Cider
New Member
Posts: 2
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Post by Cider on Dec 1, 2019 16:23:55 GMT -5
Lately even before finding this site I’ve been making excuses to not go to meetings. I stress so much about finding something to speak on no matter how much I read every day. After finding this site and the history if the “truth” I am in shock and am more confused than ever. I left the truth at 16 and came back 2 years ago. Professed a year ago and still feel like I know nothing. I was led to believe this is the only way and many in my meeting speak of this and speak how glad that they’re no part of worldly churches. Workers speak of working for salvation and I’m not even sure how to work for it. Jon knockemous (idk how to spell his last name I know I butchered it) spoke in great length about Trinity and how it is all wrong when I was a little girl.I remember he had scripture to back it up I didn’t memorize which cause I was like 12 at the time. Gloria Edwards spoke of workers being apostles and those professing as disciples of Jesus. At the time it made perfect sense they were teachers of Christ. I am just finding out these things could very much not be true. I even have new questions like what is the Holy Spirit? I know it’s something to do with god and getting it if I have the right spirit but idk how to obtain it or what exactly it is. I live an hour away from every meeting and the only time I can meet with friends is if I drive an hour or more away. I’m left in the dark a lot idek which workers are in my area no worker has spoken since convention time. I live on military base so workers don’t stay which I understand due to the difficulty of getting passed to get on bases. Plus my husband doesn’t profess (married before coming back to meeting) and has a huge TV in living room which they wouldn’t appreciate. I truly feel confused and alone. I can’t speak to my parents of this I know they would worry of me “falling out” again after I had just came back to the fold. Idk why I’m posting I just want to share with someone who doesn’t know me and wouldn’t pass judgement on my salvation.
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Post by speak on Dec 1, 2019 16:32:06 GMT -5
Lately even before finding this site I’ve been making excuses to not go to meetings. I stress so much about finding something to speak on no matter how much I read every day. After finding this site and the history if the “truth” I am in shock and am more confused than ever. I left the truth at 16 and came back 2 years ago. Professed a year ago and still feel like I know nothing. I was led to believe this is the only way and many in my meeting speak of this and speak how glad that they’re no part of worldly churches. Workers speak of working for salvation and I’m not even sure how to work for it. Jon knockemous (idk how to spell his last name I know I butchered it) spoke in great length about Trinity and how it is all wrong when I was a little girl.I remember he had scripture to back it up I didn’t memorize which cause I was like 12 at the time. Gloria Edwards spoke of workers being apostles and those professing as disciples of Jesus. At the time it made perfect sense they were teachers of Christ. I am just finding out these things could very much not be true. I even have new questions like what is the Holy Spirit? I know it’s something to do with god and getting it if I have the right spirit but idk how to obtain it or what exactly it is. I live an hour away from every meeting and the only time I can meet with friends is if I drive an hour or more away. I’m left in the dark a lot idek which workers are in my area no worker has spoken since convention time. I live on military base so workers don’t stay which I understand due to the difficulty of getting passed to get on bases. Plus my husband doesn’t profess (married before coming back to meeting) and has a huge TV in living room which they wouldn’t appreciate. I truly feel confused and alone. I can’t speak to my parents of this I know they would worry of me “falling out” again after I had just came back to the fold. Idk why I’m posting I just want to share with someone who doesn’t know me and wouldn’t pass judgement on my salvation. Looks like you have not been on your knees enough? all the help you need is in Christ, if not asking for it it won't come. Don't worry God knows your heart. There are many in the fellowship who live in rural areas away from others but really God is a far better companion than any man.
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 1, 2019 16:39:25 GMT -5
Lately even before finding this site I’ve been making excuses to not go to meetings. I stress so much about finding something to speak on no matter how much I read every day. After finding this site and the history if the “truth” I am in shock and am more confused than ever. I left the truth at 16 and came back 2 years ago. Professed a year ago and still feel like I know nothing. I was led to believe this is the only way and many in my meeting speak of this and speak how glad that they’re no part of worldly churches. Workers speak of working for salvation and I’m not even sure how to work for it. Jon knockemous (idk how to spell his last name I know I butchered it) spoke in great length about Trinity and how it is all wrong when I was a little girl.I remember he had scripture to back it up I didn’t memorize which cause I was like 12 at the time. Gloria Edwards spoke of workers being apostles and those professing as disciples of Jesus. At the time it made perfect sense they were teachers of Christ. I am just finding out these things could very much not be true. I even have new questions like what is the Holy Spirit? I know it’s something to do with god and getting it if I have the right spirit but idk how to obtain it or what exactly it is. I live an hour away from every meeting and the only time I can meet with friends is if I drive an hour or more away. I’m left in the dark a lot idek which workers are in my area no worker has spoken since convention time. I live on military base so workers don’t stay which I understand due to the difficulty of getting passed to get on bases. Plus my husband doesn’t profess (married before coming back to meeting) and has a huge TV in living room which they wouldn’t appreciate. I truly feel confused and alone. I can’t speak to my parents of this I know they would worry of me “falling out” again after I had just came back to the fold. Idk why I’m posting I just want to share with someone who doesn’t know me and wouldn’t pass judgement on my salvation. Looks like you have not been on your knees enough? all the help you need is in Christ, if not asking for it it won't come. Don't worry God knows your heart. There are many in the fellowship who live in rural areas away from others but really God is a far better companion than any man. Praying is known to cause the military to relax security on their bases.
