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Post by slowtosee on Dec 31, 2023 0:30:05 GMT -5
Depending on which calendar , Isaac newton was born on a Sunday , January 4 , 1643 . Guess , of higher importance is that he was born Likewise, for Jesus . Alvin The problem involved is too vast for our limited minds. We are in the position of a little child entering a huge library filled with books in many languages. The child knows someone must have written those books. It does not know how. It does not understand the languages in which they are written. The child dimly suspects a mysterious order in the arrangement of the books but doesn't know what it is. That, it seems to me, is the attitude of even the most intelligent human being toward God. We see the universe marvelously arranged and obeying certain laws but only dimly understand these laws.” Isaac Newton
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Love
Dec 31, 2023 3:54:45 GMT -5
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Post by Dan on Dec 31, 2023 3:54:45 GMT -5
No age, it's not up to us to say where people are going when they die. God will judge that. We don't even know where we are going yet. People are in hell in the here and now and don't even know it. Hell is here is the hearts of those who do wicked acts and they bring others to hell with them. Jesus helps to set us free from the depths of hell, he came and taught and showed us the way.
I agree that condemnation is Gods domain.. I don't agree that Christians don't know where they are going yet.
I also don't believe people are in hell in the here and now, although there are days when it may feel like it.
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Post by maryhig on Dec 31, 2023 9:00:14 GMT -5
No age, it's not up to us to say where people are going when they die. God will judge that. We don't even know where we are going yet. People are in hell in the here and now and don't even know it. Hell is here is the hearts of those who do wicked acts and they bring others to hell with them. Jesus helps to set us free from the depths of hell, he came and taught and showed us the way.
I agree that condemnation is Gods domain.. I don't agree that Christians don't know where they are going yet.
I also don't believe people are in hell in the here and now, although there are days when it may feel like it.
So you don't believe that child molesters are full of evil? If they are full of evil they are in hell. Wickedness is of the devil and the devil brings hell into our hearts if we let him in. If the kingdom of God is within those who belong to him, then hell is within those who belong to their father the devil. And God can deliver us from the chains of the world and the devil and God can lift us out of even the lowest depths of hell, and Jesus has showed us the way. Psalms 86:12 I will praise thee, O Lord my God, with all my heart: and I will glorify thy name for evermore. 86:13 For great is thy mercy toward me: and thou hast delivered my soul from the lowest hell.
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Love
Dec 31, 2023 10:31:39 GMT -5
Post by xna on Dec 31, 2023 10:31:39 GMT -5
That, it seems to me, is the attitude of even the most intelligent human being toward God. We see the universe marvelously arranged and obeying certain laws but only dimly understand these laws.” Isaac Newton A great man in history. His contributions in science advanced our understanding of the natural world in a very significantly way. But he spend most of his time on religion and alchemy, but this work didn't make a contribution to mankind. Just because you have discovered truths in one area (science), it doesn't follow that you have discovered any truths in another area. Reminds me of; He is out of his Bailiwick - you don't hear that phase much anymore. A bailiwick is an area of knowledge in which a person or institution has control or expertise "Born on Christmas Day 1642 (according to the old Julian calendar then in use)" "Two of his greatest interests were religion and the dark art of alchemy."www.astronomy.com/science/isaac-newton-a-vindictive-secretive-paranoid-genius/
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Love
Dec 31, 2023 11:24:51 GMT -5
Post by Dan on Dec 31, 2023 11:24:51 GMT -5
I agree that condemnation is Gods domain.. I don't agree that Christians don't know where they are going yet.
I also don't believe people are in hell in the here and now, although there are days when it may feel like it.
So you don't believe that child molesters are full of evil? If they are full of evil they are in hell. Wickedness is of the devil and the devil brings hell into our hearts if we let him in. If the kingdom of God is within those who belong to him, then hell is within those who belong to their father the devil. And God can deliver us from the chains of the world and the devil and God can lift us out of even the lowest depths of hell, and Jesus has showed us the way. Psalms 86:12 I will praise thee, O Lord my God, with all my heart: and I will glorify thy name for evermore. 86:13 For great is thy mercy toward me: and thou hast delivered my soul from the lowest hell.
Yes, evil is the result of sin, but evil is not hell. Hell is the end result of unrepented sin, its the pre-judgement waiting room prior to eternal death (Lake of Fire).
A flesh & blood person can be headed for hell, but they aren't technically there, that destination can only be reached after our physical death.
