|
Post by snow on Jan 7, 2020 13:25:48 GMT -5
You do understand that the Muslims have the Jewish concept of God, and Christians have a Greek/Pagan concept of god. But there are as many kinds of Islam as there are of Christianity. Most of them think they are the only ones who have the right idea of what God is like. Maybe most people don't really know what the nature of god is -- they just go along with what they've been told. Most of them even have revelations from their own version of god, which probably explains why different peoples revelations conflict with each other. But in the end it’s the Jewish God that reigns supreme, so the Bible says. He opened up salvation to the Gentiles only because the Jews had been so disobedient. It was to make them jealous. In Christ’s reign all will be together and there’ll be no Jew nor Gentile in Jerusalem. They’ll all be the saints of Christ. I’ve enjoyed listening to different Jews interpretation of the Messiah in a Jesus. They’ve put the IT right into the present day. Their God is trying to make them jealous!! Really! All powerful beings actually do that kind of thing? Wow, just wow.
|
|
|
Post by snow on Jan 7, 2020 13:27:49 GMT -5
I think if you really understood how hard it is to die, you might change your mind about not fearing death. I think some believers just think atheists are being stupid for not using wise judgement I know I do. Do think it's stupid to not believe in fairies, or Thor, or Krishna, or or or... If not then why would you think we are stupid for not believing in your particular god?
|
|
|
Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 7, 2020 13:52:42 GMT -5
I did say “from my experience “. But I only say that because it worked for the father in the Bible and it worked for me. My experience has taught me that many humans just aren’t able to give the answers I need. They aren’t in my shoes and they have little idea where I’m wanting to go with my questions. I think it’s apparent that it’s that way in regards to anything spirit related. But then again one has to be born again in the spirit to receive help from even God in answers. Which just tells me that because only you know yourself the best, the answers need to come from you in the first place. Others can offer opinions, but in the end it's you who knows what will work for you. You just happen give credit to a god while you're doing that process that atheists do and give credit to themselves being able to work out what they uniquely need. But I’m very well aware I’m not omnipotent!
|
|
|
Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 7, 2020 13:53:10 GMT -5
But in the end it’s the Jewish God that reigns supreme, so the Bible says. He opened up salvation to the Gentiles only because the Jews had been so disobedient. It was to make them jealous. In Christ’s reign all will be together and there’ll be no Jew nor Gentile in Jerusalem. They’ll all be the saints of Christ. I’ve enjoyed listening to different Jews interpretation of the Messiah in a Jesus. They’ve put the IT right into the present day. Their God is trying to make them jealous!! Really! All powerful beings actually do that kind of thing? Wow, just wow. That’s what the Bible says. EDIT: Deuteronomy 32:21. They have moved me to jealousy with THAT WHICH IS NOT GOD; they have provoked me to anger with their vanities; AND I WILL MOVE them TO JEALOUSY with those WHICH ARE NOT A PEOPLE; I will provoke them to anger with a foolish nation.(last sentence sounds like Iran and the US)
|
|
|
Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 7, 2020 13:54:05 GMT -5
I think some believers just think atheists are being stupid for not using wise judgement I know I do. Do think it's stupid to not believe in fairies, or Thor, or Krishna, or or or... If not then why would you think we are stupid for not believing in your particular god? Pardon me, but he said wise judgment, not believing.
|
|
|
Post by snow on Jan 7, 2020 14:12:37 GMT -5
Which just tells me that because only you know yourself the best, the answers need to come from you in the first place. Others can offer opinions, but in the end it's you who knows what will work for you. You just happen give credit to a god while you're doing that process that atheists do and give credit to themselves being able to work out what they uniquely need. But I’m very well aware I’m not omnipotent! No one said you were. You don't need to be omnipotent to make good decisions about yourself. And not all decisions you do make turn out to be the best, that's a fact of life for everyone. So if you depend on God to tell you want is best for you, why hasn't all your decisions not been absolutely the best ones. I'm sure you've messed up sometimes, right? Well join the club. All humans do that.
