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Post by Get off of TMB on Jan 26, 2020 13:27:10 GMT -5
It seems that fewer people are entering the fellowship and thus exiting the fellowship. Most frequent visitors on TMB are middle aged and older. The under 40 haven't had to live under the same strict upbringing as we did and they either remain in the group or the leave with few scars and hangups. Thus can we say that the interest in these websites by former members is waning? I feel less of a need to even post on these boards anymore. With smaller families, few will enter and thus exiting.
Younger people didn't hear the exclusive message drummed into their heads like the older ones did. And the younger ones have more to distract from the message. And the younger ones who remain the group pretty much do their own thing apart from attending meetings when they are inclined to do so.
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Post by BobWilliston on Jan 27, 2020 0:47:37 GMT -5
It seems that fewer people are entering the fellowship and thus exiting the fellowship. Most frequent visitors on TMB are middle aged and older. The under 40 haven't had to live under the same strict upbringing as we did and they either remain in the group or the leave with few scars and hangups. Thus can we say that the interest in these websites by former members is waning? I feel less of a need to even post on these boards anymore. With smaller families, few will enter and thus exiting. Younger people didn't hear the exclusive message drummed into their heads like the older ones did. And the younger ones have more to distract from the message. And the younger ones who remain the group pretty much do their own thing apart from attending meetings when they are inclined to do so. That's probably true in a lot of cases. On the other hand, I know of a lot of young people, both in the 2x2's and other denominations, who are really fanatically unquestioning in their religious devotion. Maybe they've just not been around enough to have experienced enough questionable circumstances.
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Post by ellie on Jan 27, 2020 1:13:00 GMT -5
It seems that fewer people are entering the fellowship and thus exiting the fellowship. Most frequent visitors on TMB are middle aged and older. The under 40 haven't had to live under the same strict upbringing as we did and they either remain in the group or the leave with few scars and hangups. Thus can we say that the interest in these websites by former members is waning? I feel less of a need to even post on these boards anymore. With smaller families, few will enter and thus exiting. Younger people didn't hear the exclusive message drummed into their heads like the older ones did. And the younger ones have more to distract from the message. And the younger ones who remain the group pretty much do their own thing apart from attending meetings when they are inclined to do so. It might be that the percentage of younger people leaving or never professing is so high the younger ones all know plenty of other people in a similar position without having to look on a forum.
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Post by snow on Jan 27, 2020 17:28:15 GMT -5
It seems that fewer people are entering the fellowship and thus exiting the fellowship. Most frequent visitors on TMB are middle aged and older. The under 40 haven't had to live under the same strict upbringing as we did and they either remain in the group or the leave with few scars and hangups. Thus can we say that the interest in these websites by former members is waning? I feel less of a need to even post on these boards anymore. With smaller families, few will enter and thus exiting. Younger people didn't hear the exclusive message drummed into their heads like the older ones did. And the younger ones have more to distract from the message. And the younger ones who remain the group pretty much do their own thing apart from attending meetings when they are inclined to do so. That's probably true in a lot of cases. On the other hand, I know of a lot of young people, both in the 2x2's and other denominations, who are really fanatically unquestioning in their religious devotion. Maybe they've just not been around enough to have experienced enough questionable circumstances. My sister's kids would be a good example of that. They are totally as devout as their mother.
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Post by joanna on Jan 27, 2020 17:56:11 GMT -5
Get off of TMB . Have no clue as to the incline; decline or status quo of the 2x2's however a decline in membership would be consistent with the Rapid Decline of Christianity in this late 2019 Pew Research Center article. Do you have any thoughts on why the 2x2's may or may not join the general mass exodus of the once faithful Christians as discussed in the article Get off of TMB?
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Post by Get off of TMB on Jan 27, 2020 19:50:51 GMT -5
This younger generation has so much info out there. Some religious leader doesn't have the stature and power that they did in our day. This generation has so much info at their fingertips. And the fellowship is much less restrictive today than in the 70s and 80s. For many the fellowship and other systems are social networks as not much more.
