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Post by hotdog on Aug 16, 2006 14:59:02 GMT -5
What is willing obedience? Doing what God and "His Servants" tell us without questioning it? Doing what you are told with a right spirit? Obedience isn't complete unless we are willing?
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Post by Oh brother on Aug 16, 2006 21:07:52 GMT -5
When I was a kid my mother would ask me to do something and I would dawdle around before getting to it. Then I would go to do it and she would get in my face and tell me she didn't want unwilling help. GUILT TRIP! Willing obedience is jumping and asking how high on the way up which is what is what the "workers" expect of people when the rules are proclaimed. Unfortunately a lot of the quirky laws have nothing to do with scripture and all to do with control. Between mother and the workers I've been on a guilt trip most of my life - not a pleasant journey and never getting you anywhere.
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Post by DAa on Aug 16, 2006 21:12:56 GMT -5
What is willing obedience? Doing what God and "His Servants" tell us without questioning it? Doing what you are told with a right spirit? Obedience isn't complete unless we are willing? Daa. Who are the "Gods Servants" you are refering to? How do you know they are "Gods Serrvants"?
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Post by jxr on Aug 17, 2006 8:04:37 GMT -5
You mean that it is about God's Servants barking orders to God's Servants servant? Is there some sort of chain'o'command?
I thought that once the veil was torn, our mediator was Jesus. Why do the workers want to get in the road.
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Post by seekingtruth on Aug 17, 2006 13:02:11 GMT -5
Maybe they're in the way in the way
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Post by withopeneyes (Mandy) on Aug 17, 2006 14:18:20 GMT -5
Well, personally speaking-
When I ask my husband to do something, and he does it willingly, I appreciate that. It makes me feel loved. When he does it while huffing, puffing, and complaining, I feel like I'd rather do it myself.. or ask someone else.
I bet God feels like that a lot too.
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Post by just me on Aug 17, 2006 18:55:50 GMT -5
Well, personally speaking- When I ask my husband to do something, and he does it willingly, I appreciate that. It makes me feel loved. When he does it while huffing, puffing, and complaining, I feel like I'd rather do it myself.. or ask someone else. I bet God feels like that a lot too. Very profound I have never seen it put like that. I would tend to think you are correct in your thinking
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Post by jxr on Aug 18, 2006 6:12:19 GMT -5
Well, personally speaking- When I ask my husband to do something, and he does it willingly, I appreciate that. It makes me feel loved. When he does it while huffing, puffing, and complaining, I feel like I'd rather do it myself.. or ask someone else. I bet God feels like that a lot too. But are all directives issued by the workers, from God?
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Post by seekingtruth on Aug 18, 2006 10:04:35 GMT -5
Depends on who you are...if you think you'll question. Workers do not encouage thinking - they've rephrased the commerical "Leave the driving to us" to "Leave the thinking to us".
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Post by ex-teenager on Aug 18, 2006 10:08:46 GMT -5
Depends on who you are...if you think you'll question. Workers do not encouage thinking - they've rephrased the commerical "Leave the driving to us" to "Leave the thinking to us". Sorry just cannot agree with that at ALL. We have been encouraged to think, to pray about it, to read, to study and to ask questions. So to say that the workers do not encourage thinking is not far of a lie.
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Post by seekingtruth on Aug 18, 2006 10:15:11 GMT -5
Well, young friend, that has not been my experience.
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Post by ex-teenager on Aug 18, 2006 10:16:56 GMT -5
Well, young friend, that has not been my experience. When you post it may be better to say something like... "some workers..." instead of clumping all the workers together.
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Post by scottishviking on Aug 18, 2006 10:17:24 GMT -5
depends what you are thinking about teenager; the workers do not encouarge thinking about, or research on, certain topics; while thinking etc is encouraged in areas which are defined as edifying or feeding (who defines these areas ? do i need to ask ?).
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Post by ex-teenager on Aug 18, 2006 10:21:49 GMT -5
depends what you are thinking about teenager; the workers do not encouarge thinking about, or research on, certain topics; while thinking etc is encouraged in areas which are defined as edifying or feeding (who defines these areas ? do i need to ask ?). To me it means all areas, and I stick by that, having spoken to a worker on a large variety of 'controversial' topics.