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Post by dmmichgood on Dec 1, 2019 16:48:59 GMT -5
Lately even before finding this site I’ve been making excuses to not go to meetings. I stress so much about finding something to speak on no matter how much I read every day. After finding this site and the history if the “truth” I am in shock and am more confused than ever. I left the truth at 16 and came back 2 years ago. Professed a year ago and still feel like I know nothing. I was led to believe this is the only way and many in my meeting speak of this and speak how glad that they’re no part of worldly churches. Workers speak of working for salvation and I’m not even sure how to work for it. Jon knockemous (idk how to spell his last name I know I butchered it) spoke in great length about Trinity and how it is all wrong when I was a little girl.I remember he had scripture to back it up I didn’t memorize which cause I was like 12 at the time. Gloria Edwards spoke of workers being apostles and those professing as disciples of Jesus. At the time it made perfect sense they were teachers of Christ. I am just finding out these things could very much not be true. I even have new questions like what is the Holy Spirit? I know it’s something to do with god and getting it if I have the right spirit but idk how to obtain it or what exactly it is. I live an hour away from every meeting and the only time I can meet with friends is if I drive an hour or more away. I’m left in the dark a lot idek which workers are in my area no worker has spoken since convention time. I live on military base so workers don’t stay which I understand due to the difficulty of getting passed to get on bases. Plus my husband doesn’t profess (married before coming back to meeting) and has a huge TV in living room which they wouldn’t appreciate. I truly feel confused and alone. I can’t speak to my parents of this I know they would worry of me “falling out” again after I had just came back to the fold. Idk why I’m posting I just want to share with someone who doesn’t know me and wouldn’t pass judgement on my salvation. Looks like you have not been on your knees enough? all the help you need is in Christ, if not asking for it it won't come. Don't worry God knows your heart. There are many in the fellowship who live in rural areas away from others but really God is a far better companion than any man. What a typical reaction from you, speak! Blame the person rather than addressing their plea for help!
Cider, -thank you for your post, welcome aboard. Please stay with us.
We are a diverse group and have many different opinions but hopeful you can find some help here. Please stay.
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Cider
New Member
Posts: 2
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Post by Cider on Dec 1, 2019 16:51:07 GMT -5
I know I need to pray about these things. I still have faith in God and hope I can one day have more understanding about these things. Thank you dmmichgood for your warm welcome!
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Post by reborn on Dec 1, 2019 16:56:55 GMT -5
You will! God will guide you into all truth. Keep asking him! You are on the right track!
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 1, 2019 16:59:03 GMT -5
I know I need to pray about these things. I still have faith in God and hope I can one day have more understanding about these things. Of course, you are right. But you aren't to blame for much of what you are wrestling with. It's a lot of things at once -- it can all be sorted out one matter at a time. In the meantime, trust that no one is responsible for what he/she does not understand. The moment one thinks he understands everything is the moment when he closes his mind to learning more.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2019 18:10:57 GMT -5
Lately even before finding this site I’ve been making excuses to not go to meetings. I stress so much about finding something to speak on no matter how much I read every day. After finding this site and the history if the “truth” I am in shock and am more confused than ever. I left the truth at 16 and came back 2 years ago. Professed a year ago and still feel like I know nothing. I was led to believe this is the only way and many in my meeting speak of this and speak how glad that they’re no part of worldly churches. Workers speak of working for salvation and I’m not even sure how to work for it. Jon knockemous (idk how to spell his last name I know I butchered it) spoke in great length about Trinity and how it is all wrong when I was a little girl.I remember he had scripture to back it up I didn’t memorize which cause I was like 12 at the time. Gloria Edwards spoke of workers being apostles and those professing as disciples of Jesus. At the time it made perfect sense they were teachers of Christ. I am just finding out these things could very much not be true. I even have new questions like what is the Holy Spirit? I know it’s something to do with god and getting it if I have the right spirit but idk how to obtain it or what exactly it is. I live an hour away from every meeting and the only time I can meet with friends is if I drive an hour or more away. I’m left in the dark a lot idek which workers are in my area no worker has spoken since convention time. I live on military base so workers don’t stay which I understand due to the difficulty of getting passed to get on bases. Plus my husband doesn’t profess (married before coming back to meeting) and has a huge TV in living room which they wouldn’t appreciate. I truly feel confused and alone. I can’t speak to my parents of this I know they would worry of me “falling out” again after I had just came back to the fold. Idk why I’m posting I just want to share with someone who doesn’t know me and wouldn’t pass judgement on my salvation. stay the course, be patient, grow where your planted read hebrews 11 and romans 8,9...going through the beatitudes in matthew 5.6.7 wouldn't be a bad idea either....