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Post by Dan on Jan 27, 2020 20:46:29 GMT -5
Have no clue as to the incline; decline or status quo of the 2x2's however a decline in membership would be consistent with the Rapid Decline of Christianity in this late 2019 Pew Research Center article. Do you have any thoughts on why the 2x2's may or may not join the general mass exodus of the once faithful Christians as discussed in the article Get off of TMB ?
"Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition" (2 Thessalonians 2:3)
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Post by joanna on Jan 27, 2020 21:17:17 GMT -5
Dan . I know enough about the bible to understand that it cannot and should not be relied upon for advice &/or guidance Dan. Do you acknowledge that the bible has been proven to contain many contradictions, false information and incitements to commit violence and other amoral actions? The concept of "sin" is an extremely dangerous one as it inflicts infinite harm on individuals who are accused by believers as having broken religious rules despite these religious rules having no ethical basis. Blasphemy is an example of such a "sin". Progressive countries have abolished laws against blasphemy Islam - which is a version of Christianity dressed in medieval costume - still considers blasphemy as a sinIf only you could progress out of the mindset that is duping you into believing in such primitive concepts Dan. The principle messages contained within the bible are counter-intuitive to that which is moral/ ethical and rational.
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Post by xna on Jan 27, 2020 21:46:42 GMT -5
You should find that information in their annual report, no?
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Post by Dan on Jan 27, 2020 23:14:03 GMT -5
Dan . I know enough about the bible to understand that it cannot and should not be relied upon for advice &/or guidance Dan. Do you acknowledge that the bible has been proven to contain many contradictions, false information and incitements to commit violence and other amoral actions? The concept of "sin" is an extremely dangerous one as it inflicts infinite harm on individuals who are accused by believers as having broken religious rules despite these religious rules having no ethical basis. Blasphemy is an example of such a "sin". Progressive countries have abolished laws against blasphemy Islam - which is a version of Christianity dressed in medieval costume - still considers blasphemy as a sinIf only you could progress out of the mindset that is duping you into believing in such primitive concepts Dan. The principle messages contained within the bible are counter-intuitive to that which is moral/ ethical and rational.
I looked at the first dozen of those "contradictions" and found none that were actual contradictions. I know enough about the bible to understand that it can be relied upon for advice & guidance.
I always make it a point to separate 'religious rules' from biblical teaching, one is divine and the others are devised by men. Islam is not a version of Christianity, not even close.
Nothing primitive about what I believe. The bible is all about morality, and sin is not a mere concept to those who believe the bible. Nonbelievers cannot commit blasphemy.
Suffice to say, we have different views of the bible.
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Post by benar on Jan 29, 2020 3:35:09 GMT -5
Dan . I know enough about the bible to understand that it cannot and should not be relied upon for advice &/or guidance Dan. Do you acknowledge that the bible has been proven to contain many contradictions, false information and incitements to commit violence and other amoral actions? The concept of "sin" is an extremely dangerous one as it inflicts infinite harm on individuals who are accused by believers as having broken religious rules despite these religious rules having no ethical basis. Blasphemy is an example of such a "sin". Progressive countries have abolished laws against blasphemy Islam - which is a version of Christianity dressed in medieval costume - still considers blasphemy as a sinIf only you could progress out of the mindset that is duping you into believing in such primitive concepts Dan. The principle messages contained within the bible are counter-intuitive to that which is moral/ ethical and rational.
I looked at the first dozen of those "contradictions" and found none that were actual contradictions. I know enough about the bible to understand that it can be relied upon for advice & guidance.
I always make it a point to separate 'religious rules' from biblical teaching, one is divine and the others are devised by men. Islam is not a version of Christianity, not even close.
Nothing primitive about what I believe. The bible is all about morality, and sin is not a mere concept to those who believe the bible. Nonbelievers cannot commit blasphemy.
Suffice to say, we have different views of the bible.
Pure delusion.
