coming to light, irrespective if you wish to consider them in isolation or collectively.
There is much in your response I agree with in general terms, and other things which, like attemting to sweep flatulence under the carpet, we can debate for days and probable end up disagreeing about things we actually agree about.
However, with regards to the following:-
People stay in situations only as long as the benefit outweighs the cost.
I think many people who visit this board have the ability to surprise you with their experiences ?
If no one knows they .. well, no one knows and it is unlikely that someone chosen for the work will have a past that included child molestation.
Background checks along with other things protects the group/organisation by showing they have, taken all reasonable steps to prevent unsuitable persons from entering the work, or from continuing in the work if misdeeds come to light. As with all mature, sane individuals, groups have to act responsibly. In many cases it is law that they adopt these procedures.
If the workers want to gain the trust of the members they will keep themselves above reproach.
A very good point. Trust nowadays (as far as it can reasonably be established) is largely gained through appropriate selection procedures and abiding by prescribed criteria, procedures and practices. These are no surefast guarantee against abuses but they do help to keep people above reproach.
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Post by wingsofaneagle on Oct 7, 2007 9:54:17 GMT -5
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Post by Humm on Oct 7, 2007 10:36:51 GMT -5
Rash, Yes, with the exception of certain categories of persons, everyone is responsible for their actions. This includes workers, which I think you agree with. This is why protective and preventative measures and checks should in this day and age apply to those applying for and entering the work. This is for their own safety as well and as far as is possible protects the many good workers out their whose image has been tarnished by the few weaker ones. You and I wont resolve this issue. The work should face up to the fact that it is an organised group and seek advise from lawyers and social services about what measures they should employ within the day to day workings, social and domestic contact they have with the lay members and their families. Workers are not responsible for the children of the members. However, they are very much responsible for their own actions where children and other vulnerable people are involved. This is the crux of the matter. This is where safety checks and measures kick in. Every other organisation has to observe such practices and procedures, even charities, voluntary organisations and traditional churches, so why not workers ? Especially in light of Tim's case or the number of others which have/are coming to light, irrespective if you wish to consider them in isolation or collectively. There is much in your response I agree with in general terms, and other things which, like attemting to sweep flatulence under the carpet, we can debate for days and probable end up disagreeing about things we actually agree about. However, with regards to the following:- People stay in situations only as long as the benefit outweighs the cost.I think many people who visit this board have the ability to surprise you with their experiences ? If no one knows they .. well, no one knows and it is unlikely that someone chosen for the work will have a past that included child molestation.Background checks along with other things protects the group/organisation by showing they have, taken all reasonable steps to prevent unsuitable persons from entering the work, or from continuing in the work if misdeeds come to light. As with all mature, sane individuals, groups have to act responsibly. In many cases it is law that they adopt these procedures. If the workers want to gain the trust of the members they will keep themselves above reproach. A very good point. Trust nowadays (as far as it can reasonably be established) is largely gained through appropriate selection procedures and abiding by prescribed criteria, procedures and practices. These are no surefast guarantee against abuses but they do help to keep people above reproach. Background checks along with other things protects the group/organisation by showing they have, taken all reasonable steps to prevent unsuitable persons from entering the work, or from continuing in the work if misdeeds come to light. As with all mature, sane individuals, groups have to act responsibly. In many cases it is law that they adopt these procedures.The F&W's can't do this because they do not have any formal statements of their organization. They trust in the unwritten rules of fath in offering up for the work. There method is to wait and see if a person still wants to be in the work after they are force to wait for some period of time-- No written requirements exsist for being in the work. To show they have taken resonable steps means to document and be accountable. They will reject attempts to document anything because that in itself makes the Church accountable. How can the Church be accountable when they have no formal Church constitution. Who will be accountable when the Church Leaders fail in this? In fact who are the Church leaders? Would it be the overseer in each state? When one does a background check you need Both the verification of the Organization doing the check and the approval of the person who is being Checked. Would seem funny to me if I received a request as Sheriff Clerk for a background check on some person by and organization which lists themself as (No Name Church care of Worker so in so). Under section for reason for background check---It would say something like (Wants to be a Worker in the No name Chruch) which has their ministers, pastors, preachers, workers live in followers homes because they have no money of their own.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2007 11:07:30 GMT -5
Humm,
I agree with what you say. The implications of what I have suggested are enormous, but I will reiterate that the time is NOW for them to wake up to the truth that they are part of the REAL world and should be following in the footsteps of other groups and organisations which work or associate with children and young persons and take on board the necessay procedures in a bid to prevent abuses from occurring.