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Post by snow on Dec 1, 2019 19:38:46 GMT -5
Lately even before finding this site I’ve been making excuses to not go to meetings. I stress so much about finding something to speak on no matter how much I read every day. After finding this site and the history if the “truth” I am in shock and am more confused than ever. I left the truth at 16 and came back 2 years ago. Professed a year ago and still feel like I know nothing. I was led to believe this is the only way and many in my meeting speak of this and speak how glad that they’re no part of worldly churches. Workers speak of working for salvation and I’m not even sure how to work for it. Jon knockemous (idk how to spell his last name I know I butchered it) spoke in great length about Trinity and how it is all wrong when I was a little girl.I remember he had scripture to back it up I didn’t memorize which cause I was like 12 at the time. Gloria Edwards spoke of workers being apostles and those professing as disciples of Jesus. At the time it made perfect sense they were teachers of Christ. I am just finding out these things could very much not be true. I even have new questions like what is the Holy Spirit? I know it’s something to do with god and getting it if I have the right spirit but idk how to obtain it or what exactly it is. I live an hour away from every meeting and the only time I can meet with friends is if I drive an hour or more away. I’m left in the dark a lot idek which workers are in my area no worker has spoken since convention time. I live on military base so workers don’t stay which I understand due to the difficulty of getting passed to get on bases. Plus my husband doesn’t profess (married before coming back to meeting) and has a huge TV in living room which they wouldn’t appreciate. I truly feel confused and alone. I can’t speak to my parents of this I know they would worry of me “falling out” again after I had just came back to the fold. Idk why I’m posting I just want to share with someone who doesn’t know me and wouldn’t pass judgement on my salvation. Welcome. I'm sorry that you're going through this, but I am not surprised if you just found out about William Irvine and how the church started. When I joined here I didn't know anything about it and I hadn't professed for 40+ years, and it shocked me too. It made me really angry at first, mostly for my parents that had been in the group all their lives. I often wonder if they knew. I think you need to be patient with yourself and kind. It's a tough place to be and don't listen to those who say you're just not trying hard enough. That's just not a compassionate way to react to someone that is having a hard time. Hugs and I hope you stay. Many here have left but still believe in God. Some of us have left and are now atheists. So we are a diverse group and hopefully one of us can help you sort things out and give you some comfort.
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Post by sharingtheriches on Dec 1, 2019 19:56:38 GMT -5
I know I need to pray about these things. I still have faith in God and hope I can one day have more understanding about these things. Thank you dmmichgood for your warm welcome! Please don’t give up on God! I’ve left the group the second time, I’ve learned about the Trinity, I’ve learned so much more about the Bible since leaving the group the second time. I was like you indoctrinated to believe the group was the inly true church which Ive since learned is not so. They are a fairly new church of about 120 years old. We’d been lied to that they went all the way back to the shores of Galilee or were a continuation of the Acts of the Apostles. Which is not true. My advice is to search for a church nearby that is Christian based and see what you hear and feel there. It won’t hurt to try several different churches of different Christian denominations just to find a fit for yourself. There are churches in some areas have Bible Study Fellowships which are not based on any one denomination if you’re interested in that , PM me here on TMB and I’ll see if there is one close to you. This is a good way of learning more about the Bible.
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Post by speak on Dec 1, 2019 20:47:34 GMT -5
Looks like you have not been on your knees enough? all the help you need is in Christ, if not asking for it it won't come. Don't worry God knows your heart. There are many in the fellowship who live in rural areas away from others but really God is a far better companion than any man. Praying is known to cause the military to relax security on their bases. weird.
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Post by speak on Dec 1, 2019 20:49:04 GMT -5
Looks like you have not been on your knees enough? all the help you need is in Christ, if not asking for it it won't come. Don't worry God knows your heart. There are many in the fellowship who live in rural areas away from others but really God is a far better companion than any man. What a typical reaction from you, speak! Blame the person rather than addressing their plea for help!
Cider, -thank you for your post, welcome aboard. Please stay with us.
We are a diverse group and have many different opinions but hopeful you can find some help here. Please stay.
No blame was meant, but I see your usual weird response.
