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Post by jondough on Jul 17, 2015 8:27:07 GMT -5
You can criticize our fellowship, and point out faults all you want....And some/many may be true...we are far from perfect - especially me.....but....
I don't know any group of people that I would go to almost any individual and completely trust them. Give them the key to my house, not have to lock anything up, and not worry about a thing. I'm talking about going to a convention that I don't know anyone, and hand just about anyone that is professing my keys.
Yes, there are bad apples in every crowd. Tares in the wheat as Jesus called them. But I love that most are so trust worthy and honest. Why? Because each one tries to be led by the Spirit. Follow Christ in the way they know best.
So there are many things that bother me...certain traditions and such....but more and more I've come to the conclusion that even those that are really hung up in the traditions are really honestly trying to do what they think is right. Knowing this makes me appreciate our fellowship more.
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Post by placid-void on Jul 17, 2015 9:00:43 GMT -5
You can criticize our fellowship, and point out faults all you want....And some/many may be true...we are far from perfect - especially me.....but.... I don't know any group of people that I would go to almost any individual and completely trust them. Give them the key to my house, not have to lock anything up, and not worry about a thing. I'm talking about going to a convention that I don't know anyone, and hand just about anyone that is professing my keys. Yes, there are bad apples in every crowd. Tares in the wheat as Jesus called them. But I love that most are so trust worthy and honest. Why? Because each one tries to be led by the Spirit. Follow Christ in the way they know best. So there are many things that bother me...certain traditions and such....but more and more I've come to the conclusion that even those that are really hung up in the traditions are really honestly trying to do what they think is right. Knowing this makes me appreciate our fellowship more. I completely, absolutely, unequivocally and whole-heartedly agree with you Mr. JohDough.
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hberry
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Post by hberry on Jul 17, 2015 9:24:44 GMT -5
You can criticize our fellowship, and point out faults all you want....And some/many may be true...we are far from perfect - especially me.....but.... I don't know any group of people that I would go to almost any individual and completely trust them. Give them the key to my house, not have to lock anything up, and not worry about a thing. I'm talking about going to a convention that I don't know anyone, and hand just about anyone that is professing my keys. Yes, there are bad apples in every crowd. Tares in the wheat as Jesus called them. But I love that most are so trust worthy and honest. Why? Because each one tries to be led by the Spirit. Follow Christ in the way they know best. So there are many things that bother me...certain traditions and such....but more and more I've come to the conclusion that even those that are really hung up in the traditions are really honestly trying to do what they think is right. Knowing this makes me appreciate our fellowship more. And what is wonderful about the body of Christ, is I feel exactly that way about the members of my church. One lady was telling me that she just leaves the key to her house with the pastor when she goes away for the summer and he gives the key to visiting missionaries, visiting families, and whoever is down and out in the church who needs refuge. She's been doing that for 11 years. It is wonderful to see that same honesty across denominational lines. I felt the same way about the folks I met with in the fellowship and I'm thankful I feel the same way with those I have fellowship with now.
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Post by kurtzphil69 on Jul 17, 2015 10:35:24 GMT -5
You can criticize our fellowship, and point out faults all you want....And some/many may be true...we are far from perfect - especially me.....but.... I don't know any group of people that I would go to almost any individual and completely trust them. Give them the key to my house, not have to lock anything up, and not worry about a thing. I'm talking about going to a convention that I don't know anyone, and hand just about anyone that is professing my keys. Yes, there are bad apples in every crowd. Tares in the wheat as Jesus called them. But I love that most are so trust worthy and honest. Why? Because each one tries to be led by the Spirit. Follow Christ in the way they know best. So there are many things that bother me...certain traditions and such....but more and more I've come to the conclusion that even those that are really hung up in the traditions are really honestly trying to do what they think is right. Knowing this makes me appreciate our fellowship more. I think the friends and workers are some of the most earnest folks I've ever met in my life. I just wish they'd relax a little more and be more secure in the Lord, TRUSTING fully in Him; soaring like an eagle. The Lord is always ready and willing and more than able to be the wind beneath our wings. And I wish they wouldn't treat 'outsiders' like lepers. And don't treat the 'lesser saints' as is they are tainted. Reach out to the outcasts. Just my two cents for today... If a worker is walking down a dirt road in the middle of nowhere practically, you would think they would at least say hi or give some sort of acknowlegement that they are passing you in the way...but that is how one worker treated a family member of mine one day...it's not only wierd/strange it's so un-Christ-like. But, then again, maybe that is how that worker also treats other 'Friends'....I am sure that worker is perfectly TRUSTWORTHY in many respect. But can God TRUST that worker to truly reach out like Christ would? The Lord is ENTRUSTING the workers with much aside from not stealing anything...