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Post by dmmichgood on Jan 29, 2020 12:58:23 GMT -5
Dan . I know enough about the bible to understand that it cannot and should not be relied upon for advice &/or guidance Dan. Do you acknowledge that the bible has been proven to contain many contradictions, false information and incitements to commit violence and other amoral actions? The concept of "sin" is an extremely dangerous one as it inflicts infinite harm on individuals who are accused by believers as having broken religious rules despite these religious rules having no ethical basis. Blasphemy is an example of such a "sin". Progressive countries have abolished laws against blasphemy Islam - which is a version of Christianity dressed in medieval costume - still considers blasphemy as a sinIf only you could progress out of the mindset that is duping you into believing in such primitive concepts Dan. The principle messages contained within the bible are counter-intuitive to that which is moral/ ethical and rational. I looked at the first dozen of those "contradictions" and found none that were actual contradictions. I know enough about the bible to understand that it can be relied upon for advice & guidance.
I always make it a point to separate 'religious rules' from biblical teaching, one is divine and the others are devised by men. Islam is not a version of Christianity, not even close.
Nothing primitive about what I believe. The bible is all about morality, and sin is not a mere concept to those who believe the bible. Nonbelievers cannot commit blasphemy.
Suffice to say, we have different views of the bible.
Many people certainly DO have different views of the bible, Dan!
Could that be because many of us who were once Christians ourselves but then began to wonder why there were so many different "Christian" denominations (thousands in fact) all supposedly believing the same book was the absolute 'word of God' but yet fighting tooth & nail about what it actually meant?
Somewhat like some Christians do right here on TMB concerning the so-called Trinity!
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Post by xna on Jan 29, 2020 13:07:41 GMT -5
I looked at the first dozen of those "contradictions" and found none that were actual contradictions. I know enough about the bible to understand that it can be relied upon for advice & guidance.
I always make it a point to separate 'religious rules' from biblical teaching, one is divine and the others are devised by men. Islam is not a version of Christianity, not even close.
Nothing primitive about what I believe. The bible is all about morality, and sin is not a mere concept to those who believe the bible. Nonbelievers cannot commit blasphemy.
Suffice to say, we have different views of the bible.
Many people certainly DO have different views of the bible, Dan!
Could that be because many of us who were once Christians ourselves but then began to wonder why there were so many different "Christian" denominations (thousands in fact) all supposedly believing the same book was the absolute 'word of God' but yet fighting tooth & nail about what it actually meant?
Somewhat like some Christians do right here on TMB concerning the so-called Trinity!
All this bible disagreement could be greatly reduced if there was something there to examine. Now if one says; that tree is 10 feet tall and another says, no its 15 feet tall, they can go together and measure the tree. The problem is as they say; there is no there - there.
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Post by Dan on Jan 29, 2020 15:46:14 GMT -5
I looked at the first dozen of those "contradictions" and found none that were actual contradictions. I know enough about the bible to understand that it can be relied upon for advice & guidance.
I always make it a point to separate 'religious rules' from biblical teaching, one is divine and the others are devised by men. Islam is not a version of Christianity, not even close.
Nothing primitive about what I believe. The bible is all about morality, and sin is not a mere concept to those who believe the bible. Nonbelievers cannot commit blasphemy.
Suffice to say, we have different views of the bible.
Many people certainly DO have different views of the bible, Dan!
Could that be because many of us who were once Christians ourselves but then began to wonder why there were so many different "Christian" denominations (thousands in fact) all supposedly believing the same book was the absolute 'word of God' but yet fighting tooth & nail about what it actually meant?
Somewhat like some Christians do right here on TMB concerning the so-called Trinity!
Religion confuses the simple Truth. There was One Christ, not a thousand renditions of him. I think his life and teachings are so simple that a child could understand. Of course there will be some interpretation disputes, even Paul & Peter experienced one or two, but that doesn't detract from the easily understood central message. New age bibles like the NIV changed 1 John 5:7-8, so of course it made the Trinity an issue.
All this bible disagreement could be greatly reduced if there was something there to examine. Now if one says; that tree is 10 feet tall and another says, no its 15 feet tall, they can go together and measure the tree. The problem is as they say; there is no there - there. The bible is the there-there. How tall does the bible say the tree is?
