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Post by bitterbetty on Aug 29, 2015 20:20:43 GMT -5
I recall one time having a conversation with a worker and telling him that I essentially marveled at how he could do what he did; trying to put myself in his place and realizing that I couldn't do it-particularly not being able to sleep in your own bed! That would probably bother me the most aside from not having enough privacy and alone time. But, you know what? He somehow deflected the thought of what all he was 'sacrificing' and simply said (paraphrased): "Well, you just somehow get your eyes off of that aspect (what you sacrifice or give up) and keep you eyes on Christ, and that makes all the difference". My respect for him grew that day. It's as if he just simply did not dwell on his 'sacrifice' and maybe he didn't even view it as a sacrifice....
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Post by kurtzphil69 on Aug 29, 2015 22:05:20 GMT -5
I like the definition my mother gave about "life begins at 40" She said it begins to fall apart. That may be true for some but maybe not all. I always chuckled when she said that because for her it was true. Aww...that's sad! But maybe somehow things will start to look up. I have to say that I had times in my 20's when life seemed to be "falling apart". A stressful period perhaps. A perplexing experience. I got through them somehow and in a way it helped me later on as I would inevitably face the 'next' perplexing thing that might come along. Next....? Sometimes it's the hard things and hard lessons that give us the utmost positive resolve....I guess you could say that in a way it gives you a fighting spirit to fight a good fight and not give up. We are all life-long learners and that thought helps carry me through at times when I am feeling a bit overwhelmed with the 'enormity' of some of life's challenges. Another thing that helps me to listen to and witness other people's challenges and take a lesson from how they are coping...some cope better than others...but I always welcome learning about good coping strategies.
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Post by bitterbetty on Aug 29, 2015 23:14:20 GMT -5
Coping skills are VERY important. I remember a time in my life when I was pregnant, couldn't walk, couldn't work and not at ALL sure what was going to happen to my little family and unborn baby. Those were some dark, gray days and there were days when all I could see was gray. I was likely depressed, but couldn't take anything for it, which is just as well. I feel quite FORTUNATE I was able to turn to other things that helped me get through the 'tunnel'. Music was one of those things...it sort of TRANSPORTED me into a better frame of mind and I am sure was also good for my soul. So music. When I think of coping with some of life's greatest stressers, I think there are times when people just want to escape or take some sort of break from it all. Some turn to drugs or indiscriminate sex and any sort of various behaviors to simply help them feel better for a time even though it is only temporary. But, I've always believed that music was an excellent "OUT"- www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDQyvLtAaQM(the Canadian Tenors with Celine Dion-"Hallelujah"-written by the Canadian Tenors) Such an awesome gift from God.
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Post by bitterbetty on Aug 29, 2015 23:29:34 GMT -5
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Post by jondough on Aug 30, 2015 8:36:32 GMT -5
Every decade has been a little better than the last one for me. I hope it continues . I agree though bitterbetty, we need to appreciate EVERY part of the body. It all works together perfectly as God has planned. Putting any part of the body except the "head" on a pedestal will no doubt cause us to take our focus off of Christ. Thx, jd. I hope that continues for you as well. I guess I'd have to say that for me there have been good timess, bad times, great times, and just average or 'fair' times. Disappointments? Heck yeah!! One of the greatest disappointments for people is when their body is failing/ailing and they cannot seem to do anything to stop it. But perhaps an even greater disappointments are those you face as a parent who has somehow failed...Being disappointed in yourself is maybe the hardest and forgiving yourself is also hard. Dealing with times in which you have been a fool and felt ASHAMED-that's not easy-but to be able to overcome your shame is a victory. Lessons to be learned? Surely! But that's all part of life and if a person can somehow get through the disappointments and struggles without feeling defeated and depressed, that is quite a miracle. I think most everyone has suffered to some degree or another...some seem to have been through TREMENDOUS suffering-maybe more suffering than is rightly fair or seemingly just. I wouldn't wish suffering on anyone. But, it's unpredictable sometimes-who will suffer and/or how they will suffer. Granted, some people end up suffering as a result of CHOICES they have made. But, some folks seem to end up suffering through no fault of their own. The ongoing challenge throughout life is to somehow find