|
|
|
Post by snow on Jan 7, 2020 14:15:07 GMT -5
Their God is trying to make them jealous!! Really! All powerful beings actually do that kind of thing? Wow, just wow. That’s what the Bible says. EDIT: Deuteronomy 32:21. They have moved me to jealousy with THAT WHICH IS NOT GOD; they have provoked me to anger with their vanities; AND I WILL MOVE them TO JEALOUSY with those WHICH ARE NOT A PEOPLE; I will provoke them to anger with a foolish nation.(last sentence sounds like Iran and the US) Not trying to be offensive, but I honestly can't understand why anyone would worship an entity that got jealous so he had to make his people jealous as punishment for making him jealous. This is not an all powerful, all knowing being in my books. It's a petty individual that doesn't seem to act any different from some humans. And those humans aren't the cream of the crop humans either imo.
|
|
|
Post by snow on Jan 7, 2020 14:17:10 GMT -5
Do think it's stupid to not believe in fairies, or Thor, or Krishna, or or or... If not then why would you think we are stupid for not believing in your particular god? Pardon me, but he said wise judgment, not believing. We do use wise judgement all the time. We just don't believe so what else could he be referring to other than being stupid for not believing in his god? I make wise judgement calls in my life all the time and I don't believe in your god. And, sometimes I don't make wise judgement calls. That's life and it seems that Christians are just as prone to both wise judgement and non wise judgement as much as atheists.
|
|
|
Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 7, 2020 14:49:43 GMT -5
But I’m very well aware I’m not omnipotent! No one said you were. You don't need to be omnipotent to make good decisions about yourself. And not all decisions you do make turn out to be the best, that's a fact of life for everyone. So if you depend on God to tell you want is best for you, why hasn't all your decisions not been absolutely the best ones. I'm sure you've messed up sometimes, right? Well join the club. All humans do that. I think you mistake the answers I seek from God. It’s mire of the spiritual realm. Yes, I do run what I’m thinking about things of everyday life and kind of leave it there. But my questions are biblical/spiritual, and those are answered maybe not always right away, but sometimes no answer makes me think it through for myself. It works that way also.
|
|
|
Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 7, 2020 15:00:25 GMT -5
Pardon me, but he said wise judgment, not believing. We do use wise judgement all the time. We just don't believe so what else could he be referring to other than being stupid for not believing in his god? I make wise judgement calls in my life all the time and I don't believe in your god. And, sometimes I don't make wise judgement calls. That's life and it seems that Christians are just as prone to both wise judgement and non wise judgement as much as atheists. It was about how hard dying is, not believing. Benar had said or the way he said it was he didn’t fear death. And I said if he knew how hard dying was he’d change his mind. I was talking in the literal and that’s what Jetmech was referring to. To say one doesn’t fear death is really not thinking wisely even literally. Only those who have sudden quick deaths might go that way but even some of sudden deaths face great fear and it’s the shock of one’s demise that kills them. I had a girl friend who I’d grown up with. She got married and she and her husband moved about 75 north of where her mother lived and they’d come back home on some weekends to see family. So one Sunday afternoon they were headed back north and it had been raining pretty hard. There is a place in that old highway that when heavy rains hit there is an oil slick that appears on top of that highway. It was an accident waiting to happen. We had many of those victims from that area when I worked with the neurosurgeon. But back to the girl and her husband. They saw the car coming at them from opposite direction spin in that oil slick and they knew they were going to be hit. The girl told her husband, “Clyde, I’m scared to death.” Those were the last words she said. She didn’t have deadly injuries like Clyde did, but she died in collision from the fear. So the autopsy doctors said. No physical reason found.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2020 16:29:45 GMT -5
gotta go back to the sinking ship again, when its sinking you don't take time to yell at whats sinking it you just get in the offered lifeboat and move on.... We've gotten totally away from the original point though. You said the man offering the lifeboat was extortion. I asked how that could be since he wasn't the reason the ship was sinking in the first place and all he was doing was offering a solution. Unlike when God makes the ship sink, gives you Jesus to offer you the lifeboat, and making it the only way to be saved. See the difference? If God hadn't made the ship sink in the first place then the offer of a lifeboat wouldn't be required. i think you meant to say salvation...i never said it was extortion...and as i showed benar its satan thats sinking the ship not God...
