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Post by mountain on Dec 1, 2019 17:46:52 GMT -5
It is very, very important that we know God if we are seeking to worship him. The Father requires us to worship him in spirit and truth, i.e. we must be born again from above with his Spirit and live by his word.
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Post by chuck on Dec 1, 2019 18:14:09 GMT -5
We don’t believe this do we? Since it was asked in the form of a question- the answer would have been yes I do in many a heart. It was not a question! The way it come across was a forcefull "We do not believe this and if You do you should change your mind!" It was arrogant, wolf in sheeps clothing!. Never heard anyone deny/challenge it the whole convention. =lots of wolves in sheeps clothing or lots of ignorant sheep or lots of brain washed sheep.
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Post by reborn on Dec 1, 2019 18:17:40 GMT -5
Yes- sadly I have heard/ seen this tried before. Doesn’t work though! The truth stands alone! I just pray for the person speaking- by name- that they would receive a revelation from God.
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Post by nathan on Dec 1, 2019 19:05:54 GMT -5
Actually, -in all the years that I was professing, I never even heard the word "trinity."
When I hear it now, -it just seems to me that all the hullabaloo for & against the idea is like trying to make a hurricane out of 'poot in the wind'! However, you still believed in the trinity and worshipped it, even though you didn't know it at the time! *** AMEN! Mountain.. That is what I try to convey. The 2x2 have NEVER use the terminology TRINITY as their Sunday morning But they WORSHIP the TRIUNE/TRINITY Godhead by their ACTIONS on EVERY Sunday morning gathering! And the early days 2x2 workers follow Christ/God Jesus 2x2 apostolic ministry and New Test. 1st day= Sunday worship pattern= Christ Passover gathering. The early days workers believed The Deity of Christ and He is God like unto the Father and the Holy Spirit.
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Post by sharingtheriches on Dec 1, 2019 19:46:04 GMT -5
It is incorrect to say all the workers NEVER believe the TRINITY and denied it. Many of the early 2x2 workers belief and teaching say the opposite to the current workers and friends. Most of The current workers and the friends have strayed from the teachings of Christ, the apostles and the early 2x2 workers.
If the current workers and the friends denied the TRINITY these days, THEN WHY, are the current workers and friends STILL having Sunday morning meeting every Sunday around the world for 120 yrs? Who do they WORSHIP? when they sing hymns, pray, and give thanks to in their Sunday morning meeting?
RossB wrote: Nate - if the first workers didn't believe in the Trinity there is ABSOLUTELY NO WAY they would have included the last verse of "Our blest Redeemer" in the first Go-Preachers hymn book of 1909.
First and last verses of the hymn: 1 Our blest Redeemer, ere He breathed His tender, last farewell, A Guide, a Comforter bequeathed With us to dwell. 6 O praise the Father; praise the Son: Blest Spirit, praise to Thee: All praise to God, the three in One, The One in Thee.If most of them didn't believe in the Trinity in 1951 the "Cease not to praise God would not have been included". But between 1951 belief in God as the Father, Son and Holy Spirit diminished as the early workers died out and by 1987 the vast, vast majority had elevated Jesus' humanity at the expense of His divinity."Cease not to praise God" was dumped and "Christ, my God" was changed to "Christ, my Lord" in the hymn we know well. And not surprisingly from the mid 1980's the group has been in serious decline - people are not only leaving because of major deceitfulness over the history of the group but because of poor doctrine. While the early workers differentiated themselves from established churches and ministers on Matt 10, the claim to apostleship, baptism, "Jesus was a common man" they accepted core Christian doctrine including the Trinity. There was absolutely no issue with it. When these early days workers leaders died out and were replaced by others, belief in the one God as Father, Son and Holy Spirit was gradually abandoned, as evidenced by the change in hymns between the 1951 and 1987 books. Barry Barkley the overseer back east coast is clearly trying to address this issue in 2015. If the 2x2 church can't get basic doctrine right on who Jesus is, there is not much hope for it in my opinion. Elizabethcoleman said: 9/1/2015 This might do a few heads in: I have this from a recent convention attendee...