that silver lining during those dark times. When someone is going through a dark phase-it's DIFFICULT for them to see...let alone see any light. My heart goes out to them. If they can just somehow get through that dark tunnel... I've been through many dark times myself. I have found myself in a place of desperation many times. The Lord has never really let me down in the long run...cause there have also been many times of sweet redemption. I believe that we need those times of sweet redemption. It restores our faith and gives us hope and fortitude to carry on and hopefully offsets any bitterness that might take root. One of my greatest concerns is that I might become a bitter person due to disappointment in life, because that can sure happen...The past is in the past. Tomorrow is not yet here. So, I try to embrace the present. Life is too short to be carrying around a bunch of regret all the time... Yep. Everyone has failed. Everyone has things in life that they wish they could do differently. Some have paid higher prices for their failures. But...Everyone can become a better person because of them. Every day is a new day. A day to look forward, and learn from yesterday. Guilt and regret can really bog us down, and if we spend too much time muddled in it, can really limit the potential of today. I think we learn from it, let it make us a better person, less selfish, maybe let it help us do things for others that we wouldn't have done otherwise, and continue forward with that positive attitude, the rest of our life can be fulfilling and full of blessing. I believe this is what God wants us to do, no matter what our failures have been in the past. There is so much blessing ahead. God doesn't want our guilt and regret to keep us from the blessing he has planned for us, or even to limit it. I believe the greatest blessing we have has to do with love. No matter how our body starts to shut down, we can always enjoy the greatest blessing of all. The greatest thing in life is right there in front of us for all to enjoy. A great thing about love, amongst so many, is it is not temporary. This is just how I see it.
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Post by kurtzphil69 on Aug 30, 2015 15:05:12 GMT -5
I recall one time having a conversation with a worker and telling him that I essentially marveled at how he could do what he did; trying to put myself in his place and realizing that I couldn't do it-particularly not being able to sleep in your own bed! That would probably bother me the most aside from not having enough privacy and alone time. But, you know what? He somehow deflected the thought of what all he was 'sacrificing' and simply said (paraphrased): "Well, you just somehow get your eyes off of that aspect (what you sacrifice or give up) and keep you eyes on Christ, and that makes all the difference". My respect for him grew that day. It's as if he just simply did not dwell on his 'sacrifice' and maybe he didn't even view it as a sacrifice.... Bingo! He likely didn't view it as a 'sacrifice'. I have an inkling that many workers are this same way...they don't really want to be put on a pedestal...sure-there are maybe some that feel they are 'sacrificing' or giving things up to be in the work...dreams and aspirations they may have liked to achieved that they simply cannot pursue because they are in the work...counting the 'cost' they paid and continue to pay to be in the work- a natural tendency-and I don't judge them for that tendency. But, perhaps they don't truly realize that non workers give things up to; they deny their selves, just in different ways. The Lord is really the only one that knows just how much a person is denying their self. But, the thing is, when we deny ourselves something because it has been laid on our hearts by God, we have peace and there is blessing in it and what follows is we do not dwell on that fact that we've denied our self and instead reap the benefits and blessings. The 'sacrifice' doesn't really even feel like a 'sacrifice'. I sort of liken this to an alcoholic to has given up drinking. They likely spend a certain amount of time dwelling on what they gave up, and in their new life as a sober person they are aware that they are denying their self something they once enjoyed-but many of them simply feel GRATITUDE that they are free from the bondage of addiction and grateful for the much greater beauty in life they can enjoy with sobriety. That is just one example of something that can be denied in exchange for something much greater. Perhaps there comes a time in which the person no longer even views it as self-denial as the denial part becomes diminished because something so much better has taken its place. This is also not unlike a person who will deny their self from over-eating-it might feel like a 'sacrifice' at first as they give up all that food they once embraced/enjoyed in an unhealthy way-and they likely experience some hunger pains... But, denying their self that indulgence can bring something so much better and greater-as their life changes and they lose all that excess weight they were carrying around; no longer feeling the self denial - simply grateful for what the self denial brought about.
