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Post by faune on Dec 13, 2015 17:22:04 GMT -5
Another fascinating study I engaged in today was regarding married workers. I believe there was some ruling around the late 1930's in regards to overseers not marrying and later on in the 1950's or 1960's it became taboo for ALL workers and they were required to remain celibate. Here's all the information I could find on this subject from Cherie's TTT site. Any comments? www.tellingthetruth.info/workers_lists/wrkrmarried.php List of Married Workers
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Post by faune on Dec 13, 2015 17:26:16 GMT -5
Here's the Table of Contents regarding this reality of married workers back in time before the ban on the same. ~
NOTE: In 1962, Martin & Betty Medica were the last married couple to enter the work. With Betty Medica's death on March 12, 2012, there are no more married worker couples in this world. Martin is still living. Eva Scott who was married to Sandy Scott passed away October 11, 2010 in Iowa. What does the Bible say about Married Workers? Married Workers on 1905 Workers' List Story of Tom & Ellen Elliott Married Workers on 1921 Staffordshire Convention Photo/List
American Married Worker Pairs Canadian Married Worker Pairs Australian Married Worker Pairs Other Countries--Married Worker Pairs
Jack Carroll - Statement Re: Workers Marrying When were the workers no longer allowed to marry? Rittenhouse and Sweetland Letter re changes by J. T. Carroll in married worker policy
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Post by faune on Dec 13, 2015 17:39:08 GMT -5
Here's what Cherie Berry Kropp shared on TTT regarding married workers. ~
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Post by faune on Dec 13, 2015 17:45:20 GMT -5
This section from the earlier cited article deals with when the "Worker Rules" change within the 2x2's and the celibacy requirement became mandatory from then on.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2015 18:06:06 GMT -5
Here's the Table of Contents regarding this reality of married workers back in time before the ban on the same. ~ NOTE: In 1962, Martin & Betty Medica were the last married couple to enter the work. With Betty Medica's death on March 12, 2012, there are no more married worker couples in this world. Martin is still living. Eva Scott who was married to Sandy Scott passed away October 11, 2010 in Iowa. What does the Bible say about Married Workers? Married Workers on 1905 Workers' List Story of Tom & Ellen Elliott Married Workers on 1921 Staffordshire Convention Photo/List American Married Worker Pairs Canadian Married Worker Pairs Australian Married Worker Pairs Other Countries--Married Worker Pairs Jack Carroll - Statement Re: Workers Marrying When were the workers no longer allowed to marry? Rittenhouse and Sweetland Letter re changes by J. T. Carroll in married worker policy
well peter was married and probably barnabas and paul so they can be married in my estimation...
BUT I like what the workers have said about the matter in the past...
1. if your not married you can concentrate on the flock better than if your married 2. you can't really attend to your family as well if your married and a worker 3. Jesus wasn't married, no matter how revisionist try to make him married
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Post by slowtosee on Dec 13, 2015 18:30:28 GMT -5
Like a Catholic priest truthfully told me when i asked him where in the bible he could justify that he needed to be single , he surprisingly told me it is not justified by scripture, but merely a discipline of his church which he was willing for. Likewise in the 2x2 church it is merely ,albeit a big deal, a discipline of the church , not a scriptural requirement at all. Alvin
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2015 19:03:24 GMT -5
Therald Sylvester told his companions that after Dave and Emily Christie married and went to Hawaii, Bea Mookinni (a native Hawaiian) stated she got no vision of the possibility of the work for herself until unmarrieds came to the islands to preach.
Based upon that, neither he nor any following after him allowed marriage, though by Carroll's example, workers were allowed to have affairs with each other and continue in the work usually provided they were separated by a large distance, except on/for special occasions. This was told me by a female worker wanting such a relationship. She eventually found it and they chose to marry.
There are many secrets still hidden.
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 13, 2015 19:53:44 GMT -5
well peter was married and probably barnabas and paul so they can be married in my estimation...
BUT I like what the workers have said about the matter in the past...
1. if your not married you can concentrate on the flock better than if your married 2. you can't really attend to your family as well if your married and a worker 3. Jesus wasn't married, no matter how revisionist try to make him married
Why do you like this?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2015 19:58:43 GMT -5
well peter was married and probably barnabas and paul so they can be married in my estimation...