"Barry Barkley (Overseer of overseers in the east coast of USA) emphasized that Jesus was fully God but came to earth to become human to enable the lowly sinners such as ourselves to be justified through Him and be with Him in heaven. Barry spoke of the relationship between "God the Father and God the Son." He tied Psalm 22 -- the prophesied words and experience of Jesus -- with passages in the New Testament. These thoughts, perhaps, are nothing "new" to the Bible-believing Christian, but I appreciated the spirit and illumination with which Barry presented elements of our hope in the gospel -- and our need and joyous privilege to make Christ the focal point of all our living." Elizabeth wrote: If you now have workers talking this way about God the Son, and Jesus being fully God, where does that leave F&W who strenuously oppose these "doctrines"? Nathan your Zeal is clouding your mind. Re read the question. Roslyn: "Who has heard?" Me: "Never" I have never hear this and I have always! heard it denied by workers and deeply rooted friends. It is what the 2x2 beleive/denied as long as I have been able to remembered. I did not say the early workers never said this!. Trinity was very much a “we do not talk about it” issue as far back as fall of 1953.
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Post by Roselyn T on Dec 2, 2019 2:50:00 GMT -5
Thank you all for your replies.
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Post by nathan on Dec 2, 2019 10:02:09 GMT -5
Nathan your Zeal is clouding your mind. Re read the question. Roslyn: "Who has heard?" Me: "Never" I have never hear this and I have always! heard it denied by workers and deeply rooted friends. It is what the 2x2 beleive/denied as long as I have been able to remembered. I did not say the early workers never said this!. Trinity was very much a “we do not talk about it” issue as far back as fall of 1953. BUT the current 2x2 workers and the friends Sunday morning WORSHIP is based on the TRINITY- God the Father, Christ/God our Redeemer/Savior and Holy Spirit concept for over 120 yrs. The workers who are anti-Trinity through the years, don't like to use the word TRINITY because they have a false or lack in understanding and history of the TRINITY.
If it quacks and looks like a DUCK! it is a Duck even you don't like to use the word Duck!
Dan Hilton, a senior worker in Calf. and Washington state had been preaching and teaching for years! to his younger companions and the friends. The word Trinity is not found in the Bible. It is a Catholic doctrine that wasn't even mentioned by the early Christians. It wasn't heard of until the second century. [Washington 1985]
Dan Hilton
Beware of the devilish doctrine of the Trinity. [Manhattan MT Conv 1996]
Who is Jesus Christ??? -- According to Willis Propp!!! April 12, 1992
Question from Dale - OK, may I ask you this question tonight? Now, that is one of the basic fundamentals that you believe that we have to understand, because there are other Jesus' and if we believe that “Jesus was God” that would be incorrect?
The reply from Willis Propp, (“Head Worker” of the Province of Alberta, Canada) in his own words.
Reply from Willis - The Catholics think they're one person, like the rosary prayer is holy Mary mother of God, holy Mary mother of God, and that is wrong because Jesus is not God. Jesus was the Son of God. John 8 says, I proceeded forth and came from God, I proceeded forth from God so He was the only begotten Son of the Father. He wasn't God, He was the Son of God.
Reply from Willis - Yes, if you look at the original of John 1:1 it says he was a god. He was divine. You cannot reconcile a father and a son as one person, you can’t do that.
- - -COMMENT- - -
Comment: Son of God – son of man Mr. Propp states “He (Jesus) wasn't God, He was the Son of God.”
So, let us reason together: If a man has a son, is that son any less human than his father? NO! If the Father (who is God) has a Son, is that Son any less God than His Father? NO!
Another Comment: God plus a god? Mr. Propp states, “…if you look at the original of John 1:1, it says he was a god.”