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Post by bitterbetty on Aug 30, 2015 16:02:30 GMT -5
Yep. Everyone has failed. Everyone has things in life that they wish they could do differently. Some have paid higher prices for their failures. But...Everyone can become a better person because of them. There is so much blessing ahead. God doesn't want our guilt and regret to keep us from the blessing he has planned for us, or even to limit it. So true. We've all done stupid things; been foolish; wasted time/energy foolishly;-not because we are bad people or even stupid people- but perhaps because of weakness, vulnerability, etc. We've all been 'took', so to speak-and felt very foolish because of it. But it doesn't have end in utter defeat, failure or bitterness. We can take away a lesson and develop a certain 'resolve'...resolving that we will never again let happen what was so foolish. Granted, some foolish mistakes are more grave than others We may not walk away from a mistake feeling proud about what happened, but we can walk away with a powerful resolve. Funny the kinds of experiences that bring about resolve-and resolve can bring about so much more. Reaching a place of resolution can usually be hearkened back to some sort of catalyst.
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Post by kurtzphil69 on Aug 30, 2015 18:26:16 GMT -5
Yep. Everyone has failed. Everyone has things in life that they wish they could do differently. Some have paid higher prices for their failures. But...Everyone can become a better person because of them. There is so much blessing ahead. God doesn't want our guilt and regret to keep us from the blessing he has planned for us, or even to limit it. So true. We've all done stupid things; been foolish; wasted time/energy foolishly;-not because we are bad people or even stupid people- but perhaps because of weakness, vulnerability, etc. We've all been 'took', so to speak-and felt very foolish because of it. But it doesn't have end in utter defeat, failure or bitterness. We can take away a lesson and develop a certain 'resolve'...resolving that we will never again let happen what was so foolish. Granted, some foolish mistakes are more grave than others We may not walk away from a mistake feeling proud about what happened, but we can walk away with a wonderful resolve. Funny the kinds of experiences that bring about resolve-and resolve can bring about so much more. Reaching a place of resolution can usually be hearkened back to some sort of catalyst. Then I've had several 'catalysts' in my life! There is something quite remarkable about a person who is resolute. That resolve most likely has come at a cost, so in a way resolutions are costly. They usually don't spring up out of thin air. You think about what brings a person to a certain resolution-and there may have been some confusion, turmoil and grief that happened before the resolution was made. Maybe a single cataclysmic event or a series of events. Regardless of the resolution, it is a force to be reckoned with. I've noted that there is a certain tranquility that often goes with the resolute. They've decided what to do and are going to do it and it's now CLEAR...as the other 'STUFF' fades away and anything that would hold a person back is cast aside. I think there is some Scripture to that effect.
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Post by bitterbetty on Aug 30, 2015 19:44:13 GMT -5
I like this verse in Hebrews 12, 1st verse. Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us. I liken being resolute with having clear intent about what you are going to do or what you are NOT going to do (anymore). With that resolution- a decision is made, and once a decision has been made, you formulate a plan;. then carry out what is needed need to accomplish what you've resolved to do/or not do. You get rid of the stuff that would hinder you from reaching the goal and much of that 'stuff', spiritually speaking. is simply the sin we seem to like to carry around with us, or cannot seem to shake off. But, with resolution, also comes discipline and the things you didn't think you could shake off can be dropped. Then, viola-you can proceed to said objective less hindered; carrying out each step of the plan methodically. But the whole process takes patience as unplanned things have a way of creeping in that you didn't account for. At times acquiring resolution comes about when you finally decide what is important and what is really NOT important. The flesh has a way of convincing us that certain things are important, when really, they are NOT.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2015 19:19:07 GMT -5
Some people are "cut out for the work/harvest field" and others aren't. Being in different beds, no permanent dwelling place, so much fitting in and filling your place, taking orders from superiors on minor less important issues is for some and not for others. Time will tell if the 4 babes in Canada make it.
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Post by howitis on Aug 31, 2015 19:54:55 GMT -5
Some people are "cut out for the work/harvest field" and others aren't. Being in different beds, no permanent dwelling place, so much fitting in and filling your place, taking orders from superiors on minor less important issues is for some and not for others. Time will tell if the 4 babes in Canada make it. Walker why is it that you're so ungracious toward those who are willing to go forth doing what you are obviously unwilling to do? Do you have no real joy in your life that you must take pleasure in wanting to degrade others or see them fail? There are other occupations that require one to be in different beds, fitting and filling in, taking orders from others over things that may seem trivial.....do you also send similar posts to the defence forces?......just wondering!!