BUT I like what the workers have said about the matter in the past...
1. if your not married you can concentrate on the flock better than if your married 2. you can't really attend to your family as well if your married and a worker 3. Jesus wasn't married, no matter how revisionist try to make him married
Why do you like this? because they show care for the flock vs self as Jesus did it...
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 13, 2015 20:05:45 GMT -5
because they show care for the flock vs self as Jesus did it... That's a nice thought -- without demonstrating any lack of care on the part of married workers.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2015 20:16:16 GMT -5
because they show care for the flock vs self as Jesus did it... That's a nice thought -- without demonstrating any lack of care on the part of married workers. a married worker would be limited in some ways from answering the urgent untimely call as promptly as an unmarried worker.
I am NOT saying married workers would not care for their flock though
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 13, 2015 20:19:06 GMT -5
That's a nice thought -- without demonstrating any lack of care on the part of married workers. a married worker would be limited in some ways from answering the urgent untimely call as promptly as an unmarried worker.
I am NOT saying married workers would not care for their flock though
I rather appreciated that explanation for not having married workers. But I NEVER believed that was the reason they were discontinued.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2015 20:25:46 GMT -5
a married worker would be limited in some ways from answering the urgent untimely call as promptly as an unmarried worker.
I am NOT saying married workers would not care for their flock though
I rather appreciated that explanation for not having married workers. But I NEVER believed that was the reason they were discontinued. we'll never really know the reason it was stopped...
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 13, 2015 21:22:37 GMT -5
I rather appreciated that explanation for not having married workers. But I NEVER believed that was the reason they were discontinued. we'll never really know the reason it was stopped... But if you're told why, could you believe it?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2015 21:58:45 GMT -5
we'll never really know the reason it was stopped... But if you're told why, could you believe it? probably but it would have to come from more than one source(worker) I would be looking for a consensus of workers/overseers...
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 13, 2015 23:02:32 GMT -5
But if you're told why, could you believe it? probably but it would have to come from more than one source(worker) I would be looking for a consensus of workers/overseers... Then I understand why you really would never find out for sure.
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Post by faune on Dec 14, 2015 1:55:40 GMT -5
Therald Sylvester told his companions that after Dave and Emily Christie married and went to Hawaii, Bea Mookinni (a native Hawaiian) stated she got no vision of the possibility of the work for herself until unmarrieds came to the islands to preach.
Based upon that, neither he nor any following after him allowed marriage, though by Carroll's example, workers were allowed to have affairs with each other and continue in the work usually provided they were separated by a large distance, except on/for special occasions. This was told me by a female worker wanting such a relationship. She eventually found it and they chose to marry.
There are many secrets still hidden. Dennis ~ Didn't Jack Carroll, who passed the Worker ruling that workers could no longer marry and remain within the work in the 1950's, have a long-term sister worker companion who was buried next to him in the Carroll cemetery plot? I believe there may be a photo of the graves in Cherie's Photo Gallery on TTT?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2015 2:15:04 GMT -5
If what I've been told over the years is correct, yes'm. Jack Carroll and Linda Heyes had some sort of very close relationship, and they are buried very close to each other in the small "Miltown" Cemetery about a mile west of the convention place known by that name. Other male and female workers now deceased, have reportedly also had such a relationship.
Upon inquiring it was asserted that a vow of celibacy is not the same as as vow of chasity. One is abstinence from marriage, the other is abstinence from intimate relations. That differentiation turned me away from that ministry, and all were forbidden to speak of it.
DJ
Note: Cherie corrected my error. The lady's name in question was Linda Heyes, not Hughes as written in error. Thank you, Cherie, for the correction.
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Post by faune on Dec 14, 2015 16:07:36 GMT -5
Like a Catholic priest truthfully told me when i asked him where in the bible he could justify that he needed to be single , he surprisingly told me it is not justified by scripture, but merely a discipline of his church which he was willing for. Likewise in the 2x2 church it is merely ,albeit a big deal, a discipline of the church , not a scriptural requirement at all. Alvin Slowtosee ~ For somebody like Wm. Irvine who railed on the Catholics a lot, he surely did a fine job of copying their celibate lifestyle within the church. As a result, they had some of the same problems that have plagued the RCC for years ~ namely CSA cases kept under wraps due to perverted priests in their ranks.