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Post by scottishviking on Aug 18, 2006 10:26:11 GMT -5
your a lucky man (woman ?) to have found such a worker to talk with, other workers may (will) not be so open and other friends, including me, have had different experiences. value them and talk with them as much as possible.
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Post by ex-teenager on Aug 18, 2006 10:28:44 GMT -5
your a lucky man (woman ?) to have found such a worker to talk with, other workers may (will) not be so open and other friends, including me, have had different experiences. value them and talk with them as much as possible. man. I do value them and the conversatiosn we can have.
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Post by DAa on Aug 18, 2006 10:29:38 GMT -5
What is willing obedience? Doing what God and "His Servants" tell us without questioning it? Doing what you are told with a right spirit? Obedience isn't complete unless we are willing? Daa. Who are the "Gods Servants" you are refering to? How do you know they are "Gods Serrvants"? I still would like to know who are the Gods Servants you are talking about and how do you know they are God Servants?
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Post by seekingtruth on Aug 18, 2006 10:45:58 GMT -5
Once upon a time I was taught that workers were God's servants (and always, always, always right. Since that is all I was ever allowed to be taught I believed it. Teenager thinks I lie when I say "they want us to leave the thinking to them". I learn lessons well - but when I find I've been duped I'm done. It has taken me a long time and a lot of sorrow to "get smart". Teenager, if you're happy GO FOR IT but do not call me a liar until you've walked a mile in my shoes.
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Post by selah on Aug 18, 2006 10:47:32 GMT -5
Yes Teenager, I too was encouraged to think, pray, read, study and ask questions. However, I soon learned which questions were okay to ask and which ones were not. I also discovered that in my thinking, praying, reading and studying, I'd better come to the same conclusions as the workers...or else.
Blessings, Linda
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Post by withopeneyes (Mandy) on Aug 18, 2006 13:54:51 GMT -5
Of course not! My parents had a lot of trouble with my brother and me when as we were growing up. My brother was the wild one, and I, well, I was just different.
The workers gave them A LOT of advice. Mom and Dad would listen, and pray about it, and more often than not- the worker's advice was ultimately overruled by God..... and thankfully so... or my brother and I could very much resent my parents today.
So, my point is.... anyone can give you advice... but God's "advice" should overrule everything. Workers, Ministers, Preachers.... whatever you call them- they are HUMAN. And, usually, their advice is from a human viewpoint.
God knows you better than you know yourself (and definitely better than anyone else).
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Post by ex-teenager on Aug 18, 2006 18:19:38 GMT -5
Once upon a time I was taught that workers were God's servants (and always, always, always right. Since that is all I was ever allowed to be taught I believed it. Teenager thinks I lie when I say "they want us to leave the thinking to them". I learn lessons well - but when I find I've been duped I'm done. It has taken me a long time and a lot of sorrow to "get smart". Teenager, if you're happy GO FOR IT but do not call me a liar until you've walked a mile in my shoes. If you are clumping all the workers together when you say "they want us to leave the thinking to them" then I believe it to be untrue. However I would say that you are not intentionally saying something untrue, but simply generalizing due to your own experience - something we all do from time to time.
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Post by scottishviking on Aug 19, 2006 5:21:46 GMT -5
If you are clumping all the workers together when you say "they want us to leave the thinking to them" then I believe it to be untrue.
However I would say that you are not intentionally saying something untrue, but simply generalizing due to your own experience - something we all do from time to time. [/quote]
teenager; given the response to your posts, is it possible that the one generalising from limited experience is you ? is it possible you are using one "open minded" worker to represent the majority when more probably, the reverse is true ?
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Post by jxr on Aug 19, 2006 5:57:44 GMT -5
... The workers gave them A LOT of advice. Mom and Dad would listen, and pray about it, and more often than not- the worker's advice was ultimately overruled by God..... and thankfully so... or my brother and I could very much resent my parents today. ... For people (the workers) who proclaim a faith in God and extoll His almighy power, they tend to lie on the interventionist end of the spectrum, don't they?