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Post by speak on Dec 1, 2019 21:01:12 GMT -5
Lately even before finding this site I’ve been making excuses to not go to meetings. I stress so much about finding something to speak on no matter how much I read every day. After finding this site and the history if the “truth” I am in shock and am more confused than ever. I left the truth at 16 and came back 2 years ago. Professed a year ago and still feel like I know nothing. I was led to believe this is the only way and many in my meeting speak of this and speak how glad that they’re no part of worldly churches. Workers speak of working for salvation and I’m not even sure how to work for it. Jon knockemous (idk how to spell his last name I know I butchered it) spoke in great length about Trinity and how it is all wrong when I was a little girl.I remember he had scripture to back it up I didn’t memorize which cause I was like 12 at the time. Gloria Edwards spoke of workers being apostles and those professing as disciples of Jesus. At the time it made perfect sense they were teachers of Christ. I am just finding out these things could very much not be true. I even have new questions like what is the Holy Spirit? I know it’s something to do with god and getting it if I have the right spirit but idk how to obtain it or what exactly it is. I live an hour away from every meeting and the only time I can meet with friends is if I drive an hour or more away. I’m left in the dark a lot idek which workers are in my area no worker has spoken since convention time. I live on military base so workers don’t stay which I understand due to the difficulty of getting passed to get on bases. Plus my husband doesn’t profess (married before coming back to meeting) and has a huge TV in living room which they wouldn’t appreciate. I truly feel confused and alone. I can’t speak to my parents of this I know they would worry of me “falling out” again after I had just came back to the fold. Idk why I’m posting I just want to share with someone who doesn’t know me and wouldn’t pass judgement on my salvation. You might enjoy this. Maimie The Eskimo Woman ( ALASKA ) This is the story of an Eskimo woman who lived far up in the Arctic. The Arctic Circle is determined in the world where, on June 22, the sun doesn't even set at all. North of that is Arctic, whether it is in Russia or Finland or Norway or Alaska, that is the circle. In the summer months the sun doesn't set and in the winter months you don't see the sun for weeks at a time. This woman was troubled about her salvation. She was living in a very remote spot and her closest neighbour on one side was 14 miles away, and on the other side 75 miles. At that place 2 people lived and at 14 miles distant 12 people lived, but no preacher and no church. She dreamed a dream and says it was more than a dream, like a trance. She walked and walked and was weary and got to where the light was and there was a door. As she approached the door, it opened a little way and a voice said, "What do you want?" and she said, "I want to come in." The message she got was, "Look at yourself, you are unclean, and no one unclean can come in." and the door quietly closed. She stood and beheld herself and saw that indeed she was very unclean, so she turned back wondering how she might be clean. It seemed that she was defiled, and she walked back from where the light seemed to be and went back into darkness. With this she began to be concerned and prayed. She didn't know how to serve God, so she thought perhaps if she quit her smoking (which she did and had a certain sense of well being). She wondered what else. Of course there was no church service to attend, so it came into her mind that she would let her hair grow. It seemed to her that that was in the will of God, and from that day to this she has never cut it. She knew nothing of ever hearing about that or reading it. This woman's husband's people had heard the Gospel but her husband has been away from home long. It was at this time, when the woman was concerned and had accomplished these things in her life, that the dying request of the man' s mother was that her son could hear the Gospel. There was some correspondence and we received a message, and we started corresponding with the Eskimo lady and her husband. It would take about a month and then we would receive a reply, because of the distance and because the mail only went in there once a week. At first they gave us an invitation to come, particularly the husband, and then when he found out we were serious in coming, he wrote a letter and told us not to come! He said, "We are poor candidates for Christianity. I am a very busy man. Maimie feels the need of being baptised, but she doesn't understand and it isn't worth your while in coming..." The letter was lost and I didn't know it was lost and so my companion and I made plans to go! We flew in a very small plane and just at the time of our going I had to go alone because my companion's father had died. So I went in on a Piper Cub, just a two person plane on skis. As soon as I arrived he said, "Did you get my last letter?" and I said yes. But he didn't tell me when the last letter was written and that the last letter he had written was lost. But the letter preceding that was the last letter I had received. He said, "It's a strange thing that you have come when you received my last letter." At the place where we received our mail, the snow would pile up as high as the mail box and by the spring of the year, which was probably about 5 months later, the sun melted the snow away from the mailbox - and there was that letter lying upon the ground telling us not to come! I have the confidence to believe that God is well able to hide a letter and that it might be kept as a witness that God was able to keep that letter from us, and then later that we also might see it as a confirmation. We had meetings every night after my companion arrived about a week later. It wasn't until he arrived that Maimie was assured that we were the very ones her mother had told her about. Her mother, who was an Eskimo of course, could neither read nor write English or her own language, but she had told Maimie that the time will come when the messengers of God will come two together. They will have no home of their own, neither will they charge for the Gospel, and will travel from place to place and Maimie believed that would happen. But that wasn't confirmed to her until my companion arrived after I had been there one week myself. God would make one family of all nations. The Eskimo people are very oriental. It would be very easy for them to migrate across the Bering Strait . That is a very narrow distance between Russia and Alaska. You could walk across in one day. It is frozen over 9 months of the year. It is 28 miles across. In 1909 workers first went to Alaska, and were there for 1909 and 1910 but they were very disheartened because of the conditions of the people. There was a family of friends who moved there in 1933 with the interest of having an open home. In 1933 Jack Carroll and a brother from New South Wales, Harold Gibson, went up there with the glorious Gospel. A little work was done and a few folks established. And since that time there has been a work continuing. There are 10 workers in that state and 2 conventions, about 800 miles apart. A small convention and a larger one at Anchorage about 600 people. Maimie's strong desire was that she might be cleansed so she would be ready to go where that bright light and that door were. As we were having meetings, Sunday came and it was our second Sunday there, and I asked them if they would like to have in the morning a little study of how the Christians met together on the first day of the week. They said they would like that so we had a little study of I Cor. 14, how one by one each would pray and testify, prophesy, singing hymns in the spirit and with the understanding. The next week, which would be our last week there, Sunday came and we asked them the night