The phrase “The kingdom of God is within you” in Luke 17:21 is a poor translation from the original Greek. It is better translated “The kingdom of God is among you” or “within your midst”. Jesus was referring to Himself as a representative of that Kingdom. The kingdom of God is a future spiritual reality for believers, not a physical place where we currently reside.
And Psalm 86:13 is a description of salvation, Jesus is the deliverer by which a soul escapes hell.
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Post by maryhig on Dec 31, 2023 12:38:55 GMT -5
So you don't believe that child molesters are full of evil? If they are full of evil they are in hell. Wickedness is of the devil and the devil brings hell into our hearts if we let him in. If the kingdom of God is within those who belong to him, then hell is within those who belong to their father the devil. And God can deliver us from the chains of the world and the devil and God can lift us out of even the lowest depths of hell, and Jesus has showed us the way. Psalms 86:12 I will praise thee, O Lord my God, with all my heart: and I will glorify thy name for evermore. 86:13 For great is thy mercy toward me: and thou hast delivered my soul from the lowest hell.
Yes, evil is the result of sin, but evil is not hell. Hell is the end result of unrepented sin, its the pre-judgement waiting room prior to eternal death (Lake of Fire).
A flesh & blood person can be headed for hell, but they aren't technically there, that destination can only be reached after our physical death.
The phrase “The kingdom of God is within you” in Luke 17:21 is a poor translation from the original Greek. It is better translated “The kingdom of God is among you” or “within your midst”. Jesus was referring to Himself as a representative of that Kingdom. The kingdom of God is a future spiritual reality for believers, not a physical place where we currently reside.
And Psalm 86:13 is a description of salvation, Jesus is the deliverer by which a soul escapes hell.
I'm sorry but we'll have to disagree regarding hell, it definitely begins here I've been there! As for the kingdom of God, do you believe the the Holy Spirit resides within our hearts once we belong to God? And if yes, where is the Holy Spirit from? ....... Heaven. So if the Spirit is within our hearts then heaven is within us. And Jesus said, that he and the father will make their abode with us. If the father and the Christ make our abode with us, then heaven is most certainly within us.
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Love
Dec 31, 2023 15:34:53 GMT -5
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Post by snow on Dec 31, 2023 15:34:53 GMT -5
Control is needed in the form of laws I agree. Telling children they are going to hell if they don't abide by the rules of their parents religion, is not needed. Yes, of course, laws are needed. The question is, what are laws needed FOR: Order in society (government) Order in a belief system (religion) The strength of any institution is measured by its authority and/or power to punish offenders. Religions in free societies are left with only the legal power to brainwash individuals. I guess that would mean that the US is no longer a free society. When they took away women's rights to bodily autonomy and decided it was okay to punish women and their doctors for making a decision that would save a woman's life, religion in the US not only has the power to brain wash their members but now they also have the right to punish those who are not believers of their religion.
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Love
Dec 31, 2023 18:07:38 GMT -5
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Post by slowtosee on Dec 31, 2023 18:07:38 GMT -5
Interestingly , many secular non “religious support pro - life and many “religious support pro- choice . Not so simple to blame either group , for opposing views . Definitely,predictable trends but sometimes data is , surprisingly, not as supportive of my preconceived beliefs , than I might “desire “. More “complicated thsn “ those “ atheists or “those “ religious people , although maybe useful tools for “division “ - us against them . Humanity is a puzzle Alvin secularprolife.org/Monica Snyder gave up her childhood faith. But she never stopped being pro-life. She opposes abortion for different reasons than her Catholic parents. Snyder doesn’t believe fetuses are made in the image of God. She doesn’t think they have eternal souls. Though her arguments differ, as an atheist with a master’s degree in forensic science from the University of California, Davis, her conclusions are the same: Human life begins with the zygote, and abortion is almost always wrong. “Pro-choice people act as if they are morally neutral,” she said. “But abortion is not amoral.” The executive director of Secular Pro-Life is one of a growing number of nonreligious people joining the pro-life cause. Historically, the pro-life movement has been almost exclusively religious, predominantly made up of Catholics and evangelicals. Nonreligious people—including the rising number of younger Americans who tell pollsters “none” when asked about their religious preference—generally defend a woman’s right to terminate a pregnancy. But a 2022 Gallup poll found that 21 percent of the nones say abortion is morally wrong. And as the pro-life movement celebrated the Supreme Court ruling overturning Roe v. Wade in June and then scrambled to fight abortion in 50 states, religious activists are increasingly finding themselves working side by side with secular allies. They welcome the support. And many “religious “ support pro / choice - a YouGov analysis of polling data on abortion from the past year, atheists are the most likely to identify as pro-choice, at 91%, among groups defined by their religious faith or attitude toward religion. Agnostics come in next, with 83% who say they are pro-choice. Just over three-quarters (77%) of Jewish people say they’re pro-choice, along with 76% of Buddhists. Most people (63%) who say their religion is “nothing in particular” also take a pro-choice stance, followed by 56% of Muslims. Roman Catholics, whose religion forbids abortion, are nearly evenly split, with 46% identifying as pro-choice and 47% as pro-life. Among Americans whose religion is Eastern or Greek Orthodox, 44% say they are pro-choice while slightly more (49%) are pro-life. Protestants (38%) and Mormons (25%) are among the least likely to say they are pro-choice. Majorities of Prostestants (57%) and Mormons (69%) are pro-life.