|
|
|
Post by BobWilliston on Jan 7, 2020 17:32:28 GMT -5
I’m not sure about that. It only makes sense though, that if we don’t know our Saviour can he not be justified in saying, “Depart from me, I never knew you.”? I know my question to God about revealing the concept to me was “if it is vital to my salvation.” So since he did reveal it, that seems to be the answer that it is vital to my salvation. But then I do admit that may not be true for everyone. But why I can’t tell you. But I do know the Bible tells us we are given revelations according to the amount of faith we have. You've done a lot of posting about the unworthiness of people who don't believe in your trinity concept. The Savior didn't tell the man on the cross to depart from him. Not good stats to bet on.
|
|
|
Post by BobWilliston on Jan 7, 2020 17:33:22 GMT -5
But in the end it’s the Jewish God that reigns supreme, so the Bible says. He opened up salvation to the Gentiles only because the Jews had been so disobedient. It was to make them jealous. In Christ’s reign all will be together and there’ll be no Jew nor Gentile in Jerusalem. They’ll all be the saints of Christ. I’ve enjoyed listening to different Jews interpretation of the Messiah in a Jesus. They’ve put the IT right into the present day. Their God is trying to make them jealous!! Really! All powerful beings actually do that kind of thing? Wow, just wow. If I tried to say God intended to do something, I can imagine the screaming from a lot of quarters.
|
|
|
Post by BobWilliston on Jan 7, 2020 17:48:06 GMT -5
You do understand that the Muslims have the Jewish concept of God, and Christians have a Greek/Pagan concept of god. But there are as many kinds of Islam as there are of Christianity. Most of them think they are the only ones who have the right idea of what God is like. Maybe most people don't really know what the nature of god is -- they just go along with what they've been told. Most of them even have revelations from their own version of god, which probably explains why different peoples revelations conflict with each other. But in the end it’s the Jewish God that reigns supreme, so the Bible says. That's what the Old Testament says. That's not Jewish scripture. That's Catholic Church selective writings to support their adoptedGreek theology -- which the founding fathers confirmed. This comes from your ideological interpretation -- or personal revelation if you prefer. Your understanding is NOT Jewish from any age of history. Your Messianic Jewish informants have largely adopted the theology of Christian Methodists, and not Judaism. Also, I'm not into interpretations of end of world events -- anyone can make anything up they want from what the Bible says about it. Like the predictions of science fiction until the time comes.
|
|
|
Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 7, 2020 18:29:23 GMT -5
But in the end it’s the Jewish God that reigns supreme, so the Bible says. That's what the Old Testament says. That's not Jewish scripture. That's Catholic Church selective writings to support their adoptedGreek theology -- which the founding fathers confirmed. This comes from your ideological interpretation -- or personal revelation if you prefer. Your understanding is NOT Jewish from any age of history. Your Messianic Jewish informants have largely adopted the theology of Christian Methodists, and not Judaism. Also, I'm not into interpretations of end of world events -- anyone can make anything up they want from what the Bible says about it. Like the predictions of science fiction until the time comes. It’s in Moses’ song to testify against Israel. A prophecy. I’ve heard Jews speak of it. Btw, some of these Jews are using the OT history and have shown that this history has been repeated over and over again. I would think they’d understand that better then anyone. Deuteronomy 32:21 They have moved me to jealousy with THAT WHICH is not God; they have provoked me to anger with their vanities; and I will move “them to jealousy with THOSE WHICH ARE NOT A PEOPLE; I will provoke them to anger WITH A FOOLISH NATION.