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Post by snow on Jul 17, 2015 12:10:07 GMT -5
You can criticize our fellowship, and point out faults all you want....And some/many may be true...we are far from perfect - especially me.....but.... I don't know any group of people that I would go to almost any individual and completely trust them. Give them the key to my house, not have to lock anything up, and not worry about a thing. I'm talking about going to a convention that I don't know anyone, and hand just about anyone that is professing my keys. Yes, there are bad apples in every crowd. Tares in the wheat as Jesus called them. But I love that most are so trust worthy and honest. Why? Because each one tries to be led by the Spirit. Follow Christ in the way they know best. So there are many things that bother me...certain traditions and such....but more and more I've come to the conclusion that even those that are really hung up in the traditions are really honestly trying to do what they think is right. Knowing this makes me appreciate our fellowship more. Totally agree. Have always felt they can be trusted in most ways. Coming here and learning about things I never knew about shocked me initially. But I think overall they are a great group of people and I loved many of them.
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Jul 17, 2015 12:38:10 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2015 12:38:10 GMT -5
Most of them are trustworthy. But don't think they all are! A young man at Knoxville convention stole a bunch of cameras and then broke down and returned them to then overseer George Lee. Lee had to mention this before the convention crowd. I would say that Jondough is right about those over 40. But I'm not so sure about the younger generation.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2015 12:40:52 GMT -5
Jondough you have a good spirit about you. Concerning the traditions, when older ones try to force their beliefs upon others, it can cause resentment. I blame the workers for not stopping some of these older dyed in the wool kinds from bullying others. If an old man is against short skirts, long hair on guys etc., why don't he lead by example and stop trying to cram his views upon others.
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Jul 17, 2015 19:43:37 GMT -5
Post by Gene on Jul 17, 2015 19:43:37 GMT -5
Most of them are trustworthy. But don't think they all are! A young man at Knoxville convention stole a bunch of cameras and then broke down and returned them to then overseer George Lee. Lee had to mention this before the convention crowd. I would say that Jondough is right about those over 40. But I'm not so sure about the younger generation. That's really unfair to young folks, Walker. I'd trust my life with many young folk sooner than I would with some of the angry old white men like me!
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Jul 17, 2015 20:03:59 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2015 20:03:59 GMT -5
Dunno about now, Gene but thievery got so bad up our way, dorms had to be cleared and locked, totally unsafe for cars to remain unlocked. Women's purses ransacked if left anywhere unattended, and I doubt whether the thievery was as a result of anyone much past the age of thirty then. While I was still in attendance it was something we all were ashamed of, and had to just pass it off to "the times."
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Jul 17, 2015 22:49:14 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2015 22:49:14 GMT -5
Most of them are trustworthy. But don't think they all are! A young man at Knoxville convention stole a bunch of cameras and then broke down and returned them to then overseer George Lee. Lee had to mention this before the convention crowd. I would say that Jondough is right about those over 40. But I'm not so sure about the younger generation. and along come walker to stick the knife into the euphoria and deflate the nice feeling i got from others posts, sigh
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Jul 17, 2015 23:25:06 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2015 23:25:06 GMT -5
Most of them are trustworthy. But don't think they all are! A young man at Knoxville convention stole a bunch of cameras and then broke down and returned them to then overseer George Lee. Lee had to mention this before the convention crowd. I would say that Jondough is right about those over 40. But I'm not so sure about the younger generation. and along come walker to stick the knife into the euphoria and deflate the nice feeling i got from others posts, sigh New Zealand friend, if there is absolutely no concerns for thievery at your conventions nowadays, I am very happy for you. At one of the last conventions I attended in my part of the world, a good friend and male convention overseer came to me. He asked me to make certain the men's dorm was totally empty at meeting time and then make sure all was secure and locked during meetings. I asked no questions, just did as I was asked. If things have changed here, I am very glad for that.
It was also my responsibility to help "patrol" the parking lot during meetings and sit where I could keep an eye on it. More than once I had to get up and make an "unscheduled" circuit in that lot. Another older man was asked to keep watch on a couple of suspicious fellows at that large convention. He quietly apprehended one, retrieving some items.