before if they would like to have a meeting. I knew we had talked about it and they said they would. Before this, one evening I said to them, "It is very possible that we are wasting our time here. We have been here nearly 2 weeks and it might be that you are getting an education about the Bible and about Christianity and if that is so we might as well leave because we don’t want to waste our own time or your time either. There will be a plane coming in 2 days and I am afraid that maybe all you are getting is a knowledge of the Bible." She quickly spoke up and said, "For the first time in my life I feel an inward feeling like I did from my father and mother. I have a family feeling for you men. It is altogether new, there is a warmth in me about you and the words you speak that I have never felt before." He also expressed a similar thought so we said, maybe this is entering your hearts and not just your heads, so we will stay another week." So that led us to have that Sunday am meeting. I said, Our brethren in Fairbanks (the closest church which would be a few 100 miles away) meet there at 10.30 am and we could meet with them at the same time before the Throne of Grace. We can pray for them and they can pray for us." They thought that would be good. She said I will get up a little earlier tomorrow so all will be in readiness." She usually got up at 4.30 so she got up at 3.30 this time. By the time the chairs were done and the dogs were fed and breakfast over everything was in readiness and 4 chairs in a circle in that little log house it was 7.30! 60 below zero is a very poor time to go for a walk and we were ready so we took our place in that little circle of 4 chairs. There wasn't a word said, not a sound made until 10.30. We were there 2 hours. I read the book of Romans part of Hebrews, and half of the hymn book! They were also reading scripture, meditating. I wouldn't recommend such a long period of time but on that particular occasion that was how it was. I don’t know if I have ever seen a person so overjoyed; her countenance was like the countenance of an angel. She was all aglow. She said, "All my days I have felt that God was unrighteous, that the only people who could worship God had to live where there was a church and a preacher. I didn't think that was right, that God would cause people who are isolated like we are, far away from a church building or a minister, to be excluded from worship." She said, "Today I knew that God is righteous and I have been wrong about this all my day. That we can worship in our own home without the church building and the minister." She was excited and thrilled to know the reality of that. That was a glorious day for us too. It became a mutual thing - her joy as well as her husband's was imparted to us also. We said it was necessary that we leave on Wednesday, and all Tuesday they were out looking for wolves. That was their occupation in the winter months, out flying in a little plane. He said to her, "It seems that we are not going to have very much help as soon as those men leave," she said, "I am confident that before they leave they will give us a little study of some kind of mid-week meeting. I am sure there will be some arrangements and they will give us a little outline of what to do in the mid-week and some maybe even oftener." They came back that Tuesday night and after supper I said, "Well, we are leaving in the morning and we would like to give you a little study list that we've got for Wednesday night meetings. She said "I was telling Errol about this, and maybe even another little study list." (We had one for Sunday night meetings) When men and women are childlike and trusting, God is well able to impart understanding aforetime to understand the way things would be. After some years Errol died and she was alone. There was a road put in but not open for the public. It was for large trucks only. Finally they opened the road and as soon as it was open I saw our chance to drive 600 miles the round trip. Fuel had to be taken too. We tried to let her know we were coming. Every night at 9 there is a news broadcast all through the Arctic for 15 minutes regarding a death or emergencies, or problems. They have no news papers or magazines. Maimie always retired early, so she didn't listen to it. Like I said she was up at 3 or 4 am, so went to bed by 6 or 7 p.m. This night she woke just at 9 pm which wasn't her custom to do! She thought well here I am awake I might as wall listen to that little Program "The news of the Arctic." She turned it on and the first message she heard was "Maimie at Creak, Stuart and Robert will be coming tomorrow". She turned it off and said, "God is well able to awaken me!" She hadn't listened to that program for several years! She didn't think it any great wonder. Felt God is well able to do things. We found after about 14 hours on the poor quality gravel road she had a tent pitched and 2 cots in for us and everything was just like the sister workers would have done it for us! She thought of everything for our comfort; it was like the finest Hotel to us, such gracious care. We regret we haven't opportunity to labour among the Eskimos as we'd like, distances are great. That man when he was alive would have opportunity most of the time to have flown us in that light plane, but it is very difficult to get there now. Maimie is now moved to Fairbanks, although she does spend 3 months of the year at that place still. We rejoice in the mighty way that God can open doors.
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Post by nathan on Dec 1, 2019 21:26:59 GMT -5
Lately even before finding this site I’ve been making excuses to not go to meetings. I stress so much about finding something to speak on no matter how much I read every day. After finding this site and the history if the “truth” I am in shock and am more confused than ever. I left the truth at 16 and came back 2 years ago. Professed a year ago and still feel like I know nothing. I was led to believe this is the only way and many in my meeting speak of this and speak how glad that they’re no part of worldly churches. Workers speak of working for salvation and I’m not even sure how to work for it. Jon knockemous (idk how to spell his last name I know I butchered it) spoke in great length about Trinity and how it is all wrong when I was a little girl.I remember he had scripture to back it up I didn’t memorize which cause I was like 12 at the time. Gloria Edwards spoke of workers being apostles and those professing as disciples of Jesus. At the time it made perfect sense they were teachers of Christ. I am just finding out these things could very much not be true. I even have new questions like what is the Holy Spirit? I know it’s something to do with god and getting it if I have the right spirit but idk how to obtain it or what exactly it is. I live an hour away from every meeting and the only time I can meet with friends is if I drive an hour or more away. I’m left in the dark a lot idek which workers are in my area no worker has spoken since convention time. I live on military base so workers don’t stay which I understand due to the difficulty of getting passed to get on bases. Plus my husband doesn’t profess (married before coming back to meeting) and has a huge TV in living room which they wouldn’t appreciate. I truly feel confused and alone. I can’t speak to my parents of this I know they would worry of me “falling out” again after I had just came back to the fold. Idk why I’m posting I just want to share with someone who doesn’t know me and wouldn’t pass judgement on my salvation. You will get all kinds of experiences from 2x2s, exes, ex-now become atheists. ALL have interesting experiences to share. Read and listen to what they have to say but DRAW NEAR to God on your KNEES and get your answers from Him, Christ and Holy Spirit as Speak and others mentioned in their posts. Once the Godhread revealed themselves to you in a personal way, you will NEVER want to forget! the experience and no man can deceive you again!