~~ NathanB: Reading Willis P. answers who is Jesus Christ? He doesn't have a complete picture of Who Jesus is. The word God/Elohim is plural (Father, Son and Holy Spirit). The word God/Elohim refers to the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. The RCC does NOT teach the Father and the Son are ONE person, that is Oneness Pentecostal church belief. The Father God/El is Singular. Christ is God/EL also. Both speaking together = the Word God/Elohim becomes Plural.
Willis P. does NOT know or understand what the doctrine of the Trinity is. Jesus was NOT a (small g) god. He was God like His Father.
~~ Once the workers and friends became Anti-Trinity and Anti Jesus is NOT God they RUN into a lot of problems! their understanding is only half-truth in understanding WHO Jesus was and is. The current workers gospel is watered down Jesus, the son of man and divine but NOT God. Therefore, their gospel message is WEAKEN! and NOT so powerful when they LEFT Jesus is NOT God out of it.
Just like having a Nice Mercedes car with a half-dead battery!
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Post by nathan on Dec 2, 2019 10:19:03 GMT -5
Actually, -in all the years that I was professing, I never even heard the word "trinity."
When I hear it now, -it just seems to me that all the hullabaloo for & against the idea is like trying to make a hurricane out of 'poot in the wind'! However, you still believed in the TRINITY and worshiped it, even though you didn't know it at the time! Amen, Mountain. I agree, MOST of the workers and friends Worshiped the TRINITY in Sunday morning meetings and in their lives without KNOWING and UNDERSTANDING it for years.
~~ an ex-2x2 wrote in 8/3/2017 on TMB.
The ex wrote: I have an e-mail from Barb Hofer/Worker from Oregon, when I was writing back and forth to her and she put in writing that yes what I was revealed on my own through the holy spirit she also agrees with on the topic of who God is. One God who consists of 3 individual entities the father, the son, the holy spirit. She told me many friends don't get it but to not stop worshiping in spirit and in truth.
I couldn't sit around the emblems with a people who worship Jesus, yet claim that he isn't God and we know that our Bible tells us to only worship one God so it contradicted itself when everyone was worshiping Jesus. They didn't get it and they didn't put Jesus in his fullness. meeting goers claim that it's the same everywhere. Doctrine is not sound when they're not even on the same page though and it was so saddening to me.
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Post by sharingtheriches on Dec 2, 2019 11:14:34 GMT -5
Trinity was very much a “we do not talk about it” issue as far back as fall of 1953. BUT the current 2x2 workers and the friends Sunday morning WORSHIP is based on the TRINITY- God the Father, Christ/God our Redeemer/Savior and Holy Spirit concept for over 120 yrs. The workers who are anti-Trinity through the years, don't like to use the word TRINITY because they have a false or lack in understanding and history of the TRINITY.
If it quacks and looks like a DUCK! it is a Duck even you don't like to use the word Duck!
Dan Hilton, a senior worker in Calf. and Washington state had been preaching and teaching for years! to his younger companions and the friends. The word Trinity is not found in the Bible. It is a Catholic doctrine that wasn't even mentioned by the early Christians. It wasn't heard of until the second century. [Washington 1985]
Dan Hilton
Beware of the devilish doctrine of the Trinity. [Manhattan MT Conv 1996]
Who is Jesus Christ??? -- According to Willis Propp!!! April 12, 1992
Question from Dale - OK, may I ask you this question tonight? Now, that is one of the basic fundamentals that you believe that we have to understand, because there are other Jesus' and if we believe that “Jesus was God” that would be incorrect?
The reply from Willis Propp, (“Head Worker” of the Province of Alberta, Canada) in his own words.
Reply from Willis - The Catholics think they're one person, like the rosary prayer is holy Mary mother of God, holy Mary mother of God, and that is wrong because Jesus is not God. Jesus was the Son of God. John 8 says, I proceeded forth and came from God, I proceeded forth from God so He was the only begotten Son of the Father. He wasn't God, He was the Son of God.
Reply from Willis - Yes, if you look at the original of John 1:1 it says he was a god. He was divine. You cannot reconcile a father and a son as one person, you can’t do that.