So, please don't be too hard on Walker for that comment, okay?
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Jul 18, 2015 0:40:59 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jul 18, 2015 0:40:59 GMT -5
and along come walker to stick the knife into the euphoria and deflate the nice feeling i got from others posts, sigh New Zealand friend, if there is absolutely no concerns for thievery at your conventions nowadays, I am very happy for you. At one of the last conventions I attended in my part of the world, a good friend and male convention overseer came to me. He asked me to make certain the men's dorm was totally empty at meeting time and then make sure all was secure and locked during meetings. I asked no questions, just did as I was asked. If things have changed here, I am very glad for that.
It was also my responsibility to help "patrol" the parking lot during meetings and sit where I could keep an eye on it. More than once I had to get up and make an "unscheduled" circuit in that lot. Another older man was asked to keep watch on a couple of suspicious fellows at that large convention. He quietly apprehended one, retrieving some items.
So, please don't be too hard on Walker for that comment, okay?the only reason we have had patrols was for people coming in at night and interfering with cars in the car park which is next to the road i would say there is with out a doubt little fingered people/children who would like the look of a nice pen i being one as a child, i got caught by my dad and made to wait until that particular person was seated to return the pen, talk about embarrassment never did that again
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Jul 18, 2015 11:32:07 GMT -5
Post by What Hat on Jul 18, 2015 11:32:07 GMT -5
You can criticize our fellowship, and point out faults all you want....And some/many may be true...we are far from perfect - especially me.....but.... I don't know any group of people that I would go to almost any individual and completely trust them. Give them the key to my house, not have to lock anything up, and not worry about a thing. I'm talking about going to a convention that I don't know anyone, and hand just about anyone that is professing my keys. Yes, there are bad apples in every crowd. Tares in the wheat as Jesus called them. But I love that most are so trust worthy and honest. Why? Because each one tries to be led by the Spirit. Follow Christ in the way they know best. So there are many things that bother me...certain traditions and such....but more and more I've come to the conclusion that even those that are really hung up in the traditions are really honestly trying to do what they think is right. Knowing this makes me appreciate our fellowship more. I think the friends and workers are some of the most earnest folks I've ever met in my life. I just wish they'd relax a little more and be more secure in the Lord, TRUSTING fully in Him; soaring like an eagle. The Lord is always ready and willing and more than able to be the wind beneath our wings. And I wish they wouldn't treat 'outsiders' like lepers. And don't treat the 'lesser saints' as is they are tainted. Reach out to the outcasts. Just my two cents for today... If a worker is walking down a dirt road in the middle of nowhere practically, you would think they would at least say hi or give some sort of acknowlegement that they are passing you in the way...but that is how one worker treated a family member of mine one day...it's not only wierd/strange it's so un-Christ-like. But, then again, maybe that is how that worker also treats other 'Friends'....I am sure that worker is perfectly TRUSTWORTHY in many respect. But can God TRUST that worker to truly reach out like Christ would? The Lord is ENTRUSTING the workers with much aside from not stealing anything... Yup, within denominations it's great. But between denominations?
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Jul 18, 2015 16:26:42 GMT -5
Post by BobWilliston on Jul 18, 2015 16:26:42 GMT -5
Most of them are trustworthy. But don't think they all are! A young man at Knoxville convention stole a bunch of cameras and then broke down and returned them to then overseer George Lee. Lee had to mention this before the convention crowd. I would say that Jondough is right about those over 40. But I'm not so sure about the younger generation. That's really unfair to young folks, Walker. I'd trust my life with many young folk sooner than I would with some of the angry old white men like me! And as for loyalty ahead of reason among young professing people -- in my experience they are more committed than the old people I know.
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Post by Mary on Jul 18, 2015 16:34:18 GMT -5
I don't think they would be any more honest than other people. For example, would you leave your child with a worker any more than you would someone else? The facts say no.
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Post by BobWilliston on Jul 18, 2015 16:35:29 GMT -5
and along come walker to stick the knife into the euphoria and deflate the nice feeling i got from others posts, sigh New Zealand friend, if there is absolutely no concerns for thievery at your conventions nowadays, I am very happy for you. At one of the last conventions I attended in my part of the world, a good friend and male convention overseer came to me. He asked me to make certain the men's dorm was totally empty at meeting time and then make sure all was secure and locked during meetings. I asked no questions, just did as I was asked. If things have changed here, I am very glad for that.