I asked God about the workers whether they are your servants or NOT. The history of the 2x2 and beyond William Irvine and the early days workers. The Trinity, Is Jesus God?.... and God has given me answers to these questions, sometimes a thought pop up in my mind, or by reading in the scriptures, or by reading someone's revelation.
Godspeed with your journey! If you have any questions please, feel free to ask.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2019 22:36:07 GMT -5
Cider can understand your confusion, we have all been in that same situation, it does take time to sort it all out. There is good help available now that we did not have available to us. That help is at questioningfriends.com. Very understanding people who have been in the same situation as yourself, and found a way through it. They mentor and give the help and support to get you back to having peace in your life. That is so important for your healthy wellbeing.
There is a lot of cut and thrust on TMB which is good fun, but can be a bit confusing when you first come to this forum. We are good friends and have great love and respect for each other. Some may get the wrong impression, we are a broad Church, it is not the place for the feint hearted.
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Post by dmmichgood on Dec 1, 2019 22:50:18 GMT -5
What a typical reaction from you, speak! Blame the person rather than addressing their plea for help!
Cider, -thank you for your post, welcome aboard. Please stay with us.
We are a diverse group and have many different opinions but hopeful you can find some help here. Please stay. No blame was meant, but I see your usual weird response. Speak! These were the very first words you answered to a young woman asking for help!
"Looks like you have not been on your knees enough?
If you "meant no blame," I wonder what you would consider "blame?" That kind of answer is so typical of how many people answer.
It does NOTHING to help and only adds an extra burden which makes the person feel like they aren't trying hard enough!
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Post by sunshine on Dec 1, 2019 23:09:23 GMT -5
Lately even before finding this site I’ve been making excuses to not go to meetings. I stress so much about finding something to speak on no matter how much I read every day. After finding this site and the history if the “truth” I am in shock and am more confused than ever. I left the truth at 16 and came back 2 years ago. Professed a year ago and still feel like I know nothing. I was led to believe this is the only way and many in my meeting speak of this and speak how glad that they’re no part of worldly churches. Workers speak of working for salvation and I’m not even sure how to work for it. Jon knockemous (idk how to spell his last name I know I butchered it) spoke in great length about Trinity and how it is all wrong when I was a little girl.I remember he had scripture to back it up I didn’t memorize which cause I was like 12 at the time. Gloria Edwards spoke of workers being apostles and those professing as disciples of Jesus. At the time it made perfect sense they were teachers of Christ. I am just finding out these things could very much not be true. I even have new questions like what is the Holy Spirit? I know it’s something to do with god and getting it if I have the right spirit but idk how to obtain it or what exactly it is. I live an hour away from every meeting and the only time I can meet with friends is if I drive an hour or more away. I’m left in the dark a lot idek which workers are in my area no worker has spoken since convention time. I live on military base so workers don’t stay which I understand due to the difficulty of getting passed to get on bases. Plus my husband doesn’t profess (married before coming back to meeting) and has a huge TV in living room which they wouldn’t appreciate. I truly feel confused and alone. I can’t speak to my parents of this I know they would worry of me “falling out” again after I had just came back to the fold. Idk why I’m posting I just want to share with someone who doesn’t know me and wouldn’t pass judgement on my salvation. 😊hi Hang in there. The most important thing is that you've accepted Christ as your Savior. Salvation is a gift from Christ, not something we have to work for. We then live our lives to honor God because of it. The light of God is the love that you show. No one is judging you on how many meetings you go to. They are just glad when you do make the effort to go all that way and show up to meet with other like-minded Christians. It helps feed our spiritual life to meet with others. Just read a few verses in meeting, and say whatever is in your heart, bring up the things that concern you and say you would like to understand it more. Everyone appreciates an honest open heartfelt testimony . Some people live even farther from meeting and only are able to get there once in a while. What matters more is your personal relationship with God. Yeah, there was some deception regarding the beginnings of the group, but the good outweighs the bad. Just stay close to God with reading, praying, and showing love to others. Thinking of you, Sunshine
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Post by speak on Dec 1, 2019 23:23:38 GMT -5
No blame was meant, but I see your usual weird response. Speak! These were the very first words you answered to a young woman asking for help!
"Looks like you have not been on your knees enough?
If you "meant no blame," I wonder what you would consider "blame?" That kind of answer is so typical of how many people answer.
It does NOTHING to help and only adds an extra burden which makes the person feel like they aren't trying hard enough! Take off your rose tinted glasses and see the question mar k.
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Post by dmmichgood on Dec 2, 2019 1:23:43 GMT -5
Speak! These were the very first words you answered to a young woman asking for help!
"Looks like you have not been on your knees enough?
If you "meant no blame," I wonder what you would consider "blame?" That kind of answer is so typical of how many people answer.
