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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2015 15:39:34 GMT -5
These internet sites made the ministry more accountable today. When people know the origins of the group, they are less likely to put up with being pinched for leaving the dining shed too early. Wm. Bryant loved to say that conventions were preparation grounds and not playgrounds.
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Post by BobWilliston on Jul 1, 2015 17:24:02 GMT -5
So, tell me which kind of foods that the workers eat differently than the friends during conventions, Bob. You already know -- you used to eat at the workers' table. Don't pretend you don't know the difference -- people won't trust you to be smart enough to notice such things,
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Post by snow on Jul 1, 2015 18:40:21 GMT -5
Part of it would also be attributed to the culture of the country. In countries where the men are more authoritarian you likely see the male workers having more of a tendency towards control and the women allowing it because it's what they are used to? Just a thought.
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Post by Gene on Jul 1, 2015 18:49:15 GMT -5
So, tell me which kind of foods that the workers eat differently than the friends during conventions, Bob. You already know -- you used to eat at the workers' table. Don't pretend you don't know the difference -- people won't trust you to be smart enough to notice such things, But, Bob, as both Ross and Nathan have written, it varies. As a worker I was at conventions where workers' table food was just like everyone else's (Iowa under Leslie White) and other places where it was definitely 3-star while the friends' was 2-star. I remember as a kid seeing the boxed cereal on the workers' table while the rest of us tried to gag down slimy oatmeal. Point is, I have no problem believing Nathan's experience was exactly as he described it. At least, until someone else who was at the same conventions at the same time tells a different story! G
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Post by Alan Vandermyden on Jul 1, 2015 19:00:17 GMT -5
Thanks, for sharing about how things were done in Calf..... In Oregon at the workers eat the same food as the friends that I remembered my 8 yrs in the work. My job was in charge of the dish washing at Boring. The visiting workers had beef sandwiches, cereals, cookies, cakes in the evening in the main house, and any worker was welcome to join in.
The friends can drive to town and eat whatever food they like, most of the workers at convention can't go wherever they want during convention time. Thanks, Nathan. Though I attended one convention at Parma (I think you were there too, in the mid-1990s?), I don't specifically remember whether or not there were differences in food at the workers' table. It does occur to me, however, that your overseer at the time, Howard Mooney, did work to be fair and approachable by both workers and friends, and I know he encouraged his staff to do so. When I was out here in Guam, Saipan and Micronesia, the sister workers in the other fields (this was 3 fields at that time) were from Oregon, and we often had occasion to discuss the ways in which our respective overseers - Eldon and Howard - operated. Howard was a communicator, an administrator, and approachable. Eldon was a bit "scarier," though also an excellent administrator, and one outstanding quality - from a "management" perspective - about him was that he did train people to replace him. That was a noticeable lack in Howard. This is a bit off-topic, but I am trying to give a little broader picture of the differences in regional administration, and how that might even affect the choice of food at the workers' table, compared to that at the other tables. Yes, we did have the worker "tea times" before the first and second meetings each day, as well as each evening. One time the sisters who "cleaned" our quarters each morning (more of a ploy to make sure we got up for breakfast!) posted a "tea-serving" list in our quarters at Santee, with two of us brothers "serving tea," at each tea time, and we had been assigned times immediately before we spoke! Not good! We brothers had no idea such a list even existed, and this one was of course a joke. We retaliated (at my instigation), by compiling a 'platform list' for the sisters, enlisting a young sister to post it in their quarters for us. I do know that when I was in charge of the dish-washing or night-watch crews, I made sure to have plenty of cookies ready for my crew, having sampled various cookies to ensure I got good ones for them!
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Post by BobWilliston on Jul 1, 2015 19:31:35 GMT -5
You already know -- you used to eat at the workers' table. Don't pretend you don't know the difference -- people won't trust you to be smart enough to notice such things, But, Bob, as both Ross and Nathan have written, it varies. As a worker I was at conventions where workers' table food was just like everyone else's (Iowa under Leslie White) and other places where it was definitely 3-star while the friends' was 2-star. I remember as a kid seeing the boxed cereal on the workers' table while the rest of us tried to gag down slimy oatmeal. Point is, I have no problem believing Nathan's experience was exactly as he described it. At least, until someone else who was at the same conventions at the same time tells a different story! G Yes, I wouldn't dispute at all that it varies one place to another. And I do remember that when I was at Elizabeth the first time when Leslie White was there that I'd been sitting at the table next to the workers' table a few times and didn't recognize it as anything different from all the other tables. Styrofoam throw-away plates seemed innovative. I never was that familiar with workers' tables here on the west coast, but I did see one at Mountain Ranch once and it had a lot of dainties on it. Only once did we actually leave convention for our meals. The year we "didn't go to convention" we actually did go to convention at Saginaw and there was something in the food every meal that was positively gross, so we ate off-grounds the last two days. The only time I never found convention food good.