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Love
Dec 31, 2023 19:00:29 GMT -5
Post by Dan on Dec 31, 2023 19:00:29 GMT -5
Yes, evil is the result of sin, but evil is not hell. Hell is the end result of unrepented sin, its the pre-judgement waiting room prior to eternal death (Lake of Fire).
A flesh & blood person can be headed for hell, but they aren't technically there, that destination can only be reached after our physical death.
The phrase “The kingdom of God is within you” in Luke 17:21 is a poor translation from the original Greek. It is better translated “The kingdom of God is among you” or “within your midst”. Jesus was referring to Himself as a representative of that Kingdom. The kingdom of God is a future spiritual reality for believers, not a physical place where we currently reside.
And Psalm 86:13 is a description of salvation, Jesus is the deliverer by which a soul escapes hell.
I'm sorry but we'll have to disagree regarding hell, it definitely begins here I've been there! As for the kingdom of God, do you believe the the Holy Spirit resides within our hearts once we belong to God? And if yes, where is the Holy Spirit from? ....... Heaven. So if the Spirit is within our hearts then heaven is within us. And Jesus said, that he and the father will make their abode with us. If the father and the Christ make our abode with us, then heaven is most certainly within us.
The indwelling of the H.S. does not put us in heaven. Jesus even said that his Kingdom was not of this world (John 18:36). He also said that no one has ascended up to heaven (John 3:13). The H.S is everywhere, its not confined to heaven, nor does it bring paradise to you. e.g; If someone from Kansas stays at your house, it doesn't mean that your in Kansas. No sin is allowed in heaven, we as sinners are not there yet. The H.S is more less a Comforter that's helps us live in the spirit to battle against opposing spirits, "For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places". (Ephesians 6:12)
Happy New Year
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 31, 2023 22:01:39 GMT -5
Yes, of course, laws are needed. The question is, what are laws needed FOR: Order in society (government) Order in a belief system (religion) The strength of any institution is measured by its authority and/or power to punish offenders. Religions in free societies are left with only the legal power to brainwash individuals. I guess that would mean that the US is no longer a free society. When they took away women's rights to bodily autonomy and decided it was okay to punish women and their doctors for making a decision that would save a woman's life, religion in the US not only has the power to brain wash their members but now they also have the right to punish those who are not believers of their religion. It's all part of the planned society -- domination by the Christian Reconstructionists.
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Post by Pragmatic on Jan 1, 2024 1:13:08 GMT -5
Yes, evil is the result of sin, but evil is not hell. Hell is the end result of unrepented sin, its the pre-judgement waiting room prior to eternal death (Lake of Fire).
A flesh & blood person can be headed for hell, but they aren't technically there, that destination can only be reached after our physical death.
The phrase “The kingdom of God is within you” in Luke 17:21 is a poor translation from the original Greek. It is better translated “The kingdom of God is among you” or “within your midst”. Jesus was referring to Himself as a representative of that Kingdom. The kingdom of God is a future spiritual reality for believers, not a physical place where we currently reside.
And Psalm 86:13 is a description of salvation, Jesus is the deliverer by which a soul escapes hell.
