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Post by ithascome on Aug 30, 2007 22:39:05 GMT -5
I have read several posts from people who thought highly of Tim. I was just wondering what kind of preacher he was? Was he born and raised in the 2x2/truth? Does his parents profess? Does anyone know anything about his past? Did he have a bad childhood?
I guess I find it hard to believe that a person can go from being a respected worker to being a pedophile. Today I have felt a little blue.. I know some are angry with him... I'm not... I just feel real sorry for him. He has taken an extreme nosedive in his life. Can you imagine what it would be like to be a ex-worker/convict facing years behind bars with some of the most evil people in the world.
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Post by Freedom2 on Aug 30, 2007 22:52:36 GMT -5
I have read several posts from people who thought highly of Tim. I was just wondering what kind of preacher he was? Was he born and raised in the 2x2/truth? Does his parents profess? Does anyone know anything about his past? Did he have a bad childhood? I guess I find it hard to believe that a person can go from being a respected worker to being a pedophile. Today I have felt a little blue.. I know some are angry with him... I'm not... I just feel real sorry for him. He has taken an extreme nosedive in his life. Can you imagine what it would be like to be a ex-worker/convict facing years behind bars with some of the most evil people in the world. I did not know Tim, but I knew who I believe to be his parents and brother. I don't know how old the children were when the parents professed. I'm not sure his dad continued, I think he was in and out of it. He was a chiropractor and they lived in Southeastern North Dakota. He died of cancer some years back. His (I believe to be) brother Paul professed, I believe through Gilbert Richter and went in the work, oh maybe a year or two later. I understand Paul left the work and is married. I didn't know the parents very well, just seemed that the dad had some issues that prevented him from continuing to profess, such as smoking. To say any more would be purely speculation.
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Post by juliette on Aug 30, 2007 22:56:26 GMT -5
I've heard from the workers and others that Tim had a pretty rough childhood. I don't know more than that. I know he's struggled with depression. I know people who Tim shared with about his childhood and depression. If they are willing to post about what Tim told them...
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Post by Im OK on Aug 31, 2007 23:55:37 GMT -5
I am very saddened by the information I have gotten about Tim. However, Please do not refer to his depression as a cause, reason, or excuse for his behavior. I have a daily fight with the disease and it has never caused me to even think of molesting children. As my doc says "giving up(the fight) is not an option"
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Post by nitro on Sept 1, 2007 0:22:23 GMT -5
Can you imagine what it would be like to be a ex-worker/convict facing years behind bars with some of the most evil people in the world. The report I read he is EVIL. And if word gets out in prison what he has done they will kill him. Molesting children is seen as the worst crime inside prison. He won't last long if he is put in general population. www.cnn.com/2003/US/08/23/geoghan/index.html
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Post by ranman77007 on Sept 1, 2007 9:21:41 GMT -5
Can you imagine what it would be like to be a ex-worker/convict facing years behind bars with some of the most evil people in the world. The report I read he is EVIL. And if word gets out in prison what he has done they will kill him. Molesting children is seen as the worst crime inside prison. He won't last long if he is put in general population. www.cnn.com/2003/US/08/23/geoghan/index.html he won't be put in general population, and it don't work that way... he'll be in p.c. and there are others in the same boat, and they don't necessarily all turn on each other..
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Post by wingsofaneagle on Sept 1, 2007 10:10:05 GMT -5
Jeffery Dahmer was supposed to have been protected too but someone got to him when he was cleaning the bathroom and bludgeoned him to death with a mop handle. If they want you, they will get you.
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Post by ranman77007 on Sept 1, 2007 10:12:49 GMT -5
yeah, but hey reuben mata is just fine. they havent killed him yet. it just depends. and jeffrey dahmer was a special case... he even had food imported from elaine bobbitt. ;D
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Post by wingsofaneagle on Sept 1, 2007 12:09:20 GMT -5
yeah, but hey reuben mata is just fine. they havent killed him yet. it just depends. and jeffrey dahmer was a special case... he even had food imported from elaine bobbitt. ;D Ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww!!!!! <GAG> You are right though. It was a highly publicized case.