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Post by Roselyn T on Aug 31, 2015 20:26:51 GMT -5
Some people are "cut out for the work/harvest field" and others aren't. Being in different beds, no permanent dwelling place, so much fitting in and filling your place, taking orders from superiors on minor less important issues is for some and not for others. Time will tell if the 4 babes in Canada make it. Walker why is it that you're so ungracious toward those who are willing to go forth doing what you are obviously unwilling to do? Do you have no real joy in your life that you must take pleasure in wanting to degrade others or see them fail? There are other occupations that require one to be in different beds, fitting and filling in, taking orders from others over things that may seem trivial.....do you also send similar posts to the defence forces?......just wondering!! People get over hearing about the "sacrifice the workers make". They choose to do what they do, the same as we all choose to do what we do !
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Post by howitis on Aug 31, 2015 20:47:20 GMT -5
Roselyn did I mention once about sacrifice?
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Post by kurtzphil69 on Aug 31, 2015 20:57:57 GMT -5
Some people are "cut out for the work/harvest field" and others aren't. Being in different beds, no permanent dwelling place, so much fitting in and filling your place, taking orders from superiors on minor less important issues is for some and not for others. Time will tell if the 4 babes in Canada make it. Walker why is it that you're so ungracious toward those who are willing to go forth doing what you are obviously unwilling to do? Do you have no real joy in your life that you must take pleasure in wanting to degrade others or see them fail? There are other occupations that require one to be in different beds, fitting and filling in, taking orders from others over things that may seem trivial.....do you also send similar posts to the defence forces?......just wondering!! Howitis-I think you are reading walker's post differently than I am and that's okay. I don't think Walker is "ungracious" so much as skeptical. [Correct me if I am wrong, Walker.] But as far as being gracious goes, if he really IS ungracious, he may have a reason for it, based on his experience(s) with workers. Perhaps he feels he has been treated ungraciously by workers. Not all workers are gracious to others. Does Walker really want to see them fail? Is he really degrading them? I don't get that impression from his posts. Is he critical? Mmmmm, yes I think he is. But it's a big leap to go from critical to degradation or wishing ill will. Are the workers critical of others? Mmmmm. Yes. Do the workers condemn other people to Hell? Mmmmm: yes, they do.
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Post by kurtzphil69 on Aug 31, 2015 21:01:19 GMT -5
Walker why is it that you're so ungracious toward those who are willing to go forth doing what you are obviously unwilling to do? Do you have no real joy in your life that you must take pleasure in wanting to degrade others or see them fail? There are other occupations that require one to be in different beds, fitting and filling in, taking orders from others over things that may seem trivial.....do you also send similar posts to the defence forces?......just wondering!! Degrading: de·grad·ing dəˈɡrādiNG/ adjective adjective: degrading causing a loss of self-respect; humiliating. "cruel or degrading treatment" synonyms: humiliating, demeaning, shameful, mortifying, ignominious, undignified, inglorious, wretched "accepting our assistance should not be a degrading experience"
I don't view Walker's posts as degrading. Sorry you see it that way...
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Post by Roselyn T on Aug 31, 2015 21:05:59 GMT -5
Roselyn did I mention once about sacrifice? howitis I didn't say you did ! I was making a statement about how we hear about the "sacrifice the workers make" so many times ! They chose to go in the work didn't they ?
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Post by kurtzphil69 on Aug 31, 2015 21:08:53 GMT -5
Roselyn did I mention once about sacrifice? Why are you so defensive and touchy about this subject? The workers are what they are and they do what they do. If they are secure in their calling they do not need to be defended or give justification for what they do. They have nothing to prove. And they certainly don't need to yap about it. Maybe this is more an issue of "respect". The workers have the respect of most of the friends just because they are workers, but there are some who have lost respect for workers or have little respect for them.I remember as a kid going to meetings I got the impression that workers had very little respect for anyone except themselves and fellow workers. From what little taste I had of meetings, it was still big enough taste to realize that they can preach about anything they want and preach to the friends about how they should live their life; giving out correction freely-but they haven't walked in the people's shoes whom they were correcting and for a lot of folks that doesn't settle too well. UNTIL you have walked in someone else's shoes you really have no right to preach at them.This is partly why people don't like to go to church and being preached at by someone with a Holier-than-thou spirit. It's a huge turn off.