- - -COMMENT- - -
Comment: Son of God – son of man Mr. Propp states “He (Jesus) wasn't God, He was the Son of God.”
So, let us reason together: If a man has a son, is that son any less human than his father? NO! If the Father (who is God) has a Son, is that Son any less God than His Father? NO!
Another Comment: God plus a god? Mr. Propp states, “…if you look at the original of John 1:1, it says he was a god.”
~~ NathanB: Reading Willis P. answers who is Jesus Christ? He doesn't have a complete picture of Who Jesus is. The word God/Elohim is plural (Father, Son and Holy Spirit). The word God/Elohim refers to the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. The RCC does NOT teach the Father and the Son are ONE person, that is Oneness Pentecostal church belief. The Father God/El is Singular. Christ is God/EL also. Both speaking together = the Word God/Elohim becomes Plural.
Willis P. does NOT know or understand what the doctrine of the Trinity is. Jesus was NOT a (small g) god. He was God like His Father.
~~ Once the workers and friends became Anti-Trinity and Anti Jesus is NOT God they RUN into a lot of problems! their understanding is only half-truth in understanding WHO Jesus was and is. The current workers gospel is watered down Jesus, the son of man and divine but NOT God. Therefore, their gospel message is WEAKEN! and NOT so powerful when they LEFT Jesus is NOT God out of it.
Just like having a Nice Mercedes car with a half-dead battery!
I’m afraid that battery is completely dead, because they’re going no where. It’s like when they started fighting the Trinity they became blinded for they sure don’t know what they’re doing every Sunday morning, if they did they’d eliminate that as well just to claim to be different then other churches. They really have no business claiming Christian status.
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Post by nathan on Dec 2, 2019 13:00:11 GMT -5
BUT the current 2x2 workers and the friends Sunday morning WORSHIP is based on the TRINITY- God the Father, Christ/God our Redeemer/Savior and Holy Spirit concept for over 120 yrs. The workers who are anti-Trinity through the years, don't like to use the word TRINITY because they have a false or lack in understanding and history of the TRINITY.
If it quacks and looks like a DUCK! it is a Duck even you don't like to use the word Duck!
Dan Hilton, a senior worker in Calf. and Washington state had been preaching and teaching for years! to his younger companions and the friends. The word Trinity is not found in the Bible. It is a Catholic doctrine that wasn't even mentioned by the early Christians. It wasn't heard of until the second century. [Washington 1985]
Dan Hilton
Beware of the devilish doctrine of the Trinity. [Manhattan MT Conv 1996]
Who is Jesus Christ??? -- According to Willis Propp!!! April 12, 1992
Question from Dale - OK, may I ask you this question tonight? Now, that is one of the basic fundamentals that you believe that we have to understand, because there are other Jesus' and if we believe that “Jesus was God” that would be incorrect?
The reply from Willis Propp, (“Head Worker” of the Province of Alberta, Canada) in his own words.
Reply from Willis - The Catholics think they're one person, like the rosary prayer is holy Mary mother of God, holy Mary mother of God, and that is wrong because Jesus is not God. Jesus was the Son of God. John 8 says, I proceeded forth and came from God, I proceeded forth from God so He was the only begotten Son of the Father. He wasn't God, He was the Son of God.
Reply from Willis - Yes, if you look at the original of John 1:1 it says he was a god. He was divine. You cannot reconcile a father and a son as one person, you can’t do that.
- - -COMMENT- - -
Comment: Son of God – son of man Mr. Propp states “He (Jesus) wasn't God, He was the Son of God.”
So, let us reason together: If a man has a son, is that son any less human than his father? NO! If the Father (who is God) has a Son, is that Son any less God than His Father? NO!
Another Comment: God plus a god? Mr. Propp states, “…if you look at the original of John 1:1, it says he was a god.”
~~ NathanB: Reading Willis P. answers who is Jesus Christ? He doesn't have a complete picture of Who Jesus is. The word God/Elohim is plural (Father, Son and Holy Spirit). The word God/Elohim refers to the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. The RCC does NOT teach the Father and the Son are ONE person, that is Oneness Pentecostal church belief. The Father God/El is Singular. Christ is God/EL also. Both speaking together = the Word God/Elohim becomes Plural.
