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Post by snow on Jan 18, 2020 13:12:15 GMT -5
The government spends millions on getting people into space. Can't the venusians just take them there? I know....they need the ticket of salvation. Venus is the place for the saved, inner earth is the place for the unsaved. You need faith to be able to get into Venus, faith that it is heaven in order to gain entry there. I'm trying to figure out how it all works. Just 'believe'and you will be okay. That just never worked for me. How do you just ignore something that is false and just believe knowing it's false but something you're required to believe on faith?
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Post by maryhig on Jan 18, 2020 13:33:15 GMT -5
I believe those in heaven are helping us here on the earth. *** The believers in heaven are praying and cheering us to keep on fight the battles to the end. Read Hebrews chapter 11 We read about the great cloud of old test believersWitnesses and now there is a greater cloud witnesses of Gentiles that no man can count add to the great cloud of Witnesses. I don't believe that they are just praying and cheering, I believe that they help us.
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Post by xna on Jan 18, 2020 13:37:09 GMT -5
Just 'believe'and you will be okay. That just never worked for me. How do you just ignore something that is false and just believe knowing it's false but something you're required to believe on faith? Belief is not a choice. If someone says otherwise, ask them to believe that it's not, and they can't.
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Post by snow on Jan 18, 2020 13:46:01 GMT -5
That just never worked for me. How do you just ignore something that is false and just believe knowing it's false but something you're required to believe on faith? Belief is not a choice. If someone says otherwise, ask them to believe that it's not, and they can't. Something to remember on here.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2020 13:48:27 GMT -5
That just never worked for me. How do you just ignore something that is false and just believe knowing it's false but something you're required to believe on faith? Belief is not a choice. If someone says otherwise, ask them to believe that it's not, and they can't. that doesn't explain atheists, especially ones who believed at one time then choose not to....
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Post by snow on Jan 18, 2020 13:57:31 GMT -5
Belief is not a choice. If someone says otherwise, ask them to believe that it's not, and they can't. that doesn't explain atheists, especially ones who believed at one time then choose not to.... Actually it does. Quite nicely. We don't not believe by choice. And we once believed and that wasn't a choice either. I know I never asked to not believe and I think many atheists are the same as me in that way. Once the realization hits, asked for or not, there is no way you can 'unsee', no way you can go back to just believing by faith.
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Post by xna on Jan 18, 2020 14:05:54 GMT -5
Belief is not a choice. If someone says otherwise, ask them to believe that it's not, and they can't. that doesn't explain atheists, especially ones who believed at one time then choose not to.... Reasonable people change their mind (belief) based on new information which is overwhelmingly more convincing than their prior understandings. Your belief is and end result, not something that can be changed at will. Ones belief does make something true or false. It’s only your perception. Verifiable evidence leads you to what is most true, and is independent of anyone’s belief.
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Post by mountain on Jan 18, 2020 14:08:04 GMT -5
Just 'believe'and you will be okay. That just never worked for me. How do you just ignore something that is false and just believe knowing it's false but something you're required to believe on faith? Are you suggesting that all this information we have been learning about Venus is false?
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Post by snow on Jan 18, 2020 14:23:41 GMT -5
That just never worked for me. How do you just ignore something that is false and just believe knowing it's false but something you're required to believe on faith? Are you suggesting that all this information we have been learning about Venus is false? Totally! How can the planets be hollow when they are clearly flat!
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Post by nathan on Jan 18, 2020 14:57:59 GMT -5
My wife says I still look the same as 35 yrs ago.... lost some hair, show some gray hair... Still have the youthful looks How are her eyes? ;-) ** Bad eyes sight. Go to eyes doctor once a yr. for check up.
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Post by matisse on Jan 18, 2020 15:14:42 GMT -5
Belief is not a choice. If someone says otherwise, ask them to believe that it's not, and they can't. that doesn't explain atheists, especially ones who believed at one time then choose not to.... When you suddenly see the "smoke and mirrors" clear as day, there is no choice.
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Post by nathan on Jan 18, 2020 15:52:38 GMT -5
*** The believers in heaven are praying and cheering us to keep on fight the battles to the end. Read Hebrews chapter 11 We read about the great cloud of old test believersWitnesses and now there is a greater cloud witnesses of Gentiles that no man can count add to the great cloud of Witnesses. I don't believe that they are just praying and cheering, I believe that they help us. So, please tell me how the believers are helping us on earth when God told them to REST and wait for their brethren.
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Post by nathan on Jan 18, 2020 15:56:01 GMT -5
that doesn't explain atheists, especially ones who believed at one time then choose not to.... When you suddenly see the "smoke and mirrors" clear as day, there is no choice. ** Paul wrote in one of his epistles, because they have no love for the truth and His way, God send them a STRONG Delusion that they believe the LIE.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2020 15:59:51 GMT -5
All this Stuff just makes a mockery of the church Nathan is in IMO & then there are those that in the next breath read some scripture he quotes & like it.