It does NOTHING to help and only adds an extra burden which makes the person feel like they aren't trying hard enough! Take off your rose tinted glasses and see the question mar k. I am not blind. My glasses are fine. And I did see the question mark. "Looks like you have not been on your knees enough? The "question mark," makes no difference when you have already made the statement, "Looks like you have not been on your knees enough?"
I have heard that old excuse made to people having problems or asking questions until it is nauseating! It stinks of sanctimony on the person making such a statement and demeaning to the person to whom it is addressed!
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Post by speak on Dec 2, 2019 2:36:00 GMT -5
Take off your rose tinted glasses and see the question mar k. I am not blind. My glasses are fine. And I did see the question mark. "Looks like you have not been on your knees enough? The "question mark," makes no difference when you have already made the statement, "Looks like you have not been on your knees enough?"
I have heard that old excuse made to people having problems or asking questions until it is nauseating! It stinks of sanctimony on the person making such a statement and demeaning to the person to whom it is addressed! Well you don't have to participate, nobody asked you to comment.
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Post by breakfree on Dec 2, 2019 3:34:10 GMT -5
I am not blind. My glasses are fine. And I did see the question mark. "Looks like you have not been on your knees enough? The "question mark," makes no difference when you have already made the statement, "Looks like you have not been on your knees enough?"
I have heard that old excuse made to people having problems or asking questions until it is nauseating! It stinks of sanctimony on the person making such a statement and demeaning to the person to whom it is addressed! Well you don't have to participate, nobody asked you to comment. Speak, I think you need to get on your knees more often ... Your response is typical 2x2 self righteousness...
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2019 4:05:07 GMT -5
The way this thread has progressed I think Cider would soon understand that we are a mixed bunch on TMB. We fight like cats and dogs, but at the end of the day we are still good friends. Bit like our happy marriage that has lasted more than 58 years. We always kiss each other good night.
It is a good thing to have a bit of variety. Makes life much more interesting, and expands our understanding. The one thing that I have learnt in my 80 years, it is much more important to learn how to think, not what to think.
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Post by ellie on Dec 2, 2019 6:45:28 GMT -5
Lately even before finding this site I’ve been making excuses to not go to meetings. I stress so much about finding something to speak on no matter how much I read every day. After finding this site and the history if the “truth” I am in shock and am more confused than ever. I left the truth at 16 and came back 2 years ago. Professed a year ago and still feel like I know nothing. I was led to believe this is the only way and many in my meeting speak of this and speak how glad that they’re no part of worldly churches. Workers speak of working for salvation and I’m not even sure how to work for it. Jon knockemous (idk how to spell his last name I know I butchered it) spoke in great length about Trinity and how it is all wrong when I was a little girl.I remember he had scripture to back it up I didn’t memorize which cause I was like 12 at the time. Gloria Edwards spoke of workers being apostles and those professing as disciples of Jesus. At the time it made perfect sense they were teachers of Christ. I am just finding out these things could very much not be true. I even have new questions like what is the Holy Spirit? I know it’s something to do with god and getting it if I have the right spirit but idk how to obtain it or what exactly it is. I live an hour away from every meeting and the only time I can meet with friends is if I drive an hour or more away. I’m left in the dark a lot idek which workers are in my area no worker has spoken since convention time. I live on military base so workers don’t stay which I understand due to the difficulty of getting passed to get on bases. Plus my husband doesn’t profess (married before coming back to meeting) and has a huge TV in living room which they wouldn’t appreciate. I truly feel confused and alone. I can’t speak to my parents of this I know they would worry of me “falling out” again after I had just came back to the fold. Idk why I’m posting I just want to share with someone who doesn’t know me and wouldn’t pass judgement on my salvation. Hello and welcome on board. I'm sorry that you had to find out about the history via the internet rather than friends or workers in person. Hope that it all works out and meetings become easier for you. If not, those on this forum have taken various life journeys and may advise you of options. None of us will know precisely what's best for you and sometimes it can take a bit of time to find our own path to contentment, but it's worth it in the end!
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Post by snow on Dec 2, 2019 14:04:42 GMT -5
Cider you mention that the reason you are avoiding meetings or wanting to is because you are finding it hard to know what to say in your testimony. I get that for sure. But one thing I do know also is that no matter who you are and what you might have to say and how much you might feel that what you have to say is irrelevant or not good enough, you never know when what you have to say is just the best thing for someone. We never know how our words are going to speak to someone. So I wouldn't be too concerned about what you say. Say if from the heart and with respect and you can bet that someone will value it because it speaks to them in a way you might never have guessed. Kids in meeting when they give their testimony used to be the ones I liked best when I was attending meetings, because they hadn't yet been indoctrinated as much and their testimonies were from the heart and fresh. So just speak of what speaks to you. It's not a competition.