Willis P. does NOT know or understand what the doctrine of the Trinity is. Jesus was NOT a (small g) god. He was God like His Father.
~~ Once the workers and friends became Anti-Trinity and Anti Jesus is NOT God they RUN into a lot of problems! their understanding is only half-truth in understanding WHO Jesus was and is. The current workers gospel is watered down Jesus, the son of man and divine but NOT God. Therefore, their gospel message is WEAKEN! and NOT so powerful when they LEFT Jesus is NOT God out of it.
Just like having a Nice Mercedes car with a half-dead battery!
I’m afraid that battery is completely dead, because they’re going no where. It’s like when they started fighting the Trinity they became blinded for they sure don’t know what they’re doing every Sunday morning, if they did they’d eliminate that as well just to claim to be different then other churches. They really have no business claiming Christian status. *** No, is NOT completely DEAD. They still believe Jesus the Son of God as their Redeemer and Savior. They still have the Sunday Trinity worship gathering in remembrance of Jesus life, death and surrection. They still believe Jesus 2x2 apostolic/workers ministry and fellowship/worship the Trinity/Godhead. All they need to do is change their belief and thinking back to the early days workers teachings and belief in the Trinity/Triune One Godhead; Jesus is God like unto His Father and Holy Spirit. Then they are FINE!
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Post by snow on Dec 2, 2019 18:57:08 GMT -5
. They really have no business claiming Christian status. Umm isn't that a bit exclusive? Just because they don't happen to believe like you I mean?
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Post by sharingtheriches on Dec 2, 2019 19:14:20 GMT -5
. They really have no business claiming Christian status. Umm isn't that a bit exclusive? Just because they don't happen to believe like you I mean? If they don’t believe in Jesus Christ why would they want to claim Christianity
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Post by snow on Dec 2, 2019 19:28:40 GMT -5
Umm isn't that a bit exclusive? Just because they don't happen to believe like you I mean? If they don’t believe in Jesus Christ why would they want to claim Christianity But they do believe in Jesus Christ. Everyone I went to meeting did believed in Jesus Christ. Your understanding differs from their's but to say they don't believe in Jesus Christ is not true.
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Post by nathan on Dec 2, 2019 20:14:32 GMT -5
If they don’t believe in Jesus Christ why would they want to claim Christianity But they do believe in Jesus Christ. Everyone I went to meeting did believed in Jesus Christ. Your understanding differs from their's but to say they don't believe in Jesus Christ is not true. ** I agree with you on this the workers and the friends believe and confess Jesus Christ as their Redeemer and Savior. Most of The current workers and friends don't fully understand or believe the doctrine of the Trinity or Jesus is God. Therfore, their thinking is off the tracks for NOT fully comprehend Jesus is BOTH Christ/God and Man/Jesus.
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Post by sharingtheriches on Dec 2, 2019 20:28:27 GMT -5
If they don’t believe in Jesus Christ why would they want to claim Christianity But they do believe in Jesus Christ. Everyone I went to meeting did believed in Jesus Christ. Your understanding differs from their's but to say they don't believe in Jesus Christ is not true. They believe in the man Jesus. If and when they say Jesus Christ they have no idea of what that means. That’s what I’m talking about to Nathan. They go through a form of worshipping Jesus as their Saviour, but they don’t realize they are worshipping him for if they believed the Bible that only God can be worshipped, then they are heaping damnation upon their own heads to be worshipping Jesus as only a perfect man!