It was also my responsibility to help "patrol" the parking lot during meetings and sit where I could keep an eye on it. More than once I had to get up and make an "unscheduled" circuit in that lot. Another older man was asked to keep watch on a couple of suspicious fellows at that large convention. He quietly apprehended one, retrieving some items.
So, please don't be too hard on Walker for that comment, okay?It happened to be an older worker who sawed the radio ariel off my cousin's car one night at convention. Here's the problem -- it's just like policemen. To outsiders, the reputation of any group extends as far as the weakest link in their "police" practices -- or in the case of the workers, as far as the acceptance of misbehavior is tolerated in the ministry. Considering the numbers of people and the time spent on convention grounds, I'm not so sure the crime rate on convention grounds is any better than a lot of cities.
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Jul 18, 2015 16:37:40 GMT -5
Post by BobWilliston on Jul 18, 2015 16:37:40 GMT -5
Most of them are trustworthy. But don't think they all are! A young man at Knoxville convention stole a bunch of cameras and then broke down and returned them to then overseer George Lee. Lee had to mention this before the convention crowd. I would say that Jondough is right about those over 40. But I'm not so sure about the younger generation. and along come walker to stick the knife into the euphoria and deflate the nice feeling i got from others posts, sigh Euphoria is a most unrealistic state of mind, unfortunately. Except for ... I'll not say.
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Jul 18, 2015 17:39:37 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jul 18, 2015 17:39:37 GMT -5
Good point, Bob. Another huge sigh!
Sadly, which one of us never did anything we are not ashamed of now but able to justify somehow then?
Grin, remembering more than one piece of pie, desert, that "found" it's way into my stomach!
Then there are deeds mentally committed. Who knows the difference between sins of thought and deed? Came to me one day, repent a thought it is gone. Repent a deed there is the memory and consequence. But what do I know? I'm just an excommunicate, unwilling to repent something I was not guilty of, never have been, nor ever will be, kind of like you, Bob. Evil workers according to some, though...
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Jul 18, 2015 20:07:57 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jul 18, 2015 20:07:57 GMT -5
and along come walker to stick the knife into the euphoria and deflate the nice feeling i got from others posts, sigh Euphoria is a most unrealistic state of mind, unfortunately. Except for ... I'll not say. i never mentioned a state of mind, more like a state of peace in the soul if you understand
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Jul 18, 2015 20:30:10 GMT -5
Post by BobWilliston on Jul 18, 2015 20:30:10 GMT -5
Euphoria is a most unrealistic state of mind, unfortunately. Except for ... I'll not say. i never mentioned a state of mind, more like a state of peace in the soul if you understand If it's not in your mind how can you know what's happening to any of you? I'm not slamming euphoria -- I think everyone needs a bit of it. But to not be mindful of it -- does one just make it up, or what?
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Jul 19, 2015 6:59:41 GMT -5
Post by What Hat on Jul 19, 2015 6:59:41 GMT -5
The negative objections just reinforce jondough's point that the friends can be trusted and are trusting.
For example, if I was a thief and given my past experience and knowledge of the friends, a convention ground would be ripe picking, especially the car parking lot during meetings. I'd make sure to have spent a day at convention and prepare an elaborate disguise including a Bible case, and a pen and pencil in my shirt pocket. Snoop around the cars looking for open doors and if anyone is around or asks questions I'm just getting a blanket. Whoops, wrong car.
One can extrapolate to the situation of a pedophile and how easy pickings might be with no active prevention program in place.
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Jul 19, 2015 7:23:58 GMT -5
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Post by Greg on Jul 19, 2015 7:23:58 GMT -5
I'd make sure to have spent a day at convention and prepare an elaborate disguise including a Bible case, and a pen and pencil in my shirt pocket. I cannot be positive on this, but I think within an hour or two some would know you don't belong there.
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Jul 19, 2015 7:46:33 GMT -5
Post by What Hat on Jul 19, 2015 7:46:33 GMT -5
I'd make sure to have spent a day at convention and prepare an elaborate disguise including a Bible case, and a pen and pencil in my shirt pocket. I cannot be positive on this, but I think within an hour or two some would know you don't belong there. I was thinking of those issues when I indicated the thief would need to be someone with "past experience and knowledge of the friends". Such a thief would understand that some groundwork is necessary as the price of admission to the convention. Part of the groundwork would involve some work on the disguise, in part, growing hair either longer or shorter depending on gender.