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Post by kurtzphil69 on Aug 31, 2015 21:29:31 GMT -5
Roselyn did I mention once about sacrifice? howitis I didn't say you did ! I was making a statement about how we hear about the "sacrifice the workers make" so many times ! They chose to go in the work didn't they ? You are correct, roselyn-They may not always use the word 'sacrifice', but that is often what is implied. At the least, I think some (not all) the workers simply believe they superior, better, and that their 'job' is the most important 'job'-the greatest job, if you will. This is a direct contraindication to what Christ preached Who said the least shall be the greatest and greatest shall be the least. It's a human tendency to compare yourself to others try to better than other or to be considered the greatest. But Jesus gave out correction in that regard. When someone is secure in the Lord, there is NO NEED to lift their self up. But, if a person in INSECURE, they have a tendency to want to elevate their self-however they can accomplish that; even cloaked as a 'humble servant'. In the 'truth', however, it is more the friends who lift the workers up and maybe some workers don't like that so much, but they do very little to give correction in this area. My grandma and most of the friends I knew were somewhat worshipful of the workers.
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Post by bitterbetty on Aug 31, 2015 21:53:23 GMT -5
I hope I can shed a little light on this subject. In many regards, the workers are in a 'no-win' situation. They are darned if they do and darned if they don't. This often happens too, whenever someone has to give out correction. As a nurse I DREAD having to correct people, but I have faced that often. My biggest fear in correcting someone is that I will alienate them. But sometimes it's a risk I've had to take. At the same time, when someone is doing something wrong-for me to stand-by and do nothing or say nothing in a way makes me part and parcel of the wrong doing. Similarly, if I see another nurse doing something outside the scope of nursing (which is illegal) and I don't do anything about it, MY license is on the line. So, what do you do? It's especially tricky when someone who is in a position of authority over you needs to be corrected-because they usually have the attitude of "how dare you correct me?!" You run the risk of offending them. When someone is OFFENDED-well, anything could happen at that point, but sometimes they become vindictive. Again, it is a risk I've had to take. If the person I've corrected becomes vindictive, even if I was in the right, then it's a case of 'watch out'. They will try to get back at you somehow, someway. If they cannot not get back at you DIRECTLY, they do it in a passive-aggressive way. However, in the dynamics between the friends and workers the friends seem to have no 'voice', and that can be rather oppressive. I can see both sides of this issue. Respect is a two-way street. Respect can be very precarious; something difficult to gain, but easy to lose. There are many friends who have much respect for workers,even if they haven't really earned it. Do the workers have respect for the friends? You know, I really don't know the answer to that question.