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Post by nathan on Dec 2, 2019 20:37:49 GMT -5
But they do believe in Jesus Christ. Everyone I went to meeting did believed in Jesus Christ. Your understanding differs from their's but to say they don't believe in Jesus Christ is not true. They believe in the man Jesus. If and when they say Jesus Christ they have no idea of what that means. That’s what I’m talking about to Nathan. They go through a form of worshipping Jesus as their Saviour, but they don’t realize they are worshipping him for if they believed the Bible that only God can be worshipped, then they are heaping damnation upon their own heads to be worshipping Jesus as only a perfect man! ** The current workers got the preaching Jesus the Son of man dowm 100% correct. Now, they need to study the other side of Jesus the ETERNAL Christ/God the Co-Creator with God the Father of ALL things in the universe. Then, the 2x2 workers and the friends have the most glorious and awesome gospel to preach to the whole world.
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Post by Roselyn T on Dec 2, 2019 20:44:02 GMT -5
They believe in the man Jesus. If and when they say Jesus Christ they have no idea of what that means. That’s what I’m talking about to Nathan. They go through a form of worshipping Jesus as their Saviour, but they don’t realize they are worshipping him for if they believed the Bible that only God can be worshipped, then they are heaping damnation upon their own heads to be worshipping Jesus as only a perfect man! ** The current workers got the preaching Jesus the Son of man dowm 100% correct. Now, they need to study the other side of Jesus the ETERNAL Christ/God the Co-Creator with God the Father of ALL things in the universe. Then, the 2x2 workers and the friends have the most glorious and awesome gospel to preach to the whole world. According to the "Church of nathan" !!!
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Post by sharingtheriches on Dec 2, 2019 20:54:24 GMT -5
They believe in the man Jesus. If and when they say Jesus Christ they have no idea of what that means. That’s what I’m talking about to Nathan. They go through a form of worshipping Jesus as their Saviour, but they don’t realize they are worshipping him for if they believed the Bible that only God can be worshipped, then they are heaping damnation upon their own heads to be worshipping Jesus as only a perfect man! ** The current workers got the preaching Jesus the Son of man dowm 100% correct. Now, they need to study the other side of Jesus the ETERNAL Christ/God the Co-Creator with God the Father of ALL things in the universe. Then, the 2x2 workers and the friends have the most glorious and awesome gospel to preach to the whole world. But a part of the gospel isn’t the truth.
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Post by nathan on Dec 2, 2019 21:07:22 GMT -5
** The current workers got the preaching Jesus the Son of man dowm 100% correct. Now, they need to study the other side of Jesus the ETERNAL Christ/God the Co-Creator with God the Father of ALL things in the universe. Then, the 2x2 workers and the friends have the most glorious and awesome gospel to preach to the whole world. But a part of the gospel isn’t the truth. Tell me which church/ denomination has the Whole or 100% gospel? None today. They are so diluted and water down gospel or half-truth. The only group I think came close to 100% gospel were the 1914-1960s 2x2 workers.
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Post by sharingtheriches on Dec 2, 2019 21:44:45 GMT -5
But a part of the gospel isn’t the truth. Tell me which church/ denomination has the Whole or 100% gospel? None today. They are so diluted and water down gospel or half-truth. The only group I think came close to 100% gospel were the 1914-1960s 2x2 workers. There are several preach the God the Son, Jesus Christ our Saviour gospel. They don’t spend time belaboring a manner of ministry which is NOT a part of the gospel. The reason preaching was so stressed in bible days and first centuries churches was because there were no individual bibles. There was no others way for the gospel truth to be spoken but when the Bible were translated off the scrolls and made into individual bibles, then preaching became a much less necessary ubtridyction if biblical scriptures. It wasn’t until 1454 the Gutenberg Bible was available and then 1611 when the first Holy Bible was printed. So for 1600 years preaching was the source of the gospel’s spread. By that time several Christian denominations had churches in various countries. In 230 AD St. George’s church was built and recognized as the church of the 70 disciples of Christ who fled in 70 AD when Nero persecuted the Christians in Jerusalem and to Rome.