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Post by xna on Jan 29, 2020 16:11:01 GMT -5
Religion confuses the simple Truth. There was One Christ, not a thousand renditions of him. I think his life and teachings are so simple that a child could understand. Of course there will be some interpretation disputes, even Paul & Peter experienced one or two, but that doesn't detract from the easily understood central message. New age bibles like the NIV changed 1 John 5:7-8, so of course it made the Trinity an issue.
The bible is the there-there. How tall does the bible say the tree is? Daniel 4:11 The tree grew and became strong; Its height reached to the heavens, And it could be seen to the ends of all the earth.———————-------------------------—- That does work if the earth was flat (like the bible describes) or hollow (like nathan describes), otherwise the verse is rooted in fiction, and is much like Jack in the Been-stock myth.
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Post by benar on Jan 29, 2020 18:03:56 GMT -5
]The bible is the there-there. How tall does the bible say the tree is? The Bible is the claim, not the evidence.
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Post by Dan on Jan 29, 2020 20:36:30 GMT -5
Religion confuses the simple Truth. There was One Christ, not a thousand renditions of him. I think his life and teachings are so simple that a child could understand. Of course there will be some interpretation disputes, even Paul & Peter experienced one or two, but that doesn't detract from the easily understood central message. New age bibles like the NIV changed 1 John 5:7-8, so of course it made the Trinity an issue.
The bible is the there-there. How tall does the bible say the tree is? Daniel 4:11 The tree grew and became strong; Its height reached to the heavens, And it could be seen to the ends of all the earth.———————-------------------------—- That does work if the earth was flat (like the bible describes) or hollow (like nathan describes), otherwise the verse is rooted in fiction, and is much like Jack in the Been-stock myth.
You do realize that the Tree in Daniel 4 was what Nebuchadnezzar described in a dream? Daniel interpreted that dream and revealed that the tree represented the King. So the story never meant to describe a literal tree, but a dream-tree.
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Post by xna on Jan 29, 2020 20:47:27 GMT -5
Daniel 4:11 The tree grew and became strong; Its height reached to the heavens, And it could be seen to the ends of all the earth.———————-------------------------—- That does work if the earth was flat (like the bible describes) or hollow (like nathan describes), otherwise the verse is rooted in fiction, and is much like Jack in the Been-stock myth.
You do realize that the Tree in Daniel 4 was what Nebuchadnezzar described in a dream? Daniel interpreted that dream and revealed that the tree represented the King. So the story never meant to describe a literal tree, but a dream-tree.
No I didn't. Now that you mention it I do recall that was the case but I threw my bible away, and don't own a bible. I did know Jack in the been-stock was dreamed up. Speaking of things which reach heaven; Do you think that The Tower of Babel "with a tower that reaches to the heavens" was real, or also a dream?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2020 21:13:01 GMT -5
You do realize that the Tree in Daniel 4 was what Nebuchadnezzar described in a dream? Daniel interpreted that dream and revealed that the tree represented the King. So the story never meant to describe a literal tree, but a dream-tree.
No I didn't. Now that you mention it I do recall that was the case but I threw my bible away, and don't own a bible. I did know Jack in the been-stock was dreamed up. Speaking of things which reach heaven; Do you think that The Tower of Babel "with a tower that reaches to the heavens" was real, or also a dream? ummm you can see the remnants of the tower of babel in iraq i believe...
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Post by xna on Jan 29, 2020 21:18:35 GMT -5
No I didn't. Now that you mention it I do recall that was the case but I threw my bible away, and don't own a bible. I did know Jack in the been-stock was dreamed up. Speaking of things which reach heaven; Do you think that The Tower of Babel "with a tower that reaches to the heavens" was real, or also a dream? ummm you can see the remnants of the tower of babel in iraq i believe... The Book of Jubilees mentions the tower's height as being 5,433 cubits and 2 palms, or 2,484 m (8,150 ft), or roughly 1.6 miles high! That would be a very big pile of rocks to hide. Today we don't have any way to build such a tall structure. That's amazing.