You have to wonder at the mentality of all this.
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Post by maryhig on Jan 18, 2020 16:03:40 GMT -5
I don't believe that they are just praying and cheering, I believe that they help us. So, please tell me how the believers are helping us on earth when God told them to REST and wait for their brethren. Can you quote me the scripture you are referring to please?
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Post by Annan on Jan 18, 2020 16:17:30 GMT -5
I believe those in heaven are helping us here on the earth. Help us how and with what? Do they answer prayer in that they assist God or do his will for us? I'm seriously asking what you believe.
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Post by nathan on Jan 18, 2020 16:18:14 GMT -5
So, please tell me how the believers are helping us on earth when God told them to REST and wait for their brethren. Can you quote me the scripture you are referring to please? ** READ Rev. 6:9-13.
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Post by matisse on Jan 18, 2020 16:23:09 GMT -5
When you suddenly see the "smoke and mirrors" clear as day, there is no choice. ** Paul wrote in one of his epistles, because they have no love for the truth and His way, God send them a STRONG Delusion that they believe the LIE. I loved God. It was devastating to me when I suddenly saw the "smoke and mirrors" clear as day.
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Post by nathan on Jan 18, 2020 16:34:00 GMT -5
Are you suggesting that all this information we have been learning about Venus is false? Totally! How can the planets be hollow when they are clearly flat! ** RAM/Mountain KNOWS I do a through study and research on all kinds of subjects before I post it on here. I have multiples sources to back it up because I want signed, sealed and delivered.
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Post by xna on Jan 18, 2020 16:38:41 GMT -5
When you suddenly see the "smoke and mirrors" clear as day, there is no choice. ** Paul wrote in one of his epistles, because they have no love for the truth and His way, God send them a STRONG Delusion that they believe the LIE. The verse you quote shows one of the many bible contradictions. 2 Thessalonians 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie. Both can not be true at the same time; either god lies, or god does not lie.
Satan was the great deceiver in the rest of the bible, and it's impossible for god to lie. Hebrews 6:18 That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us:
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Post by nathan on Jan 18, 2020 16:41:08 GMT -5
** Paul wrote in one of his epistles, because they have no love for the truth and His way, God send them a STRONG Delusion that they believe the LIE. I loved God. It was devastating to me when I suddenly saw the "smoke and mirrors" clear as day. *** I KNOW many of you LOVE God at one time and some still do. Satan is our souls fierce enemy and he and 1/3 millions of fallen angels don't want any of us to be in heaven with God for eternity. Therefore, Satan and the demonic angels will use all of their super natural power to deceive and to take our crowns of life that God has promised to give us if we ENDURE unto the end of life. We need to help and encourage each other to stay on course and not to waiver or veer off from the path of eternal life.
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Post by nathan on Jan 18, 2020 16:53:37 GMT -5
** Paul wrote in one of his epistles, because they have no love for the truth and His way, God send them a STRONG Delusion that they believe the LIE. The verse you quotes shows one of the many bible contradictions. 2 Thessalonians 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie
Satan was the great deceiver in the rest of the bible, and it's impossible for god to lie. Hebrews 6:18 That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us:
*** Because they are no longer have LOVE for truth or God so, He harden His heart like He did with Pharaoh, who REFUSED to set the children of Israel FREE so they could Worship God/Yahweh as their God instead the Pharoah Egyptians gods of Horus. God harden his heart and let them believe the LIE as the truth... Like William Irvine started/Founder all of it in 1897 and this truth of Jesus is ONLY 130 yrs old. God's Truth and Way are Eternal.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2020 17:09:18 GMT -5
The verse you quotes shows one of the many bible contradictions. 2 Thessalonians 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie
Satan was the great deceiver in the rest of the bible, and it's impossible for god to lie. Hebrews 6:18 That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us:
*** Because they are no longer have LOVE for truth or God so, He harden His heart like He did with Pharaoh, who REFUSED to set the children of Israel FREE so they could Worship God/Yahweh as their God instead the Pharoah Egyptians gods of Horus. God harden his heart and let them believe the LIE as the truth... Like William Irvine started/Founder all of it in 1897 and this truth of Jesus is ONLY 130 yrs old. God's Truth and Way are Eternal. So by that reasoning, you are saying that those in the church who agree William Irvine started the church no longer have LOVE for truth or God and God has hardened their hearts. But Nathan, who has his theory is an exception.
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Post by xna on Jan 18, 2020 17:09:40 GMT -5
The verse you quotes shows one of the many bible contradictions. 2 Thessalonians 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie
Satan was the great deceiver in the rest of the bible, and it's impossible for god to lie. Hebrews 6:18 That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us:
*** Because they are no longer have LOVE for truth or God so, He harden His heart like He did with Pharaoh, who REFUSED to set the children of Israel FREE so they could Worship God/Yahweh as their God instead the Pharoah Egyptians gods of Horus. God harden his heart and let them believe the LIE as the truth... Like William Irvine started/Founder all of it in 1897 and this truth of Jesus is ONLY 130 yrs old. God's Truth and Way are Eternal. Those verses kinda kill the whole idea of freewill. Here is a summary of the bible contradictions verses on: Does God lie?No, God cannot and does not lie.