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Post by Grant on Dec 2, 2019 21:59:26 GMT -5
But a part of the gospel isn’t the truth. Tell me which church/ denomination has the Whole or 100% gospel? None today. They are so diluted and water down gospel or half-truth. The only group I think came close to 100% gospel were the 1914-1960s 2x2 workers. The majority of denominations preach the true Gospel. The Gospel is that Christ died on the Cross for our sins, and rose again the 3rd day. The Gospel is not a method of preaching. If you believe the Bible then it says, Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever, so why have the workers changed their understanding of who Jesus is? Many would say that Jesus is part of God is an important part of the Gospel message so are the workers preaching the true Gospel. The Gospel is the message not a method. The message is about Jesus, the method is about men. What Jesus has done for us, not what the workers do for us. Think about who you're giving the glory to.
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Post by nathan on Dec 2, 2019 22:47:58 GMT -5
Tell me which church/ denomination has the Whole or 100% gospel? None today. They are so diluted and water down gospel or half-truth. The only group I think came close to 100% gospel were the 1914-1960s 2x2 workers. The majority of denominations preach the true Gospel. The Gospel is that Christ died on the Cross for our sins, and rose again the 3rd day. The Gospel is not a method of preaching. Majority of Protestant denomination do NOT preach the True or full gospel of Jesus Christ. The majority do NOT teach Jesus and the apostles New Testament church FULL gospel! You and the majority are believing in the tradition and ideas of men methods ministry of the RCC and Protestants. If you believe the Bible then it says, Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever, so why have the workers changed their understanding of who Jesus is? Many would say that Jesus is part of God is an important part of the Gospel message so are the workers preaching the true Gospel. There were false teachers/apostles among us lead many friends astray with their own ideas about the Trinity is heresy! Pagans doctrine and Jesus is NOT God doctrine. Hopefully, there are men and women full of the Holy Spirit will lead us/2x2 back to the RIGHT PATH on the TRINITY, Jesus is God like unto the Father glorious and awesome gospel.
The Gospel is the message not a method. The message is about Jesus, the method is about men. What Jesus has done for us, not what the workers do for us. Think about who you're giving the glory to. The True gospel is Jesus the Christ/God and His New Testament/apostolic ministry and His people come together to Pray, sing hymns of praises, adoration and to WORSHIP the TRINITY= God the Father, Christ/our LORD God Savior and Holy Spirit... That is TRUE worship in the Spirit and in TRUTH the Godhead.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2019 0:41:03 GMT -5
Tell me which church/ denomination has the Whole or 100% gospel? None today. They are so diluted and water down gospel or half-truth. The only group I think came close to 100% gospel were the 1914-1960s 2x2 workers. The majority of denominations preach the true Gospel. The Gospel is that Christ died on the Cross for our sins, and rose again the 3rd day. The Gospel is not a method of preaching. If you believe the Bible then it says, Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever, so why have the workers changed their understanding of who Jesus is? Many would say that Jesus is part of God is an important part of the Gospel message so are the workers preaching the true Gospel. The Gospel is the message not a method. The message is about Jesus, the method is about men. What Jesus has done for us, not what the workers do for us. Think about who you're giving the glory to. what do you think come follow me means? it certainly doesn't mean follow me and do your own thing...it means follow me and do as i do or a method....
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Post by nathan on Dec 3, 2019 1:12:27 GMT -5
The majority of denominations preach the true Gospel. The Gospel is that Christ died on the Cross for our sins, and rose again the 3rd day. The Gospel is not a method of preaching. If you believe the Bible then it says, Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever, so why have the workers changed their understanding of who Jesus is? Many would say that Jesus is part of God is an important part of the Gospel message so are the workers preaching the true Gospel. The Gospel is the message not a method. The message is about Jesus, the method is about men. What Jesus has done for us, not what the workers do for us. Think about who you're giving the glory to. what do you think come follow me means? it certainly doesn't mean follow me and do your own thing...it means follow me and do as i do or a method.... Amen, Wally... Those kind of believers are like unto the Tares look like the Wheat but it has the RIGHT Stuff on the inside. LOVE Jesus with their mouths but they don't want to follow the method he asked them. They follow their own method and do whatever they believe is best for them. Enuff is like a Pharisee who said I believe God but don't want to believe and follow in Jesus the Son of God teachings. Enuff like the gift but hate/dislike the wrapping paper, the box and the postage stamp come with it. Without the package, box and the stamp there is no gift/Salvation to receive.