I'm sorry but we'll have to disagree regarding hell, it definitely begins here I've been there! As for the kingdom of God, do you believe the the Holy Spirit resides within our hearts once we belong to God? And if yes, where is the Holy Spirit from? ....... Heaven. So if the Spirit is within our hearts then heaven is within us. And Jesus said, that he and the father will make their abode with us. If the father and the Christ make our abode with us, then heaven is most certainly within us. The truth is that no-one actually knows. We can put labels on how we feel, or felt (eg; hell) and we can believe in a concept or what has been written or handed down,so strongly that it feels like we actually know. Faith however does not replace knowing. We just have faith so strong it's as if we do know.
I have enjoyed watching the sun go down in a Middle Eastern desert in the company of Muslims, Jews, and Buddhists. We all marveled at the beauty of creation, and it's creator. However, we had different names or labels for him. Heaven, Hell, God, Allah, Holy Spirit are labels we ascribe to what or who we believe, or believe in.
Some say they are man-made constructs. I'm merely putting it out there, that we do not in fact know. It does not affect my Christian faith, however.
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Post by fixit on Jan 1, 2024 1:24:54 GMT -5
“The kingdom of God is within you” in Luke 17:21 is a poor translation from the original Greek. It is better translated “The kingdom of God is among you” or “within your midst”. Jesus was referring to Himself as a representative of that Kingdom. The kingdom of God is a future spiritual reality for believers, not a physical place where we currently reside. My understanding is that “within your midst” is a poor translation. If anyone says the kingdom is here or there, go not after them for the kingdom is within you. Christ in you is your hope of glory.
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Love
Jan 1, 2024 4:47:48 GMT -5
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Post by slowtosee on Jan 1, 2024 4:47:48 GMT -5
I guess that would mean that the US is no longer a free society. When they took away women's rights to bodily autonomy and decided it was okay to punish women and their doctors for making a decision that would save a woman's life, religion in the US not only has the power to brain wash their members but now they also have the right to punish those who are not believers of their religion. It's all part of the planned society -- domination by the Christian Reconstructionists. I’m quite ignorant on that “theory “ and had to look up “Christian Reconstructionists” . If I understand them correctly, and humanity , there wouldn’t be many of us “ Christian’s” , whatever that means , left alive as we’d be classified as blasphemers , and get the death penalty . Obviously , atheists would have a lot better chance of survival , than us “ so called “ Christians , as we are the real heretics and guilty of death . I think the whole worlds crazy , except me and you , then sometimes I wonder about you - “ one tin soldier “https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cTBx-hHf4BE! Cheers Alvin “-Christian reconstructionism is a fundamentalist Calvinist theonomic movement.[1] It developed primarily under the direction of Rousas Rushdoony, Greg Bahnsen and Gary North[2] and has had an important influence on the Christian right in the United States.[3][4] Its central theme is that society should be reconstructed under the lordship of Jesus in all aspects of life.[5] In keeping with the biblical cultural mandate, reconstructionists advocate for theonomy and the restoration of certain biblical laws said to have continued applicability.[6] These include the death penalty not only for murder, but also for idolatry,[7] open homosexuality,[8] adultery, witchcraft and blasphemy.[9] Most Calvinists reject Christian reconstructionism and hold to classical covenant theology, which is the traditional Calvinist view of the relationship between the Old Covenant and Christianity.[10] Christian reconstructionism is closely linked with postmillennial eschatology and the presuppositional apologetics of Cornelius Van Til.