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Post by magpie on Dec 14, 2015 16:49:38 GMT -5
If you don't have nits stop nit picking..........Paul wrote in Corinthians..Havn't I the right to follow the examples of the Apostles and the LOrd's brothers and Peter by taking a Christian wife with me on my travels?/ Or are Barnabas and I the only ones who have to work for a living? No wonder they don,t study the Epistles...they use the same heresy of celibacy as the Roman Catholic priesthood it appears. Attitude that are so parallel in so many ways? (THANKS FAUNE)
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Post by magpie on Dec 14, 2015 19:06:24 GMT -5
And a P.S. for Nathan B, Nathan you or someone get up at convention and read out and ask for explaination of 1 Corinthians 9,vs 5/6. Then one of you get up and say that Ephesians 4,vs 11/12/13 have been on your mind and say as the with Corinthians verse "It is written in God's Book of life?-persist on an explaination (with a witness or 2 , as 2x2 middle east tradition)see how you will get a fob of answer, let us all know how you went?
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Post by magpie on Dec 14, 2015 19:57:10 GMT -5
"NATHAN", For 35 years they tried to ram it down our necks that the 2x2s were as a direct continuation of the Pauline teachings."Direct line" Clyde Crittendon would say. As a kid I believed them for a while,till I heard it come from the mouth of 2x2s sexual perpetrator"s".
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Post by magpie on Dec 14, 2015 20:08:52 GMT -5
Please do your homework,then we will enjoy a debate over a cuppa a lot more.........historynewsnetwork.org/article/696
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Post by magpie on Dec 14, 2015 20:15:45 GMT -5
OH Nathan-sight is exact copy? So sorry,look it up please great article. ....History News Network |When did the Catholic Church decide Priests should be celibate?...Perhaps someone could kindle write the correct Web address for us here. Regards
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 14, 2015 20:52:06 GMT -5
The Catholic church is honest about why they stopped having married priests. They didn't want to be in competition with the priests' families for their income and estates when they died.
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Post by dmmichgood on Dec 14, 2015 21:18:26 GMT -5
"NATHAN", For 35 years they tried to ram it down our necks that the 2x2s were as a direct continuation of the Pauline teachings. "Direct line" Clyde Crittendon would say. As a kid I believed them for a while, till I heard it come from the mouth of 2x2s sexual perpetrator"s". Pauline "Celibacy" teachings came from Jesus himself... I am VERY sorry that there has been 2x2 CSA workers and friends among us, it is mandatory for us (USA) to report any CSA workers, or friends to the authority these days. Let the authority deals with the CSA among us. Nathan, please give bible chapter & verse where any kind of "Celibacy" teachings came from Jesus?
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Post by magpie on Dec 14, 2015 21:36:29 GMT -5
Nathan----What do you say and pray about those over (me 7 decades) decades who have been denied justice, as in the Ernie Barry case,clever expensive o/seer arranged, legal defence stopped the fact there was a long list of victims, sone still little children,got witheld from court hearing. About the sametime Chandler was jailed. This in the hands of decades of 2x2s his/her criminal paedophile preachers,has been ostracisms(not worthy of Irvines heaven (and many destroyed by gossip,causing family breakdowns ,disillusioned with God,mental illnesses, AND MANY SUICIDES"MANY",to hear older people say how did he/she get such terrible things in their minds,must be those kids at school,they are just rebelling against God's servants & only way.I remember as a young teen sitting in a back paddock with the .22 and thinking is this the only way to get away from these horrid molesting preachers. Don't try and lessen this mentally disordered paedophile problem amongst your only claimed true way"WORLD WIDE". How do Barrys young victims feel?vindicated or rejected from having some Godly understanding,love,justice,compassion or Pastoring and professional help.Remember Pastors are part of the biblical structure of the Body of Christ (Church).
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Post by magpie on Dec 14, 2015 21:39:14 GMT -5
Nathan,by the way don't forget to study the History of RCC celibacy at Web----History News NetmWork| When did the Catholic Church decide Priests should be celibate?
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