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Post by ex-teenager on Aug 19, 2006 11:40:39 GMT -5
If you are clumping all the workers together when you say "they want us to leave the thinking to them" then I believe it to be untrue. However I would say that you are not intentionally saying something untrue, but simply generalizing due to your own experience - something we all do from time to time. teenager; given the response to your posts, is it possible that the one generalising from limited experience is you ? is it possible you are using one "open minded" worker to represent the majority when more probably, the reverse is true ?[/quote][/i] Oh, the one worker I have spoken to is one I had not thought would speak freely on the subjects, others I know have but not directly to me. In this case we are talking about workers who tell us to think etc, that is my experience with the vast majority of workers I have had in my area, meetings, conventions, Gospel missions etc. Therefore if your asking is this from one worker, the answer is no, its from many. And for that I am glad
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Post by DAa on Aug 19, 2006 15:47:41 GMT -5
DAa I am a little slow.
Would someone please tell me who these servants of God are and also How you know they are servants of God?
WHo Who WHO
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Post by Deleted on Aug 19, 2006 16:49:28 GMT -5
I personally know several people who have shared my experience with the workers but I do not know anyone who has had teenager's experience in regards to asking questions of the workers.
My experience has been that if you ask the 'wrong' questions (for example: "Where in the bible does it say that meeting is the only way to get to heaven?") you will immediately be labeled "unwilling for the sacrifices that need to be made". My experience in this has not been from one worker but from EVERY worker I've ever asked these 'kinds' of questions in my area, meetings, conventions, Gospel missions, etc.
It is interesting to hear of others experience within the same group that seem to be opposite of what I have experienced. If I hadn't heard it here I would have never thought it was a possibility since I do not communicate with anyone from any field that I know has ever had the experience described by teenager.
Every time I've heard a worker speak of there being differences or likenesses in 'the truth' (meetings) I've ALWAYS heard that 'the truth' (meetings) are the same everywhere. So I've been told that differences like this do not exist by the 'leaders' of 'the truth' (meetings).
So, I wonder have any who have been encouraged to ask any of the 'wrong' questions ever been told by the workers that 'the way' (meetings) is the same everywhere?
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Post by just me on Aug 19, 2006 17:23:30 GMT -5
If the answer is "Yes, they are the same everywhere" the person making that statement is either a moron or has no knowledge of human nature.
I dont care what we are talking about, religious meetings, production plants or Micydees, THEY all have their own idiosyncrasies that are peculiar to THEIR location.
Different leader operate differently, different people have their own biases, and furthermore, unless each worker has been to EVERY different meeting, they CANT KNOW they are the same.
I wonder how many "wrong" questions teenager has asked??
I mean no disrespect, but if you really are a teen, you may be a bit on the light side of practical life experience to really shake up a "worker" with a question they dont have a "pet answer" to.
" Blanket statements rarely cover everyone" me
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Post by ex-teenager on Aug 20, 2006 11:44:51 GMT -5
I personally know several people who have shared my experience with the workers but I do not know anyone who has had teenager's experience in regards to asking questions of the workers. My experience has been that if you ask the 'wrong' questions (for example: "Where in the bible does it say that meeting is the only way to get to heaven?") you will immediately be labeled "unwilling for the sacrifices that need to be made". My experience in this has not been from one worker but from EVERY worker I've ever asked these 'kinds' of questions in my area, meetings, conventions, Gospel missions, etc. It is interesting to hear of others experience within the same group that seem to be opposite of what I have experienced. If I hadn't heard it here I would have never thought it was a possibility since I do not communicate with anyone from any field that I know has ever had the experience described by teenager. Every time I've heard a worker speak of there being differences or likenesses in 'the truth' (meetings) I've ALWAYS heard that 'the truth' (meetings) are the same everywhere. So I've been told that differences like this do not exist by the 'leaders' of 'the truth' (meetings). So, I wonder have any who have been encouraged to ask any of the 'wrong' questions ever been told by the workers that 'the way' (meetings) is the same everywhere? It may be hard to believe, but it is my experience, I'm sorry you havent had the same experiencses. to just me, I wouldnt say I was intending to shake anyone up. But from the conversations I had no topic was a no-go.
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