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Love
Jan 1, 2024 12:31:29 GMT -5
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Jan 1, 2024 12:31:29 GMT -5
I was thinking it's Christmas, and everyone is out shopping, buying presents, partying, lots of excessive drinking, eating, spending etc. Then on the religious side, lots of ceremonies in churches, money collecting, people thinking they are good and holy by putting into the collection box in church, all the pomp and ceremony. All these things without a thought about what Christmas means. Now I don't see Christmas as a religious holiday, I don't know when Jesus was born, but I would think it would be in the spring, lambing season, when things are coming to life, flowers starting to bloom, the sun coming back bringing life, to me this is when Jesus would have been born but I don't know. But the way the world has gone its crazy. They use Christmas to be the total opposite of what he taught. They have changed his simple way, to the ways of the world, and sticking his name to it to make money everything is in excess. I went to our supermarket yesterday and the trollies were piled high, full of food and alcohol. I too have been guilty of all these things, but maybe not in so much excess. Then I thought what would Christmas be like if it were really about Jesus, and I thought, we would feed the homeless man on the street, try to help others in need, cloth someone who's cold, buy shoes for the child, we see in the house down the street where the parents have lost their job, see a child with no toys and help buy them so they don't miss out, sit with someone lonely or even better include them at your Christmas table and care for them after too. Visit the relatives you haven't seen, make amends for wrongdoing and forgive where you can and love. Love is the key, by our own nature we are selfish and all me and mine, but God made us all, so we should never look down on anyone and be there for everyone. Get past me and mine and think if everyone else too and pass on something you don't need, to someone who does need it for free. Give and not just take. Overcome evil with good, God doesn't care about fairly lights, or the gold cross neckless you bought your wife for Christmas, he doesn't care about the false worship and all the ceremonies, he cares about us. He cares about our hearts and he wants us to get our hearts right before him, he wants his love in our hearts, a love where you would do the things that your flesh would never do. Love overcomes evil, and if we all truly followed Jesus, and lived as he taught and really loved one another this excessive world be put to death in our hearts, and Christmas would be every day as we share, care, help even out of our little and love one another, because that's what Jesus would have done and this is the way we should live when we follow him and please God. Merry Christmas. If Christmas was all about your jesus then these verses of hate that he spoke come to mind. Luke 14.26 If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple. And whosoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, cannot be my disciple. There you have it. Your god of love promotes hate and division. What kind of person would lap that up?
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nathan2
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Love
Jan 1, 2024 13:07:35 GMT -5
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Post by nathan2 on Jan 1, 2024 13:07:35 GMT -5
I was thinking it's Christmas, and everyone is out shopping, buying presents, partying, lots of excessive drinking, eating, spending etc. Then on the religious side, lots of ceremonies in churches, money collecting, people thinking they are good and holy by putting into the collection box in church, all the pomp and ceremony. All these things without a thought about what Christmas means. Now I don't see Christmas as a religious holiday, I don't know when Jesus was born, but I would think it would be in the spring, lambing season, when things are coming to life, flowers starting to bloom, the sun coming back bringing life, to me this is when Jesus would have been born but I don't know. But the way the world has gone its crazy. They use Christmas to be the total opposite of what he taught. They have changed his simple way, to the ways of the world, and sticking his name to it to make money everything is in excess. I went to our supermarket yesterday and the trollies were piled high, full of food and alcohol. I too have been guilty of all these things, but maybe not in so much excess. Then I thought what would Christmas be like if it were really about Jesus, and I thought, we would feed the homeless man on the street, try to help others in need, cloth someone who's cold, buy shoes for the child, we see in the house down the street where the parents have lost their job, see a child with no toys and help buy them so they don't miss out, sit with someone lonely or even better include them at your Christmas table and care for them after too. Visit the relatives you haven't seen, make amends for wrongdoing and forgive where you can and love. Love is the key, by our own nature we are selfish and all me and mine, but God made us all, so we should never look down on anyone and be there for everyone. Get past me and mine and think if everyone else too and pass on something you don't need, to someone who does need it for free. Give and not just take. Overcome evil with good, God doesn't care about fairly lights, or the gold cross neckless you bought your wife for Christmas, he doesn't care about the false worship and all the ceremonies, he cares about us. He cares about our hearts and he wants us to get our hearts right before him, he wants his love in our hearts, a love where you would do the things that your flesh would never do. Love overcomes evil, and if we all truly followed Jesus, and lived as he taught and really loved one another this excessive world be put to death in our hearts, and Christmas would be every day as we share, care, help even out of our little and love one another, because that's what Jesus would have done and this is the way we should live when we follow him and please God. Merry Christmas. If Christmas was all about your jesus then these verses of hate that he spoke come to mind. Luke 14.26 If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple. And whosoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, cannot be my disciple. There you have it. Your god of love promotes hate and division. What kind of person would lap that up? I like the NIV translation which said LOVE LESS not Hate! That is a cross all apostles and true followers of Jesus MUST face when it comes between doing and choosing God’s will, plans or choices to make in life. The true believers must choose or put God’s will and choice before ANYONE, fathers, mothers, wives, families or anything in life. Only God, Christ and the Holy Spirit give us the strength, the power, the joy, the inner peace and great blessings when we put them first before anyone or anything. most humans relationship, choices and decisions on earth must end at the grave because bring no eternal blessings in the next world. That is why people and followers of Jesus MUST choose and LOVE God’s will and plans before theirs own will and their love ones, which bring ETERNAL Blessings throughout eternity.