|
|
|
Post by BobWilliston on Jan 7, 2020 18:32:56 GMT -5
That's what the Old Testament says. That's not Jewish scripture. That's Catholic Church selective writings to support their adoptedGreek theology -- which the founding fathers confirmed. This comes from your ideological interpretation -- or personal revelation if you prefer. Your understanding is NOT Jewish from any age of history. Your Messianic Jewish informants have largely adopted the theology of Christian Methodists, and not Judaism. Also, I'm not into interpretations of end of world events -- anyone can make anything up they want from what the Bible says about it. Like the predictions of science fiction until the time comes. It’s in Moses’ sing to testify against Israel. A prophecy. I’ve heard Jews speak of it. Deuteronomy 32:21 They have moved me to jealousy with THAT WHICH is not God; they have provoked me to anger with their vanities; and I will move “them to jealousy with THOSE WHICH ARE NOT A PEOPLE; I will provoke them to anger WITH A FOOLISH NATION. Fits well into Jewish theology. I can't imagine either Jesus or Paul saying such a thing.
|
|
|
Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 7, 2020 18:34:29 GMT -5
I’m not sure about that. It only makes sense though, that if we don’t know our Saviour can he not be justified in saying, “Depart from me, I never knew you.”? I know my question to God about revealing the concept to me was “if it is vital to my salvation.” So since he did reveal it, that seems to be the answer that it is vital to my salvation. But then I do admit that may not be true for everyone. But why I can’t tell you. But I do know the Bible tells us we are given revelations according to the amount of faith we have. You've done a lot of posting about the unworthiness of people who don't believe in your trinity concept. The Savior didn't tell the man on the cross to depart from him. Not good stats to bet on. You’ve completely misrepresented what I’ve said! What’s your beef!
|
|
|
Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 7, 2020 18:35:41 GMT -5
It’s in Moses’ sing to testify against Israel. A prophecy. I’ve heard Jews speak of it. Deuteronomy 32:21 They have moved me to jealousy with THAT WHICH is not God; they have provoked me to anger with their vanities; and I will move “them to jealousy with THOSE WHICH ARE NOT A PEOPLE; I will provoke them to anger WITH A FOOLISH NATION. Fits well into Jewish theology. I can't imagine either Jesus or Paul saying such a thing. THATS WHERE I GOT THAT GOD INTENDED TO MAke THEM JEALOUS But no! You had to put all that garbage in about Greek/Catholic etc. as if I don’t know what I’m talking about
|
|
|
Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 7, 2020 18:38:47 GMT -5
It’s in Moses’ sing to testify against Israel. A prophecy. I’ve heard Jews speak of it. Deuteronomy 32:21 They have moved me to jealousy with THAT WHICH is not God; they have provoked me to anger with their vanities; and I will move “them to jealousy with THOSE WHICH ARE NOT A PEOPLE; I will provoke them to anger WITH A FOOLISH NATION. Fits well into Jewish theology. I can't imagine either Jesus or Paul saying such a thing. You’re show a lot of not knowing Jesus. He came to fulfill all biblical prophecies and in dying for all sinners he did just exactly what Moses said God would do.
|
|
|
Post by sharingtheriches on Jan 7, 2020 18:47:19 GMT -5
I’m not sure about that. It only makes sense though, that if we don’t know our Saviour can he not be justified in saying, “Depart from me, I never knew you.”? I know my question to God about revealing the concept to me was “if it is vital to my salvation.” So since he did reveal it, that seems to be the answer that it is vital to my salvation. But then I do admit that may not be true for everyone. But why I can’t tell you. But I do know the Bible tells us we are given revelations according to the amount of faith we have. You've done a lot of posting about the unworthiness of people who don't believe in your trinity concept. The Savior didn't tell the man on the cross to depart from him. Not good stats to bet on. But there’s something about that thief you’ve failed to notice. His words to Jesus showed he clearly knew who Jesus was. He said, “Lord, remember me when THOU COMEST INTO THY KINGDOM.” He recognized the position that Jesus had in heaven. Just like Jesus told Pilate, “My kingdom is not of this world.” The thief understood clearly Jesus as God in his Royal Majesty.
|
|
|
Post by BobWilliston on Jan 7, 2020 18:52:13 GMT -5
You've done a lot of posting about the unworthiness of people who don't believe in your trinity concept. The Savior didn't tell the man on the cross to depart from him. Not good stats to bet on. You’ve completely misrepresented what I’ve said! What’s your beef! No beef. I'm just commenting on the distinct impression you leave with your certainty that the rest of us don't know enough to appreciate your spirituality.