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Post by SharonArnold on Dec 2, 2019 16:01:55 GMT -5
Lately even before finding this site I’ve been making excuses to not go to meetings. I stress so much about finding something to speak on no matter how much I read every day. After finding this site and the history if the “truth” I am in shock and am more confused than ever. I left the truth at 16 and came back 2 years ago. Professed a year ago and still feel like I know nothing. I was led to believe this is the only way and many in my meeting speak of this and speak how glad that they’re no part of worldly churches. Workers speak of working for salvation and I’m not even sure how to work for it. Jon knockemous (idk how to spell his last name I know I butchered it) spoke in great length about Trinity and how it is all wrong when I was a little girl.I remember he had scripture to back it up I didn’t memorize which cause I was like 12 at the time. Gloria Edwards spoke of workers being apostles and those professing as disciples of Jesus. At the time it made perfect sense they were teachers of Christ. I am just finding out these things could very much not be true. I even have new questions like what is the Holy Spirit? I know it’s something to do with god and getting it if I have the right spirit but idk how to obtain it or what exactly it is. I live an hour away from every meeting and the only time I can meet with friends is if I drive an hour or more away. I’m left in the dark a lot idek which workers are in my area no worker has spoken since convention time. I live on military base so workers don’t stay which I understand due to the difficulty of getting passed to get on bases. Plus my husband doesn’t profess (married before coming back to meeting) and has a huge TV in living room which they wouldn’t appreciate. I truly feel confused and alone. I can’t speak to my parents of this I know they would worry of me “falling out” again after I had just came back to the fold. Idk why I’m posting I just want to share with someone who doesn’t know me and wouldn’t pass judgement on my salvation. I was B&R, in many respects a true believer in 2X2ism, that gradually fell away to a more solid, sustaining (non-affiliated) sort of belief. I did not leave until age 36. In my exiting years, I found it increasingly difficult to find something to speak on in meeting - the honest expressions of my own heart were often in conflict with what was politically correct to say in meeting. I would first put things through the personally meaningful and significant filter, only to have them dissolve under the PC filter. In my exiting years, I (as often as I reasonably thought I could) made excuses to not go to Sunday morning meeting. For me, these were heady days of joy, of freedom, where i frequently escaped to go hiking in nearby mountains. God's church, if you will. Skimming this thread, I think ellie offers really good advice. There is no one-size-fits-all solution to these kinds of situations. I do not fault @wally's "bloom-where-you-are-planted" approach either, as I have seen it work for some people. Give yourself time. There is no rush. Be patient with yourself. Listen to the voice within.
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Post by dmmichgood on Dec 2, 2019 16:19:23 GMT -5
I am not blind. My glasses are fine. And I did see the question mark. The "question mark," makes no difference when you have already made the statement, "Looks like you have not been on your knees enough?"
I have heard that old excuse made to people having problems or asking questions until it is nauseating! It stinks of sanctimony on the person making such a statement and demeaning to the person to whom it is addressed! Well you don't have to participate, nobody asked you to comment. So, - speak, you think that I am going to just "walk on the other side of the road" and ignore someone who is asking for help while someone like yourself thinks it is going to actually "help" someone by telling them, "Looks like you have not been on your knees enough?"
What kind of person would stand by let that happen?
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Post by benar on Dec 2, 2019 17:56:06 GMT -5
Before fretting about how to achieve salvation, one should be encouraged to determine if there is actually anything to be saved from. Studying ABOUT the Bible, rather than just what it says is a worthwhile pursuit. You may just realise a huge sense of freedom and release when understanding it’s just another document created by men.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2019 18:35:02 GMT -5
Six things to consider if you are confused and still going to meetings.
1. Is the church you are involved with really and truly the only true way or is it just another mad cap man made religious sect that was founded in Ireland in the early 1900s and which caused controversy everywhere its preachers went until it took the decision to go underground and cover up its history?
2. Does the Holy Spirit really exist in reality and if it does why do those who claim to possess it behave no more ethically or morally than those who don’t? And if the Holy Spirit really does exist why is the history of the 2x2 church (and other Christian churches) littered with examples of workers engaged in all sorts of unethical and immoral behaviour? And based on the evidence does it make more sense to believe that workers (and priests and other religious leaders) are filled with something called the Holy Spirit or that they are not? Could it be that there really is no evidence whatsoever to support the existence of the Holy Spirit and that there are just good people and bad people in every walk of life?
3. Do you believe in the biblical God because the biblical God is the one true God or do you believe in the biblical God as a result of (a) where you were born, (b) when you were born, (c) who your parents were and (d) a pretty hefty dose of religious conditioning due to your particular family circumstances?
4. Is your experience of God something solely within you or is there actually any external evidence to support the existence of the God you believe in? Is it possible that the God you believe in is merely something that has been created in your head solely as a result of your upbringing and experiences? Could this explain why God never speaks audibly and why those who don’t believe in your God never hear him?
5. Does the God you believe in (and which you believe is all powerful, all loving, all caring and able to heal all ailments) really have the power to heal anything given that throughout the last thousand years of recorded human history there is not a single record of God every healing a lost leg, arm, hand, toe, finger, foot, thumb or ear? And is it possible that every healing that God IS claimed to have carried out has a perfectly rational alternative explanation begging the question does God really heal anything? And if he can’t even heal your missing toe do you think he can really save your soul?
6. Given that the resurrection and the ascension up Jesus to heaven completely contravene the laws of science and nature and given that Jesus said he be back soon and has still not returned after two thousand years, is it possible that the biblical story which you have been conditioned to believe as a truth is in fact just a myth? Is it possible that you have been duped into believing something that isn't true at all whether it is the 2x2 church, the bible or God himself? Matt10
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