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Post by Dan on Jan 1, 2024 13:42:24 GMT -5
I was thinking it's Christmas, and everyone is out shopping, buying presents, partying, lots of excessive drinking, eating, spending etc. Then on the religious side, lots of ceremonies in churches, money collecting, people thinking they are good and holy by putting into the collection box in church, all the pomp and ceremony. All these things without a thought about what Christmas means. Now I don't see Christmas as a religious holiday, I don't know when Jesus was born, but I would think it would be in the spring, lambing season, when things are coming to life, flowers starting to bloom, the sun coming back bringing life, to me this is when Jesus would have been born but I don't know. But the way the world has gone its crazy. They use Christmas to be the total opposite of what he taught. They have changed his simple way, to the ways of the world, and sticking his name to it to make money everything is in excess. I went to our supermarket yesterday and the trollies were piled high, full of food and alcohol. I too have been guilty of all these things, but maybe not in so much excess. Then I thought what would Christmas be like if it were really about Jesus, and I thought, we would feed the homeless man on the street, try to help others in need, cloth someone who's cold, buy shoes for the child, we see in the house down the street where the parents have lost their job, see a child with no toys and help buy them so they don't miss out, sit with someone lonely or even better include them at your Christmas table and care for them after too. Visit the relatives you haven't seen, make amends for wrongdoing and forgive where you can and love. Love is the key, by our own nature we are selfish and all me and mine, but God made us all, so we should never look down on anyone and be there for everyone. Get past me and mine and think if everyone else too and pass on something you don't need, to someone who does need it for free. Give and not just take. Overcome evil with good, God doesn't care about fairly lights, or the gold cross neckless you bought your wife for Christmas, he doesn't care about the false worship and all the ceremonies, he cares about us. He cares about our hearts and he wants us to get our hearts right before him, he wants his love in our hearts, a love where you would do the things that your flesh would never do. Love overcomes evil, and if we all truly followed Jesus, and lived as he taught and really loved one another this excessive world be put to death in our hearts, and Christmas would be every day as we share, care, help even out of our little and love one another, because that's what Jesus would have done and this is the way we should live when we follow him and please God. Merry Christmas. If Christmas was all about your jesus then these verses of hate that he spoke come to mind. Luke 14.26 If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple. And whosoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, cannot be my disciple. There you have it. Your god of love promotes hate and division. What kind of person would lap that up?
A little research would help your biblical Illiteracy. In Luke 14:26, the Greek word for hate (miseo) can mean love less or esteem less (Strong's concordance reference #3404). Elsewhere Jesus emphasized the 5th commandment to ‘Honor your father and mother’, so he was not contradicting himself. He was simply saying that a disciple must be willing to forsake all to follow him, loving family was not prohibited, it just couldn't take precedence.
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Love
Jan 1, 2024 14:01:06 GMT -5
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Jan 1, 2024 14:01:06 GMT -5
The above two replies represent religious gymnastics at their best, (or worst)
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nathan2
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Love
Jan 1, 2024 14:43:11 GMT -5
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Post by nathan2 on Jan 1, 2024 14:43:11 GMT -5
The above two replies represent religious gymnastics at their best, (or worst) To a hard core atheist like yourself everything about God, Christ’s teachings, belief are gymnastics according to your unbelief mind. However, according to the true followers ofChrist/God, Jesus teachings are like the anchor of our belief and we must LISTEN, and OBEY to his words which bring ETERNAL blessings.
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Love
Jan 1, 2024 14:53:46 GMT -5
Post by curlywurlysammagee on Jan 1, 2024 14:53:46 GMT -5
The above two replies represent religious gymnastics at their best, (or worst) To a hard core atheist like yourself everything about God, Christ’s teachings, belief are gymnastics according to your unbelief mind. However, according to the true followers ofChrist/God, Jesus teachings are like the anchor of our belief and we must LISTEN, and OBEY to his words which bring ETERNAL blessings. Well done, that's a valiant effort.
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Post by Dan on Jan 1, 2024 14:58:10 GMT -5
The above two replies represent religious gymnastics at their best, (or worst)
Atheist often select one verse out of context and contort it into something negative, that's gymnastic apologetics in reverse.