|
|
|
Post by BobWilliston on Jan 7, 2020 18:57:50 GMT -5
Fits well into Jewish theology. I can't imagine either Jesus or Paul saying such a thing. THATS WHERE I GOT THAT GOD INTENDED TO MAke THEM JEALOUS But no! You had to put all that garbage in about Greek/Catholic etc. as if I don’t know what I’m talking about No. That's not where you got all that. You've been thoroughly and indoctrinated in Christian theology to the point where you treat it like the state of the cosmos. You know so little about the origins of your belief system. That's not an insult -- it's an extremely common situation with the vast majority of Christians. I'm sorry if this offends, but from a historical aspect it's all quite amateur.
|
|
|
Post by BobWilliston on Jan 7, 2020 19:04:58 GMT -5
Fits well into Jewish theology. I can't imagine either Jesus or Paul saying such a thing. You’re show a lot of not knowing Jesus. He came to fulfill all biblical prophecies and in dying for all sinners he did just exactly what Moses said God would do. It doesn't matter how much I know about Jesus. What I do know is that what you say about the NT fulfilling OT prophesies is absolutely, totally, exclusively, Christian doctrine and Christian fundamentalist theology. It explains zilch about any other understanding of the cosmos. I'm not the expert, but I know your limitations.
|
|
|
Post by BobWilliston on Jan 7, 2020 19:08:23 GMT -5
You've done a lot of posting about the unworthiness of people who don't believe in your trinity concept. The Savior didn't tell the man on the cross to depart from him. Not good stats to bet on. But there’s something about that thief you’ve failed to notice. His words to Jesus showed he clearly knew who Jesus was. He said, “Lord, remember me when THOU COMEST INTO THY KINGDOM.” He recognized the position that Jesus had in heaven. Just like Jesus told Pilate, “My kingdom is not of this world.” The thief understood clearly Jesus as God in his Royal Majesty. You've already interpreted/expanded what he is supposed to have said with good Christian spin -- it's the basis of all your anticipated revelation.
|
|
|
Post by speak on Jan 7, 2020 19:20:44 GMT -5
Man some of you people make some of the most ridiculous statements. Weird I must say. You do realize we are talking about some very weird people, don't you? Yes you.
|
|
|
Post by speak on Jan 7, 2020 19:22:44 GMT -5
Man some of you people make some of the most ridiculous statements. Weird I must say. Not at all weird. Many of the friends are in complete denial of the truth about the truth. Are you one of those? And so are you.
|
|
|
Post by BobWilliston on Jan 7, 2020 19:24:16 GMT -5
You do realize we are talking about some very weird people, don't you? Yes you. All relative.
|
|
|
Post by speak on Jan 7, 2020 19:24:27 GMT -5
The other night I was wondering about a certain subject and a voice sounded in my head read a certain chapter, I have never read that chapter before and would have never thought to read it. I found the answer to my wonderings. Also in dreams there come answers to things I have wondered about a good time ago. In reading, in meditating, in prayer and even in something someone has said. I am sorry that you have never heard the word of because you have such a wonderful glorious feeling. No I cannot prove to you that i have heard his voice within the proof you seek it is a thing that has to be experienced other than say I have. Many have believed the God of Abraham who have had no scripture who have been drawn by Him even the ones before Abraham, even the Kings in Daniels time. It doesn't require human intervention, when God has spoken to me it hasn't always been in preaching or from human hand but directly from Him. He certainly wasn't non-existent to me when I wasn't listening or attending, I was just like any other person who wasn't following Jesus. It is told in the Bible of times of disaster we have plenty of warning of what to expect and to be ready when our time comes. I cannot answer for what happened to you but there have been many who have waited for years but have been faithful in those times, take Cornelius Acts 10-11 to see such happened to him but he remained faithful to his belief. If it was in my own mind there wouldn't be any thought of God I can assure you of that. Gods thoughts and our thoughts are poles apart, they cannot be compared in way shape or form so your real, my real and Gods real are so completely different. Hope this is a help to you. How much warning did your god give you that the Chch earthquakes were going to happen? Why would He give specific warning about that? He has given general warning of things to come and time to be ready.
|
|