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Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 29, 2020 21:42:22 GMT -5
answersingenesis.org/kids/bible-questions/how-big-was-babel/And they said, “Come, let us build ourselves a city, and a tower whose top is in the heavens; let us make a name for ourselves, lest we be scattered abroad over the face of the whole earth.” (GENESIS 11:4) Bible GENESIS 11:3–4 JUDGES 9:51 PROVERBS 18:10 The Bible doesn’t tell us how big the Tower of Babel was. It is described as “a tower whose top is in the heavens.” (GENESIS 11:4) This means that it was much taller than the buildings of the city that Noah’s descendants were constructing. The tower would have been above them, but it would not have needed to be as big as a skyscraper today. Later, other towers were built in the same area that had names similar to “tower whose top is in the heavens”, but these towers were not that big. They were just the largest structures compared to what was around them. Many believe that the Etemenanki (EH-tuh-meh-NAHN-kee) tower was simply another later name for the Tower of Babel. Etemenanki means “temple of the foundation of heaven and earth.” The tower was old and run down by the time of Daniel and Nebuchadnezzar (500–600 B.C.) and Alexander the Great tore it down about 325 B.C. Judging by the square base where the tower originally was located, an old description on a tablet, and the writing of a historian named Herodotus, the tower was probably about 7–8 stories and 300 feet (91 meters) high. That would definitely be big enough to stand out in a little city!
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Post by nathan on Jan 29, 2020 22:35:57 GMT -5
They built the Tower of Babel just in case, God sent another world wide flood then they would NOT be drowned in the water.
The next time God will destroy the earth with fire/meteorite fallen from the sky that wiped out the dinasours on earth millions yrs ago.
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Post by BobWilliston on Jan 29, 2020 23:57:48 GMT -5
]You do realize that the Tree in Daniel 4 was what Nebuchadnezzar described in a dream? Daniel interpreted that dream and revealed that the tree represented the King. So the story never meant to describe a literal tree, but a dream-tree. [/div][/quote] If the Bible is so simple, how come one needs Cliff Notes* to make sense of it. *For Canadian readers, that's Cole's Notes.
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Post by BobWilliston on Jan 30, 2020 0:34:58 GMT -5
No I didn't. Now that you mention it I do recall that was the case but I threw my bible away, and don't own a bible. I did know Jack in the been-stock was dreamed up. Speaking of things which reach heaven; Do you think that The Tower of Babel "with a tower that reaches to the heavens" was real, or also a dream? ummm you can see the remnants of the tower of babel in iraq i believe... It's been replaced by the Burj Khalifa.
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Post by curlywurlysammagee on Jan 30, 2020 0:37:09 GMT -5
Have no clue as to the incline; decline or status quo of the 2x2's however a decline in membership would be consistent with the Rapid Decline of Christianity in this late 2019 Pew Research Center article. Do you have any thoughts on why the 2x2's may or may not join the general mass exodus of the once faithful Christians as discussed in the article Get off of TMB ?
"Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition" (2 Thessalonians 2:3)
That is very applicable to the writers and believers of the bible or any other religious tract. They are the ones doing the deceiving.
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Post by BobWilliston on Jan 30, 2020 0:37:41 GMT -5
They built the Tower of Babel just in case, God sent another world wide flood then they would NOT be drowned in the water. Pinocchio
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Post by Dan on Jan 30, 2020 2:02:42 GMT -5
"Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition" (2 Thessalonians 2:3)
That is very applicable to the writers and believers of the bible or any other religious tract. They are the ones doing the deceiving.
Its no deception, the fact is, and the numbers prove, that Christianity is on the decline.. I believe you could find proof of that in the nearest mirror
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Post by xna on Jan 30, 2020 8:46:57 GMT -5
That is very applicable to the writers and believers of the bible or any other religious tract. They are the ones doing the deceiving.
Its no deception, the fact is, and the numbers prove, that Christianity is on the decline.. I believe you could find proof of that in the nearest mirror Worldwide the number of Christians is increasing. As a percentage of the population they are decreasing in Europe and the USA, but is increasing in sub-Saharan Africa and the Asia-Pacific region. www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2013/03/22/number-of-christians-rises-but-their-share-of-world-population-stays-stable/
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