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Post by ithasfinallycome on Sept 1, 2007 14:47:49 GMT -5
So ithascome actually DOES have a heart. I wouldn't have believed it until this thread. You so vehemently disagreed with 'Hunters' and have stated so many arrogant or ignorant statements that I figured your heart was elsewhere. I may be wrong. "Extreme nosedive in life' is exactly my point. Think about it.
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therose
Junior Member
"Beauty is in the eye of the beholder"
Posts: 135
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Post by therose on Sept 1, 2007 17:10:13 GMT -5
Wow, ithasfinallycome - kind of mean don't ya think? I do not know this worker and have never heard about this whole thing until the other day but I think all of us agree that the crime here is disgusting to say the least - no excuses - but you can't help but feel a measure of sadness for anyone who has obviously ruined his life and needs some help desparately - not to mention the sympathy we feel especially for the children involved. They will never recover.
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Post by as I c it on Sept 1, 2007 18:00:06 GMT -5
ithascome,
Nitro read the report (I believe), and stated that Tim was EVIL.
I believe those who murder a soul (which is what molestation and rape does) makes a person EVIL....and far more evil, by the way, than someone who simply robs a bank: or swears: or smokes: or drinks: or goes dancing: or...even does drugs.
Money--is replaceable. The other sins either aren't sins: or sins of the soul: or (deliberately done) to bring harm to another human being.
So: what do you classify as "evil"?
And what kind of people do you really think someone (who can molest one day--and preach the gospel the next day) really belongs?
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Post by ANDREW M on Sept 1, 2007 18:32:30 GMT -5
To my mind anything which "grieves" the Holy Spirit can be classified as being "evil." However, I do believe there are different gravities of evil. This is with due regard to "all sin is sin" in which I see no sin as being more "right" than another sin, but I do see some sins as being more "grave" than other sins, if you understand what I mean ?
I am at a loss to comprehend how a person could molest a young child one day and soon after preach the Gospel of righteousness. But for the fact that this and other matters like it have been proved to have happened, I would have thought it impossible.
Without trying to dilute the blame for the perpetrators I can only imagine a mandatory lifestyle of suppressing one's basic human instincts, having no persons they were able to talk to or confide in and having committed themselves to an intended lifetime of such living, has has a contributory effect, so much so that the perpetrators minds shut of to what they were doing in order to get their desired/depraved release.
Attempting to permanently live up to unrealistic expectations I'm sure can cause some individuals to lose their minds to the point they plunge to the depths of despair or depavity before it is fully realised what they are doing.
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Post by ithascome on Sept 1, 2007 19:06:34 GMT -5
I agree.
I guess what I was thinking of, was the contrast. He has been with some of the kindest people in the world .... now he will see the other side. My post was never intended to debate evil.
I beg forgivness... sorry if I gave you a poor impression.
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Post by as I c it on Sept 1, 2007 19:16:11 GMT -5
Andrew,
I believe the desire to molest children was present long before he entered the work.
Rape isn't about a sexual desire. Rape is a form of violence--and hatred--toward women. And their "weapon" employed to destroy.
Molestation is about dominance. And cowardness. And abuse--where the abuser knows that he can victimize the other individual--and the other individual won't/can't "retaliate"--or "hurt them"--in turn.
Abusers never pick an equal "opponent". It's always someone weaker.
A few days ago I saw a Cold Case Files (TV program) where a child molester had kept a journal. And his victims were always chosen at a particular age range: and where he knew that the shame of what he did to them--would keep them silent.
The point I'm having trouble putting into words is that the victim of an abuser is never anyone with the power to strike back at them. "Niceness"/goodness/soft hearts--make them weak.
And the men PICK their victims (often long before they strike).
These are manipulative cowards--who use the "goodness" and innocence of their victims against them. And as far as I'm concerned--they are the scum of the earth when they can pretend to care about your soul (and the soul of others) and then destroy the very soul that they've pretended to care about!
We have MANY fine men who are in the work--who would NEVER molest or hurt a child. And who don't, in fact, EVER want to be guilty of hurting another person--and ESPECIALLY not where their SOUL is concerned!