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hberry
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Post by hberry on Jul 19, 2015 8:57:40 GMT -5
I cannot be positive on this, but I think within an hour or two some would know you don't belong there. I was thinking of those issues when I indicated the thief would need to be someone with "past experience and knowledge of the friends". Such a thief would understand that some groundwork is necessary as the price of admission to the convention. Part of the groundwork would involve some work on the disguise, in part, growing hair either longer or shorter depending on gender. This reminds me of 'way back in the day' (the 60's) when ET was the overseer of CA, there had been some purses stolen at the convention we attended and ET would warn folks not to leave their possessions around (although he didn't mention that there were lost items). Mom was vigilant about her stuff on the grounds, but I don't know if she was privy to any of the details or not. Given the oddball location of the convention (up a hill), it seemed like it had to be an inside job. I'd forgotten all about that. I made sure my purse full of crayolas was with me at all times...except when something more interesting came along and I had friends to play with. Then Mom was in charge.
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Post by slowtosee on Jul 19, 2015 9:24:28 GMT -5
Appreciated jondough's post, and agree most of the friends are NOT thieves. I think it is still good advice , like was announced at Portage convention, to keep trailers locked during meetings , as things had gone missing. Reminds me of incident at the church we attend here in Birch River. One morning a local lady, sadly known for severe drug abuse etc, came to church and sat down toward the front and I remember thinking this is so good and maybe she can get help to overcome her self destructive habits. About halfway through the service she quietly got up and started walking towards the back. , in no big hurry. Oh, she's going to the washroom , but no, all of a sudden the lady who was sitting beside her got up in a panic and instinctively just cried out to the lady leaving, "excuse me, could you please give me my purse back" OOOOPS, got caught, stealing purse at church... the pastor was thrown off for a second and apologized and purse was left behind but regrettably , the thief did not remain , and sadly has not been able to change her ways , that I know of. I suppose, if one was planning to steal, it would be easier to steal from people who trust you ? Seemed like Judas thought so . Alvin
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Post by What Hat on Jul 19, 2015 9:59:21 GMT -5
Appreciated jondough's post, and agree most of the friends are NOT thieves. I think it is still good advice , like was announced at Portage convention, to keep trailers locked during meetings , as things had gone missing. Reminds me of incident at the church we attend here in Birch River. One morning a local lady, sadly known for severe drug abuse etc, came to church and sat down toward the front and I remember thinking this is so good and maybe she can get help to overcome her self destructive habits. About halfway through the service she quietly got up and started walking towards the back. , in no big hurry. Oh, she's going to the washroom , but no, all of a sudden the lady who was sitting beside her got up in a panic and instinctively just cried out to the lady leaving, "excuse me, could you please give me my purse back" OOOOPS, got caught, stealing purse at church... the pastor was thrown off for a second and apologized and purse was left behind but regrettably , the thief did not remain , and sadly has not been able to change her ways , that I know of. I suppose, if one was planning to steal, it would be easier to steal from people who trust you ? Seemed like Judas thought so . Alvin I think the correct response is supposed to be, "Oh I see you have my purse, please ... take these candlesticks also." Assuming there are candlesticks in the church. Only then will she be redeemed. www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCvLfypVszI
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Jul 19, 2015 10:17:27 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2015 10:17:27 GMT -5
Indeed, such things can happen anywhere. By pointing out what I have it was not to indicate anything otherwise.
Remembering now when the first publicated church pedophia became nearly the topic of the day. One very nice and naive lady was thanking God it was not something "we" ever had to worry about or concern ourselves with whatsoever! Should have heard the "amens" to that! Fortunately, a very honest younger male worker (no longer a worker, don't know what actually happened to him...) in attendance afterwards calmly, quietly told everyone there, that was not true, and it was something to be aware of and concerned about among us, although he did not go into details.
Ahhh, isn't life grand, and those of us not deliberately turning to look the other way are called "sniping!"
Sad sigh!
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Jul 21, 2015 22:48:12 GMT -5
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Post by rational on Jul 21, 2015 22:48:12 GMT -5
It happened to be an older worker who sawed the radio ariel off my cousin's car one night at convention. How many decades ago did that happen?
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