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nathan2
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Love
Jan 1, 2024 15:10:29 GMT -5
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Post by nathan2 on Jan 1, 2024 15:10:29 GMT -5
A little research would help your biblical Illiteracy. In Luke 14:26, the Greek word for hate (miseo) can mean love less or esteem less (Strong's concordance reference #3404). Elsewhere Jesus emphasized the 5th commandment to ‘Honor your father and mother’, so he was not contradicting himself. He was simply saying that a disciple must be willing to forsake all to follow him, loving family was not prohibited, it just couldn't take precedence.
Amen, Dan… My own personal experience help me to understand and appreciate Jesus teachings about LOVE God, Christ more or first before anyone one or thing. When I first coming to gospel meetings of the 2x2 workers, God gave me a clear revelation of Jesus Christ New Testament 2x2 apostolic/workers ministry and Sunday morning Worship fellowship to continue the end of time or Jesus returns. My Pentecostal girlfriend told me I must make a decision that I must STOP attending the workers gospel meetings/Sunday morning meetings if NOT WE are done. What is your choice? I told her blankly I choose God and Jesus Truth and Way and the workers! We broke off but continue to stay as friends to this day. It was a hard decision to make but that is the choice the followers must decide in our journey from earth to heaven. We will make MANY similar choices in days to come. God always come FIRST before anyone or anything! God’s plans, wills and choice are ALWAYS much better than our own and it will bring ETERNAL Joy, inner peace into our lives and the lives of others because of our own choices. ALWAYS Love God more or first than others LESS when it comes in choosing between doing God will or others.
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Post by maryhig on Jan 1, 2024 19:57:56 GMT -5
I'm sorry but we'll have to disagree regarding hell, it definitely begins here I've been there! As for the kingdom of God, do you believe the the Holy Spirit resides within our hearts once we belong to God? And if yes, where is the Holy Spirit from? ....... Heaven. So if the Spirit is within our hearts then heaven is within us. And Jesus said, that he and the father will make their abode with us. If the father and the Christ make our abode with us, then heaven is most certainly within us.
The indwelling of the H.S. does not put us in heaven. Jesus even said that his Kingdom was not of this world (John 18:36). He also said that no one has ascended up to heaven (John 3:13). The H.S is everywhere, its not confined to heaven, nor does it bring paradise to you. e.g; If someone from Kansas stays at your house, it doesn't mean that your in Kansas. No sin is allowed in heaven, we as sinners are not there yet. The H.S is more less a Comforter that's helps us live in the spirit to battle against opposing spirits, "For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places". (Ephesians 6:12)
Happy New Year
No Jesus's kingdom isn't of this world because this world belongs to the prince of this world, Satan, the devil. But heaven is in the heart of those who belong to God, Jesus himself said that the kingdom of God is within you, so if the kingdom of God is within us, then heaven is in our hearts. And if Satan is the prince of this world then hell is here. Sorry we'll have to agree to disagree regarding heaven and hell. Happy new year to you too 😊
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Post by maryhig on Jan 1, 2024 19:58:57 GMT -5
Amen, Dan… My own personal experience help me to understand and appreciate Jesus teachings about LOVE God, Christ more or first before anyone one or thing. When I first coming to gospel meetings of the 2x2 workers, God gave me a clear revelation of Jesus Christ New Testament 2x2 apostolic/workers ministry and Sunday morning Worship fellowship to continue the end of time or Jesus returns. My Pentecostal girlfriend told me I must make a decision that I must STOP attending the workers gospel meetings/Sunday morning meetings if NOT WE are done. What is your choice? I told her blankly I choose God and Jesus Truth and Way and the workers! We broke off but continue to stay as friends to this day. It was a hard decision to make but that is the choice the followers must decide in our journey from earth to heaven. We will make MANY similar choices in days to come. God always come FIRST before anyone or anything! God’s plans, wills and choice are ALWAYS much better than our own and it will bring ETERNAL Joy, inner peace into our lives and the lives of others because of our own choices. ALWAYS Love God more or first than others LESS when it comes in choosing between doing God will or others. Welcome back Nathan, long time since we've seen you, hope you're ok 😊👋
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Post by maryhig on Jan 1, 2024 20:06:52 GMT -5