Because they are true believers in God. And because the state of their heart is such that even if they weren't trusted (by God) to take care of the flock, they STILL wouldn't use THEIR POWER, and strength--as MEN--to hurt anyone. (And certainly not anyone who was weaker than them--and who couldn't fight back).
Let's keep the blame where the blame belongs. Which, in my opinion, is on Tim himself. And not the work. Or anyone else.
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Post by as I c it on Sept 1, 2007 19:30:15 GMT -5
ithascome,
Thank you. I think the fact that Tim was a worker (which creates a wonderful image of some very wonderful men we've known), makes it very difficult to see Tim as he really was.
Whereas if he was just a regular member of society, our vision would clear up pretty fast!
And, actually, I think the right order for him would be: pedophile--pedophile. I'm not sure "worker" really belongs in there....
By the way, do you know that according to one report I read, a large portion of those who are in prison today were children who were molested....
It's regrettable that Tim's life has come to what it has. But it's time victimizers paid the price for their actions--and not the victims.
And perhaps Tim's time in jail may give him the time (and just what he really needs) to give him a saved eternity. We can all pray that this is so.
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Post by ithascome on Sept 1, 2007 19:31:08 GMT -5
Concerning Tim...
There is a blessing that does happen when we're knocked on our backs. It causes us to look up. When we've been knocked on our backs, there's no place to look, but up. When we look up, who do we see? We see the One who is able to raise us up. I believe Jesus is able to raise Tim up.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2007 19:37:50 GMT -5
Andrew M:
"I am at a loss to comprehend how a person could molest a young child one day and soon after preach the Gospel of righteousness. But for the fact that this and other matters like it have been proved to have happened, I would have thought it impossible."
Easy but perverse answer to that Andrew. These guys believe they are doing something good and wonderful for the child. From what I understand, this is true with the vast majority of molesters. So standing up and preaching God the next day is a breeze. It's little wonder there is very little, if any, success in rehabilitating these people, there's obviously a "hardwiring" problem that cannot be fixed with counseling.
Frankly, I don't believe that the lifestyle of the workers contributes to the desire of people like this. However, the lifestyle system of the workers does give these perverted people opportunities to ply their trade like few other professions.
The ministry does have some indirect culpability in this. Workers, the vast majority who are not like this, should encourage parents to be vigilant for this. Workers should understand this phenomena very well and be able to pass on information and strategies to parents to prevent this from happening ever again. To do anything less is to be partly responsible for what happened to Severud's victims and the guaranteed future victims.
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Post by ithascome on Sept 1, 2007 20:51:07 GMT -5
If we are truly to follow Jesus’ commands, we should forgive, and even love, the sex offender even as we sentence them to prison for their actions. There is no conflict between the forgiveness and the punishment - we do what we have to do to protect society, all the while recognizing that redemption is available even to the child molester.
So when we look at a convicted child molester in our midst, the same thiinking should pertain. We can’t judge the man’s soul. He is a sinner, but then so are we, and we all need forgiveness and grace. If the job of judging is lifted from our shoulders, then all have left to do is to protect our children and love our neighbor.
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Post by as i c it on Sept 1, 2007 21:23:21 GMT -5
ithascome,
That's a good point. We need to forgive them for the good of our own souls--even if they don't repent.
And since God is able to save to the utmost, then even molesters can be saved...if they'll really get honest with themselves, and inwardly see the wrongness within themselves.
Perhaps Tim will...
Perhaps he's already beginning to...
Guess time will tell...
And I'm sure many are praying for him.
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Post by Scott Ross on Sept 1, 2007 22:04:17 GMT -5
Howdy, I have to agree with ithascome. It is not up to us to judge Tim. I have been praying for him, although I'll have to admit that I pray more for his victims and the family. To be honest with everyone, I have prayed for a lot of the people who share on this board. When we share our struggles in our lives here, Why wouldn't we pray for each other? When people tell me that they have prayed for me it makes me feel.... loved for no better word. Someone who posts here shared with me a prayer they said before the meeting with Lyle. It really made my day, and I truly believe that the prayer had a part in how the meeting took place. Scott
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skippy
Junior Member
Posts: 79
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Post by skippy on Sept 1, 2007 22:18:12 GMT -5
First of all, his last name is Severud not "rund."