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Post by Grant on Dec 3, 2019 1:48:09 GMT -5
The majority of denominations preach the true Gospel. The Gospel is that Christ died on the Cross for our sins, and rose again the 3rd day. The Gospel is not a method of preaching. If you believe the Bible then it says, Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever, so why have the workers changed their understanding of who Jesus is? Many would say that Jesus is part of God is an important part of the Gospel message so are the workers preaching the true Gospel. The Gospel is the message not a method. The message is about Jesus, the method is about men. What Jesus has done for us, not what the workers do for us. Think about who you're giving the glory to. what do you think come follow me means? it certainly doesn't mean follow me and do your own thing...it means follow me and do as i do or a method.... Christians do not say that they can do their own thing any more than those in meetings. If you mean becoming legalistic and following man made dress codes like the pharisees then no that is not what following Jesus means. The mark of a Christian is the fruit of the spirit as opposed to the works of the flesh. It is not becoming like a pharisee.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2019 1:58:06 GMT -5
what do you think come follow me means? it certainly doesn't mean follow me and do your own thing...it means follow me and do as i do or a method.... Christians do not say that they can do their own thing any more than those in meetings. If you mean becoming legalistic and following man made dress codes like the pharisees then no that is not what following Jesus means. The mark of a Christian is the fruit of the spirit as opposed to the works of the flesh. It is not becoming like a pharisee. Christ didn't do the things he did just to hear the sound of his own voice. we are suppose to do the same things he did as much as possible...thats a method...
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Post by Grant on Dec 3, 2019 1:58:14 GMT -5
The majority of denominations preach the true Gospel. The Gospel is that Christ died on the Cross for our sins, and rose again the 3rd day. The Gospel is not a method of preaching. Majority of Protestant denomination do NOT preach the True or full gospel of Jesus Christ. The majority do NOT teach Jesus and the apostles New Testament church FULL gospel! You and the majority are believing in the tradition and ideas of men methods ministry of the RCC and Protestants. If you believe the Bible then it says, Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever, so why have the workers changed their understanding of who Jesus is? Many would say that Jesus is part of God is an important part of the Gospel message so are the workers preaching the true Gospel. There were false teachers/apostles among us lead many friends astray with their own ideas about the Trinity is heresy! Pagans doctrine and Jesus is NOT God doctrine. Hopefully, there are men and women full of the Holy Spirit will lead us/2x2 back to the RIGHT PATH on the TRINITY, Jesus is God like unto the Father glorious and awesome gospel.
The Gospel is the message not a method. The message is about Jesus, the method is about men. What Jesus has done for us, not what the workers do for us. Think about who you're giving the glory to. The True gospel is Jesus the Christ/God and His New Testament/apostolic ministry and His people come together to Pray, sing hymns of praises, adoration and to WORSHIP the TRINITY= God the Father, Christ/our LORD God Savior and Holy Spirit... That is TRUE worship in the Spirit and in TRUTH the Godhead.
No, churches do not preach a ministry, they preach Jesus. The Gospel is not Jesus plus a ministry, but "Jesus only is our message". Preaching Jesus is the full Gospel. By your own admission you do not even believe in the Trinity let alone come together to worship it. Churches come together to worship Jesus not a ministry, be it a man made ministry started by a man called William Irvine 120 years ago.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2019 2:09:45 GMT -5
No, churches do not preach a ministry, they preach Jesus. The Gospel is not Jesus plus a ministry, but "Jesus only is our message". Preaching Jesus is the full Gospel. By your own admission you do not come together to worship the Trinity. Churches come together to worship Jesus not a ministry, be it a man made ministry started by man called William Irvine 120 years ago. i'm gonna go out on a limb here and say NO ONE has ever said to worship our ministry. listen to them? yes...but thats not worship else one would say that you worship gov't then because you "listen" to them too....
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