The Workers system allows it to side-step requirements other churches and faiths are legally bound by.
The protection of children and other vulnerable people should be such a consideration that the workers would only be too willing to act responsibly and take on board the initiates that other groups employ.
Is it too much to ask for even a written Code of Practice, a copy of which can be sent out to every worker and lay member ?
Clearly, in light of all that is unfolding, the status quo cannot continue ?
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Post by LOOKING on Oct 8, 2007 20:38:32 GMT -5
I am looking for the original thread that juliette started, regarding the child molestation----Minnesota, I have gone through 13 pages and cannot find it,-----anyone know what page it is on?
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Post by juliette on Oct 8, 2007 20:54:41 GMT -5
I used the search function on this board and used criteria that would bring up my original post, but I didn't get anything. I'm wondering if our Administrator could help?! My thread was started before the board when down.... I'm wondering if it got removed for some reason? I think someone started posted the names of different people on that thread... maybe it's in the locked section of the board for that reason?
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Post by tim unlogged on Oct 10, 2007 16:34:13 GMT -5
The workers don't need to work or evangelize or anything. This religion was founded BY a worker and it remains to this day FOR the workers. It's their club. They make the rules. They do as they wish and people can choose to join the club or not to join the club. It is not a church. It is a club of and by and for workers. All for the workers' benefit. that's a very interesting way of looking at it That is a very interesting way of putting it.
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Post by tim unlogged on Oct 10, 2007 16:37:37 GMT -5
The workers don't need to work or evangelize or anything. This religion was founded BY a worker and it remains to this day FOR the workers. It's their club. They make the rules. They do as they wish and people can choose to join the club or not to join the club. It is not a church. It is a club of and by and for workers. All for the workers' benefit. that's a very interesting way of looking at it That is a very interesting way of putting it.[/quote one of those last two lines should have been deleted. Sorry about that. and by the way so there's no confusion this is Tim, formerly know as Spiderman.
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ecarg
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Post by ecarg on Oct 12, 2007 9:24:32 GMT -5
SHARING MY EXPERIENCES! I appreciate ALL the thoughts, ideas and opinions on this thread. I'd like to share my knowledge and experience on these issues.
1. I was sexually abused in "the truth" by workers and older professing boys. I know first hand the pain, sorrow, confusion, anger, shame, woundedness journey of such sickness. My FIRST outpouring of prayer, concern and love is to ANY other person ( male or female ) on this message board who has suffered such evil. I'M SORRY!!!!!!! You deserved BETTER! 2. Accountability! This seems to be such a topic of discussion. WE ARE ALL ACCOUNTABLE in some form or another. You can't get out of it. Seems that out of fear or because of such pride and egos, no one wants to be accountable. I believe that if we have been instrusted a "life" here on earth.....................we are accountable. I can see, that in a religion based on methodology, and that teaches the WRATH of God VS the LOVE AND MERCY of God, it would be VERY HARD to accept responsibility. You just might go "straight to hell" for your sins. Who wants to "fess up" under such pressure. Part of growing ourselves up and becoming adults means that we are ALL accountable for the "little ones". And I'm not just talking children. Those who "CAN" are called to reach out to those that "CAN NOT". Those that "HAVE" are called to reach out to those who "HAVE NOT" It's called the Body Of Christ!!!!!! We should ALL get madder than hell when someone "less fortunate or weak" is taken advantage of.........PERIOD. Whether it is our "personal" children or not. Our children come THROUGH us, not TO US. They are gifts from God that we have been INTRUSTED to care for. Talk about Accountability!!!!! And people of the truth.............you may not have been the one to abuse a child, but your Church Family Members HAVE ABUSED children. I'm sorry. You are part of a "family" of believers who have sinned. If you believe you are ONE BODY or A FAMILY, YOU TOO are accountable by virtue of what you believe. 