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Post by kurtzphil69 on Aug 31, 2015 22:30:21 GMT -5
I hope I can shed a little light on this subject. In many regards, the workers are in a 'no-win' situation. They are darned if they do and darned if they don't. This often happens too, whenever someone has to give out correction. As a nurse I DREAD having to correct people, but I have faced that often. My biggest fear in correcting someone is that I will alienate them. But sometimes it's a risk I've had to take. At the same time, when someone is doing something wrong-for me to stand-by and do nothing or say nothing in a way makes me part and parcel of the wrong doing. Similarly, if I see another nurse doing something outside the scope of nursing (which is illegal) and I don't do anything about it, MY license is on the line. So, what do you do? It's especially tricky when someone who is in a position of authority over you needs to be corrected-because they usually have the attitude of "how dare you correct me?!" You run the risk of offending them. When someone is OFFENDED-well, anything could happen at that point, but sometimes they become vindictive. Again, it is a risk I've had to take. If the person I've corrected becomes vindictive, even if I was in the right, then it's a case of 'watch out'. They will try to get back at you somehow, someway. If they cannot not get back at you DIRECTLY, they do it in a passive-aggressive way. However, in the dynamics between the friends and workers the friends seem to have no 'voice', and that can be rather oppressive. I can see both sides of this issue. Respect is a two-way street. Respect can be very precarious; something difficult to gain, but easy to lose. There are many friends who have much respect for workers,even if they haven't really earned it. Do the workers have respect for the friends? You know, I really don't know the answer to that question. It's a good question: Do the workers have respect for others? Or is it more along the lines that the workers EXPECT to receive respect from others, even though they may have done very little to earn that respect? It seems as though it is mainly a one-way street. Why the friends put up with that, I do not know...I guess they feel their salvation is on the line or something. I will admit I am a little skeptical myself about those in authority. I've known too many people in authority who did not deserve my respect, and instead did things to make me feel contempt for them. That's my deal, I know and I have to get over it. But my SENSE of right vs. wrong has a hard time letting things go that are : wrong. Sometimes I wish I didn't' hang on to that stuff so much and that it didn't bother me. But at least I am not apathetic which is one of the greatest "ills" of our world. God would rather people be hot or cold, not lukewarm. And I can understand that sentiment. When someone is lukewarm, they don't care. When people don't care, there is a degredation of society. I had a boss once who would never take a stand. But everyone thought she was the nicest lady. I like her well enough for awhile. But when I really needed her to take a stand on a very important matter, she had no back bone. I totally lost respect for her after that. It's not that I hated her or anything. It's not that I wished ill for her. She didn't have my back and knew I could not trust her. I felt betrayed by someone who was supposed to be there for me. It hurt and was a hard lesson. But, thankfully, I was eventually redeemed and rightly so. Right won out. That restored my faith that redemption could be just around the corner, even in times when we feel wrong is winning over what is right. Good will prevail. I have that faith.
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Post by bitterbetty on Aug 31, 2015 23:58:33 GMT -5
Roselyn did I mention once about sacrifice? I got the impression that workers had very little respect for anyone except themselves and fellow workers. Oh come on...are you sure about that? I still say the workers are in a no-win situation. In which case, sometimes they just have to cut their losses and move on.
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Post by bitterbetty on Sept 1, 2015 0:17:24 GMT -5
There are other occupations that require one to be in different beds, fitting and filling in, taking orders from others over things that may seem trivial.....do you also send similar posts to the defence forces?......just wondering!! Surely you are not comparing the workers to the armed forces? In my mind there is very little comparison there, but feel free to explain why you think those two occupations are similar.
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Post by howitis on Sept 1, 2015 13:47:00 GMT -5
There are other occupations that require one to be in different beds, fitting and filling in, taking orders from others over things that may seem trivial.....do you also send similar posts to the defence forces?......just wondering!! Surely you are not comparing the workers to the armed forces? In my mind there is very little comparison there, but feel free to explain why you think those two occupations are similar. My comparison is only in the way they must take orders and instructions from others sometimes over very menial tasks, my son was once ordered out of bed at 2am told to dress make their beds, go outside, then go back to bed. They often sleep in different places and are moved quite frequently....all things walker mentioned are perhaps 'difficult'. Yes I agree they are often in a 'no win' situation and the best we can do is firstly be ourselves (must be pretty tiresome sometimes visiting people who put on airs and graces for their visitors), and if you're upset with something that's been said tell them. So if walker is not ungracious or degrading what exactly is his point, always having a little dig here or there, questions about conventions which seem so pointless if he's one if the offended. Yes its nice he's 'in the loop' as far as deaths and the odd birthday and lets us know, but his other posts seem extremely pointless if he's had a bad experience, fess up.....people here are generally concerned with others welfare and are quite a nice bunch to chat with.