I was thinking it's Christmas, and everyone is out shopping, buying presents, partying, lots of excessive drinking, eating, spending etc. Then on the religious side, lots of ceremonies in churches, money collecting, people thinking they are good and holy by putting into the collection box in church, all the pomp and ceremony. All these things without a thought about what Christmas means. Now I don't see Christmas as a religious holiday, I don't know when Jesus was born, but I would think it would be in the spring, lambing season, when things are coming to life, flowers starting to bloom, the sun coming back bringing life, to me this is when Jesus would have been born but I don't know. But the way the world has gone its crazy. They use Christmas to be the total opposite of what he taught. They have changed his simple way, to the ways of the world, and sticking his name to it to make money everything is in excess. I went to our supermarket yesterday and the trollies were piled high, full of food and alcohol. I too have been guilty of all these things, but maybe not in so much excess. Then I thought what would Christmas be like if it were really about Jesus, and I thought, we would feed the homeless man on the street, try to help others in need, cloth someone who's cold, buy shoes for the child, we see in the house down the street where the parents have lost their job, see a child with no toys and help buy them so they don't miss out, sit with someone lonely or even better include them at your Christmas table and care for them after too. Visit the relatives you haven't seen, make amends for wrongdoing and forgive where you can and love. Love is the key, by our own nature we are selfish and all me and mine, but God made us all, so we should never look down on anyone and be there for everyone. Get past me and mine and think if everyone else too and pass on something you don't need, to someone who does need it for free. Give and not just take. Overcome evil with good, God doesn't care about fairly lights, or the gold cross neckless you bought your wife for Christmas, he doesn't care about the false worship and all the ceremonies, he cares about us. He cares about our hearts and he wants us to get our hearts right before him, he wants his love in our hearts, a love where you would do the things that your flesh would never do. Love overcomes evil, and if we all truly followed Jesus, and lived as he taught and really loved one another this excessive world be put to death in our hearts, and Christmas would be every day as we share, care, help even out of our little and love one another, because that's what Jesus would have done and this is the way we should live when we follow him and please God. Merry Christmas. If Christmas was all about your jesus then these verses of hate that he spoke come to mind. Luke 14.26 If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple. And whosoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, cannot be my disciple. There you have it. Your god of love promotes hate and division. What kind of person would lap that up? It's hate the sin, not the person. How many people hate themselves? Most people love themselves and put themselves first. It's hating the sin with ourselves and others. And it's putting God first before everyone else in our lives including ourselves. You can hate with a perfect hate, and that's to hate with love. Love the person hate the sin, including in ourselves.
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nathan2
Royal Member
Nathan again
50%
Posts: 3,259
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Post by nathan2 on Jan 1, 2024 20:16:13 GMT -5
Welcome back Nathan, long time since we've seen you, hope you're ok 😊👋 Thanks, it’s good to be back. Yes, everything is going great for me and my family.
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Post by Annan on Jan 1, 2024 20:25:44 GMT -5
Welcome back Nathan, long time since we've seen you, hope you're ok 😊👋 Thanks, it’s good to be back. Yes, everything is going great for me and my family. Have you wife and son professed yet?
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Love
Jan 1, 2024 20:48:49 GMT -5
Post by Dan on Jan 1, 2024 20:48:49 GMT -5
Amen, Dan… My own personal experience help me to understand and appreciate Jesus teachings about LOVE God, Christ more or first before anyone one or thing. When I first coming to gospel meetings of the 2x2 workers, God gave me a clear revelation of Jesus Christ New Testament 2x2 apostolic/workers ministry and Sunday morning Worship fellowship to continue the end of time or Jesus returns. My Pentecostal girlfriend told me I must make a decision that I must STOP attending the workers gospel meetings/Sunday morning meetings if NOT WE are done. What is your choice? I told her blankly I choose God and Jesus Truth and Way and the workers! We broke off but continue to stay as friends to this day. It was a hard decision to make but that is the choice the followers must decide in our journey from earth to heaven. We will make MANY similar choices in days to come. God always come FIRST before anyone or anything! God’s plans, wills and choice are ALWAYS much better than our own and it will bring ETERNAL Joy, inner peace into our lives and the lives of others because of our own choices. ALWAYS Love God more or first than others LESS when it comes in choosing between doing God will or others.
Welcome back.
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nathan2
Royal Member
Nathan again
50%
Posts: 3,259
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Love
Jan 1, 2024 20:53:25 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by nathan2 on Jan 1, 2024 20:53:25 GMT -5
Welcome back. Thanks, Dan… I have always appreciate and enjoy reading your posts and replies on TMB. Your posts make a lot of sense and with the correct interpretations to back it up.
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