3. BACKGROUND CHECKS. Here is my experience with background checks. I work in a Catholic Church. CHILL!!!!!! LOL It's amazing how the "Church" I was taught to hate has helped me in my relationship with Jesus more than any other Church I attended. I have appreciated the way the Church has stepped up and taken responsibility for what has happened with some of the Priests. I've SEEN first hand, what a "Sexual Abuse Scandal" can do to a Faith Community. I've personally experienced it. ( sexual abuse by workers ) I've been on the inner workings of training people to "watch" for pedophiles, I've been on the administrative side of trying to set up safe environments, etc etc etc........MY THOUGHTS! Just as with ANY other sickness or illness or evil in the world, we are only human, and we do the best we can to prevent all that we can. Period. Background checks are a good idea. They will not catch a pedophile who has NEVER been caught before, but they do help with "red flags". Behaviors that are questionable. It's a step. Not a perfect one, but a step. TRAINING AND EDUCATION is KEY! We have classes that teach the children what to look out for. What's OK behavior and what is NOT. For example....................TRUST YOUR GUT!!!!!! Don't let other people THINK for you! People who feel creepy ARE CREEPY for a reason. Hello!!!! Even if it is Uncle Joe or Dad or a Priest or a Worker or your coach or your teacher. Teach children to LISTEN to their feelings. God gave them to us for a very good reason. Teach children that sometimes REASONING in the Head IS WRONG! Sometimes things that don't make logical sense, ARE RIGHT! I teach my children to QUESTION authority. If authority is on the "up and up" then there is no fear when someone questions it. Expand on the commandments. "Obey your parents" EXCEPT WHEN YOUR PARENTS ASK YOU TO SIN!!!! "Love God with all your heart" PEOPLE ARE NOT GOD even if they represent God. Good old common sense!!!! 4. PRACTICAL IDEAS. If you work with children or any person that is childlike ( mentally handicapped for example ) Always have another adult with you. It's safer for YOU and the person you are working with. When 2x2 becomes 1on1..........HELLO! Adults who only have kids as friends..............hello! Read flag! Adults WORK with children but they should not be peers. We all know these people. ( can't function in the adult world ) 5. GET EDUCATED! We can "chat" on these boards all day long, but the best way we canuse our energy is to get educated. There is a process called GROOMING, that pedophies do to their victims. Sometimes it goes on for YEARS before the pedophile will actually hurt someone. Study this stuff people. Please! 6. PEOPLE IN THE TRUTH. Please, step outside of "the box" and look to other organizations who have delt with this issue. If "religious" institutions are to hard for you to reach out to, look at the scouts or the educational institutions. There are VERY GOOD programs in place to work through the scandal that has his your religion. It's a fact of life. I am hoping and praying for all of you. Please don't hide your face in shame. Step into this mess. Clean it up. It's a great opportunity to see what you are made of. To use those gifts of the Holy Spirit. to use the Fruits of the Holy Spirit. I don't agree with your theology, but I can meet you in this mess of humanity and reach out to you as a Sister in Christ. What a glorious opportunity you have upon you. Use this time to get closer to Christ. He meets us at the Cross. The "truth" now has a MAJOR cross to bear. Pick it up!!!! Carry it!!!!! YOU CAN DO IT!
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Post by nitro on Oct 12, 2007 10:00:20 GMT -5
Could you post this as it's own thread? I would hate for this to get lost in the shuffle. A must read and thanks for the input. Sounds like you have taken a step or two in your healing ecarg and hope others take the time to read it.
nitro
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ecarg
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Post by ecarg on Oct 12, 2007 10:38:52 GMT -5
Thanks Nitro. YES..........by the grace of God, I've accomplished some MAJOR steps. It's time for me to give back! Have a great day!
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