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Post by kurtzphil69 on Sept 1, 2015 14:28:56 GMT -5
Surely you are not comparing the workers to the armed forces? In my mind there is very little comparison there, but feel free to explain why you think those two occupations are similar. My comparison is only in the way they must take orders and instructions from others sometimes over very menial tasks, my son was once ordered out of bed at 2am told to dress make their beds, go outside, then go back to bed. They often sleep in different places and are moved quite frequently....all things walker mentioned are perhaps 'difficult'. Yes I agree they are often in a 'no win' situation and the best we can do is firstly be ourselves (must be pretty tiresome sometimes visiting people who put on airs and graces for their visitors), and if you're upset with something that's been said tell them. So if walker is not ungracious or degrading what exactly is his point, always having a little dig here or there, questions about conventions which seem so pointless if he's one if the offended. Yes its nice he's 'in the loop' as far as deaths and the odd birthday and lets us know, but his other posts seem extremely pointless if he's had a bad experience, fess up.....people here are generally concerned with others welfare and are quite a nice bunch to chat with. Not a great example of workers following orders. I seriously doubt any worker has been ordered out of bed at 2 am and ordered to make beds, etc. That seems bizarre. What's Walker's point? I don't know. Maybe he doesn't even have a point, you'll have to get that from him. I've noticed he frequently starts threads like this; likely to just get conversation or debate going. He succeeded in this case, didn't he? But, you have accused him of being "unwilling", "having no joy","degrading the workers" and "ungracious". He is in no way obligated to be gracious to the workers. Why are you so up in arms about this? Why such an emotional response/ reaction? Is he critical? Yes. But he is not being critical of you. Rather, you are being critical of him. I think you need to calm down a bit and look at this rationally. As far as accusing him of being unwilling to do what the workers do-that's just bizarre. How do you know he is unwilling for the Work? That would be between him and God anyway if such were the case-and none of your business. Maybe he has never been called or bothered by the work at all, so how could he be "unwilling"? I remember my Grandma using the "unwilling' cop out when she didn't understand someone. 'Oh, they're just unwilling'. I wasn't unwilling to profess. I just never felt moved. It had nothing to do with will.
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Post by howitis on Sept 1, 2015 14:43:20 GMT -5
kurtzphil69 seems you're the one that is upset by the words I've used and yes perhaps I shouldn't have used the word 'unwilling', perhaps walker offered for the work and was knocked back.....now wouldn't that make a great thread. As for being Christ like we could say much here, but I didn't see Jesus as one who let things go, there he was with the publicans, there He was overthrowing the trader's tables in the temple, he was willing to say 'sorry guys you've got it a bit wrong, better to heal on the Sabbath than not at all' As far as my son being told to get out of bed.....bizarre, but true....learn yo take orders, regardless of their point.....same scenario I believe if you don't like it eventually you leave.
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Post by kurtzphil69 on Sept 1, 2015 14:47:18 GMT -5
I got the impression that workers had very little respect for anyone except themselves and fellow workers. Oh come on...are you sure about that? I still say the workers are in a no-win situation. In which case, sometimes they just have to cut their losses and move on. Well, maybe my impression was off. I was just a kid. The message I got loud and clear from workers, based upon the things they said, inferred and overall attitude was that they didn't have much respect for anyone who wasn't a worker like them. If you weren't a worker you were nothing, in other words. Being an outsider I might have had a more objective take on that, believe it or not. The friends and especially those raised in the truth are somewhat indoctrinated, don't think for them selves and swallow whatever the workers hand out.
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Post by kurtzphil69 on Sept 1, 2015 14:48:45 GMT -5
kurtzphil69 seems you're the one that is upset by the words I've used and yes perhaps I shouldn't have used the word 'unwilling', perhaps walker offered for the work and was knocked back.....now wouldn't that make a great thread. As for being Christ like we could say much here, but I didn't see Jesus as one who let things go, there he was with the publicans, there He was overthrowing the trader's tables in the temple, he was willing to say 'sorry guys you've got it a bit wrong, better to heal on the Sabbath than not at all' As far as my son being told to get out of bed.....bizarre, but true....learn yo take orders, regardless of their point.....same scenario I believe if you don't like it eventually you leave. Oh no. You've got that wrong. Not upset. I am just pointing out what I see as erroneous thinking. You also used the terms "degrading" (the workers), ungracious, and "having no joy". Where/how did you dream that up? There is absolutely no indication from Walker's post that he has no joy, or that he wants workers to fail...neither is there any indication he is degrading anyone. etc. As to whether or not he is gracious: if he were ungracious, so what? What does that matter to you?
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Post by howitis on Sept 1, 2015 14:52:01 GMT -5
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