Secondly Tim was my friend. He would come over and talk to me and my husband a lot when he was out of the work. He was super kind to my kid goats and would sit out in the goat yard with us for hours and chat. He left some of his stuff in our honey house when he went back in the work. He loves tin whistles as I do. We used to play hymn after hymn and everyone who listened loved it. He is a great whistler.
Just a month ago I talked to him for about a half hour after Sunday morning meeting. Like Juliette said in one of her posts, "he was a beloved brother worker." I share her feelings. I loved Tim. He was my friend. He was so real (although tragically not) and you could tell him exactly what you thought about any of the bullsh*t that goes on in the religion of the friends and he would hear you. He was like an honest, funny, self deprecating kid himself.
I knew he was often sad and very tormented. We just never knew what it was about. Of course, I am absolutely stunned and horrified to learn what was destroying him. When I saw his picture posted I felt sick. I still can't get my mind around it. There was a Tim that I loved; just how in the world could I have been so snowed?
Minnesota, unfortunately, had another horrific molester who was finally turned in about 15 years ago. He was my elder when I first professed at 18. Although he never did anything to me, he badly hurt so many, many people. I loved both him and his wife. I saw him just last year and he is scary. He is sometimes exactly like I remember him and then he can turn on a dime into a really crazed person.
You know, maybe there are a lot more pedophiles around then we actually know about. Or else I have just had the experience of being in a little home church that housed two of them and they got caught.
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Post by ithascome on Sept 1, 2007 22:38:50 GMT -5
sorry about the misspelled name
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Post by as I c it on Sept 1, 2007 22:58:30 GMT -5
skippy,
You loved the best in him...and from the sounds of that fellow, he was a pretty terrific guy.
Perhaps their desire for their pleasure (albeit at the cost of someone else) was what got out of control within him...
Meanwhile, the good in him (to a certain degree) could have been very real...
I'm glad you wrote in. It turned Tim into more of a person for me--and your comments about him feeling sad and tormented have given me great hope for him in the future.
Especially if he was tormented by the knowledge (and acknowledgment of what he was...and it's wrongness: and his sad state before God because of it).
My heart goes out to you (and to all of those who loved him) and your loss.
Keep praying for him. And that his torment was the beginning of the end of that sin...and, who knows, he may yet end up being a help to those who are in prison with him.
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Post by wanttobewithGod on Sept 1, 2007 23:03:24 GMT -5
There's more than enough sadness to go around in this whole situation, that's for sure...the primary measure, of *course* being for the victims and their families...but I also feel sad that anyone's life would have to go this direction. M.
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Post by as I c it on Sept 1, 2007 23:03:33 GMT -5
skippy,
Sorry. That one sentence should have read "Perhaps his desire for his pleasure (albeit at the cost of someone else) was what got out of control with him".
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Post by nitro on Sept 1, 2007 23:05:22 GMT -5
Render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s, and unto God the things that are God’s
You do the crime you do the time. What you do in prison to make it right with God is Tim's choice. Yes God is all about mercy and Grace.But Caesar's calling now and its time now for him to meet his Judge here on earth.
nitro
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Post by as I c it on Sept 1, 2007 23:18:49 GMT -5
Yes, nitro, you're right.
And it's better that he should pay now (and to this Judge) than later (and to the Heavenly one).
And the fact that he's paying for the wrong he did will also help to heal his victims. (Whereas if he got away with it scott-free, they'd have to deal with that also--adding to their burden of healing from it).
(Poor Lyle. If he really was as nice as skippy makes him sound, it must have broken Lyle's heart to have to do the tough--but right thing--with regards to this event).
So sad. All around.
Which makes me issue this "invitation":
Would any who are pedophiles within the work please now leave--of your own accord--right now...
Whatever damage you're done--you've done. No need to add more....
Nitro:
Where does your "get busy living or get busy dying" statement come from??? I know it's a movie--but the "which one" has been driving me crazy in trying to figure that out.
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