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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2015 20:46:19 GMT -5
At present I am having to consider carefully the 'once saved always saved' teaching to a degree I haven't had to previously. This is because I am looking at the possibility of joining a new church which on its membership form requires people to believe in 'one saved, always saved'. This church is reformed baptist.
I am trying to understand what is really meant by the teaching (and have yet to talk to someone in the higher leadership group of this Reformed Baptist church about it). I am certainly wary of joining this church if I do not honestly understand and agree with the teaching mentioned on their membership form .
I have looked up some previous threads on this Board and came across this written some years back by Dennis Jacobsen.
"So, as I always write, for ME, the conclusion I reach regarding this concept of once saved always saved is this: "can I loose the gift of eternal life?" Sure, IF it is possible. Can I hold onto that gift so it is not possible to lose it? Absolutely. How? By believing in GOD as Father, Son, and Holy Ghost, as HE is the one who has made provision for me according to HIS reason.
Then will I lose my salvation? Absolutely not, for my trust is absolutely in HIM. What about others? Yeah, what about others? If I could make the choice for them, none of them would miss out on the gift of eternal everlasting life in the presence of the LORD either!"
This sounds reasonable to me. But I would like to know from those who are strong believers in 'once saved, always saved' and understand what this church likely means by it, if there is anything they feel needs to be amended in Dennis statement to cover the teaching better. Likewise I would also like to hear from those who don't believe in 'once saved always saved,' what they feel is incorrect in Dennis statement.
I think this would be helpful to me in understanding better where I really stand on this teaching.
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Post by elizabethcoleman on Nov 26, 2015 21:09:18 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2015 22:31:05 GMT -5
At present I am having to consider carefully the 'once saved always saved' teaching to a degree I haven't had to previously. This is because I am looking at the possibility of joining a new church which on its membership form requires people to believe in 'one saved, always saved'. This church is reformed baptist. I am trying to understand what is really meant by the teaching (and have yet to talk to someone in the higher leadership group of this Reformed Baptist church about it). I am certainly wary of joining this church if I do not honestly understand and agree with the teaching mentioned on their membership form . I have looked up some previous threads on this Board and came across this written some years back by Dennis Jacobsen. "So, as I always write, for ME, the conclusion I reach regarding this concept of once saved always saved is this: "can I loose the gift of eternal life?" Sure, IF it is possible. Can I hold onto that gift so it is not possible to lose it? Absolutely. How? By believing in GOD as Father, Son, and Holy Ghost, as HE is the one who has made provision for me according to HIS reason.
Then will I lose my salvation? Absolutely not, for my trust is absolutely in HIM. What about others? Yeah, what about others? If I could make the choice for them, none of them would miss out on the gift of eternal everlasting life in the presence of the LORD either!"This sounds reasonable to me. But I would like to know from those who are strong believers in 'once saved, always saved' and understand what this church likely means by it, if there is anything they feel needs to be amended in Dennis statement to cover the teaching better. Likewise I would also like to hear from those who don't believe in 'once saved always saved,' what they feel is incorrect in Dennis statement. I think this would be helpful to me in understanding better where I really stand on this teaching. there are a few parables in the bible that lead me to believe you can lose your salvation such as the 5 wise and 5 foolish virgins...
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2015 22:38:07 GMT -5
John 6:66 From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.
would that also mean they were saved no more?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2015 22:42:33 GMT -5
At present I am having to consider carefully the 'once saved always saved' teaching to a degree I haven't had to previously. This is because I am looking at the possibility of joining a new church which on its membership form requires people to believe in 'one saved, always saved'. This church is reformed baptist. I am trying to understand what is really meant by the teaching (and have yet to talk to someone in the higher leadership group of this Reformed Baptist church about it). I am certainly wary of joining this church if I do not honestly understand and agree with the teaching mentioned on their membership form . I have looked up some previous threads on this Board and came across this written some years back by Dennis Jacobsen. "So, as I always write, for ME, the conclusion I reach regarding this concept of once saved always saved is this: "can I loose the gift of eternal life?" Sure, IF it is possible. Can I hold onto that gift so it is not possible to lose it? Absolutely. How? By believing in GOD as Father, Son, and Holy Ghost, as HE is the one who has made provision for me according to HIS reason.
Then will I lose my salvation? Absolutely not, for my trust is absolutely in HIM. What about others? Yeah, what about others? If I could make the choice for them, none of them would miss out on the gift of eternal everlasting life in the presence of the LORD either!"This sounds reasonable to me. But I would like to know from those who are strong believers in 'once saved, always saved' and understand what this church likely means by it, if there is anything they feel needs to be amended in Dennis statement to cover the teaching better. Likewise I would also like to hear from those who don't believe in 'once saved always saved,' what they feel is incorrect in Dennis statement. I think this would be helpful to me in understanding better where I really stand on this teaching. what prompted you to think of this change?
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Post by maryhig on Nov 26, 2015 23:33:57 GMT -5
And this 2 Peter 2
For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning. For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them. But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to wallowing in the mire.
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Post by fred on Nov 27, 2015 0:22:51 GMT -5
If you approach the topic from Gods viewpoint - which we are prone not to do - it makes perfect sense. I believe that the term OSAS is used as a pejorative by those opposed to the teaching. Those who subscribe prefer to use the term Perseverance Of The Saints (POTS), or so I am informed. Nevertheless, it sure makes a worthwhile study.
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Post by emy on Nov 27, 2015 0:32:19 GMT -5
Read 1 Cor. 10, and note verse 12.
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Post by fred on Nov 27, 2015 4:03:57 GMT -5
Read 1 Cor. 10, and note verse 12. Thank you emy, and best read in context with verse 13.
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Post by CherieKropp on Nov 27, 2015 12:59:35 GMT -5
Conditional Security is an alternate viewpoint to Eternal Security (aka OSAS) It's an age old debate... Pigeon, my advice to you is to let the Holy Spirit guide you into all truth. (John 16:13) Eternal Security Thoughts
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Post by fixit on Nov 27, 2015 13:57:28 GMT -5
Good advise Cherie.
If you're forced to sign up to a particular belief system it's a form of exclusivity.
Its limiting the Holy Spirit.
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Post by Jason Storebo on Nov 27, 2015 15:29:49 GMT -5
The whole discourse regarding the belief in once saved always saved, or in the belief that one can lose salvation is moot. When we die we simply go to whatever level in the spirit world that is appropriate, based on our spiritual development. The bible is not a very accurate metaphysical guide to what happens to us after death.
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Post by blandie on Nov 27, 2015 16:56:16 GMT -5
Salvation is a gift. One can refuse a gift whether it is god's gift of salvation and righteousness imputed once for all or it is a guy offering you a hand to climb out of the quicksand - you can refuse it for whatever reason but its not that the gift giver has taken away or put conditions on the gift.
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Post by Lee on Nov 27, 2015 17:45:18 GMT -5
The condition is an effectual grasp of Christ as he exhibited salvation. Some grasp the presentation, some don't. This is elective salvation.
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Post by emy on Nov 27, 2015 18:04:41 GMT -5
Read 1 Cor. 10, and note verse 12. Thank you emy, and best read in context with verse 13. Verse 13 is great, too. To know the way of escape, means searching for God's guidance. Not all, including me, are faithful to do that.
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