God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent. Numbers 23:19
The Strength of Israel will not lie nor repent. 1 Samuel 15:29
Thou art that God, and thy words be true. 2 Samuel 7:28
Thy word is true from the beginning. Psalm 119:160
In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began. Titus 1:2
It was impossible for God to lie. Hebrews 6:18 Yes, God lies by proxy; He sends prophets or lying spirits to deceive.
Now, therefore, behold, the Lord hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of these thy prophets, and the Lord hath spoken evil concerning thee. 1 Kings 22:23
Now therefore, behold, the Lord hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of these thy prophets. 2 Chronicles 18:22
Ah, Lord GOD! surely thou hast greatly deceived this people. Jeremiah 4:10
O Lord, thou hast deceived me, and I was deceived. Jeremiah 20:7
And if a prophet be deceived when he hath spoken a thing, I the Lord have deceived that prophet. Ezekiel 14:9
For this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie. 2 Thessalonians 2:11
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Post by nathan on Jan 18, 2020 17:36:06 GMT -5
*** Because they are no longer have LOVE for truth or God so, He harden His heart like He did with Pharaoh, who REFUSED to set the children of Israel FREE so they could Worship God/Yahweh as their God instead the Pharoah Egyptians gods of Horus. God harden his heart and let them believe the LIE as the truth... Like William Irvine started/Founder all of it in 1897 and this truth of Jesus is ONLY 130 yrs old. God's Truth and Way are Eternal. Those verses kinda kill the whole idea of freewill. Here is a summary of the bible contradictions verses on: Does God lie?No, God cannot and does not lie.
God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent. Numbers 23:19
The Strength of Israel will not lie nor repent. 1 Samuel 15:29
Thou art that God, and thy words be true. 2 Samuel 7:28
Thy word is true from the beginning. Psalm 119:160
In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began. Titus 1:2
It was impossible for God to lie. Hebrews 6:18 Yes, God lies by proxy; He sends prophets or lying spirits to deceive.
Now, therefore, behold, the Lord hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of these thy prophets, and the Lord hath spoken evil concerning thee. 1 Kings 22:23
Now therefore, behold, the Lord hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of these thy prophets. 2 Chronicles 18:22
Ah, Lord GOD! surely thou hast greatly deceived this people. Jeremiah 4:10
O Lord, thou hast deceived me, and I was deceived. Jeremiah 20:7
And if a prophet be deceived when he hath spoken a thing, I the Lord have deceived that prophet. Ezekiel 14:9
For this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie. 2 Thessalonians 2:11*** God doesn't make mistake, He/They are just and perfect that I know. Most of the times we humans don't know the whole story or understand the situation, what behind the scence so, we say things are NOT true and correct about God. Like in the story of Job, he didn't know God and Satan were fighting for His dear soul! Job said things about God were NOT quite true so, He spoke to him from heaven READ Job chapters 38-39 WOW! God gave the humans some insight of who He is.
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Post by xna on Jan 18, 2020 18:08:09 GMT -5
** God doesn't make mistake, He/They are just and perfect that I know. Well, you only have to make it to chapter 6 in the first book of the bible to read that "He/They" made mistakes. That's not the image of a perfect god. You could say that was the devil and evil and not god. But then who made the the devil and who made evil. Genesis 6:6 "And it repented the Lord that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.John 1:3 "All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.”Isaiah 45:7 "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things."The bible is full of self contradictions, it's best to read it as myth and metaphor.
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Post by matisse on Jan 18, 2020 18:20:00 GMT -5
I loved God. It was devastating to me when I suddenly saw the "smoke and mirrors" clear as day. *** I KNOW many of you LOVE God at one time and some still do. Satan is our souls fierce enemy and he and 1/3 millions of fallen angels don't want any of us to be in heaven with God for eternity. Therefore, Satan and the demonic angels will use all of their super natural power to deceive and to take our crowns of life that God has promised to give us if we ENDURE unto the end of life. We need to help and encourage each other to stay on course and not to waiver or veer off from the path of eternal life. I do not believe this. I do not believe in Satan or demonic angels or crowns of life or eternal life. These, IMO, are part of the "smoke and mirrors".
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Post by benar on Jan 18, 2020 18:39:00 GMT -5
Belief is not a choice. If someone says otherwise, ask them to believe that it's not, and they can't. that doesn't explain atheists, especially ones who believed at one time then choose not to.... Wally, do you choose to not believe in pixies, or is it a case of not having enough evidence to convince you?
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