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Post by fixit on Jul 1, 2015 21:04:04 GMT -5
In the 1990's you were told from the platform at NSW conventions not to leave the grounds and if you wanted to you should ask the worker in charge. That's scary.
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Post by BobWilliston on Jul 1, 2015 22:09:51 GMT -5
In the 1990's you were told from the platform at NSW conventions not to leave the grounds and if you wanted to you should ask the worker in charge. That's scary. Sounds like Jonestown.
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Post by fixit on Jul 1, 2015 22:25:35 GMT -5
That's exactly what went through my mind. There's no need for that level of control.
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Post by BobWilliston on Jul 1, 2015 23:36:33 GMT -5
That's exactly what went through my mind. There's no need for that level of control. The frightening part of it is that people are so ready to comply with such orders. I've heard of workers "recommending" that people not leave the grounds at convention time, the idea being that they would lose the spirit of the event if they went somewhere, I've always wondered what kind of trance this kind of control was intended to create, We had an old guy who used to come to convention and he'd sneak away off to the wooded part of the convention grounds to have a smoke between meetings, and the kids would hide and watch him.
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Post by whyisitso on Jul 1, 2015 23:51:32 GMT -5
That's exactly what went through my mind. There's no need for that level of control. The frightening part of it is that people are so ready to comply with such orders. I've heard of workers "recommending" that people not leave the grounds at convention time, the idea being that they would lose the spirit of the event if they went somewhere, I've always wondered what kind of trance this kind of control was intended to create, We had an old guy who used to come to convention and he'd sneak away off to the wooded part of the convention grounds to have a smoke between meetings, and the kids would hide and watch him. The thing is, now there are 2 conventions in Queensland that are 'Day Only' comprised of two consecutive weekends and they swap workers for each weekend. Not sure how that works with 'losing the spirit of convention by leaving the grounds ' that we were all taught growing up. I guess it's become a necessity to do it so it's ok now and blessed by the powers that be? I wonder at the other Queensland conventions if that line is still used?
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Post by BobWilliston on Jul 2, 2015 0:00:45 GMT -5
The frightening part of it is that people are so ready to comply with such orders. I've heard of workers "recommending" that people not leave the grounds at convention time, the idea being that they would lose the spirit of the event if they went somewhere, I've always wondered what kind of trance this kind of control was intended to create, We had an old guy who used to come to convention and he'd sneak away off to the wooded part of the convention grounds to have a smoke between meetings, and the kids would hide and watch him. The thing is, now there are 2 conventions in Queensland that are 'Day Only' comprised of two consecutive weekends and they swap workers for each weekend. Not sure how that works with 'losing the spirit of convention by leaving the grounds ' that we were all taught growing up. I guess it's become a necessity to do it so it's ok now and blessed by the powers that be? I wonder at the other Queensland conventions if that line is still used? What is "day-only" about them? Daytime meetings only? One-day conventions?
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Post by dmmichgood on Jul 2, 2015 4:23:28 GMT -5
That's exactly what went through my mind. There's no need for that level of control. Yes, it does sound like the level of control in NSW (and other parts of Australia) were extreme. When you are part of it you tend to accept the control but some were starting to react to it in the 1990's. I remember in 1994 or 1995 we left the Silverdale convention ground near Sydney after lunch on the Saturday to go visit a local relative who was not well. We didn't ask anyone whether or not we could go (as we found it over the top) but on returning we were asked by a male worker whose permission we had sought. I nicely responded that I'd sought permission from myself but was reminded that we shouldn't leave the grounds without permission. T HAT IS ABSOLUTELY CRAZY!
FOR AN ADULT TO HAVE TO ASK PERMISSION FROM A WORKER TO LEAVE THE CONVENTION GROUNDS!
THAT IS ABOUT AS 'CULT LIKE' AS ANY RELIGION CAN GET!
I DON'T THINK I EVER HEARD OF THAT HAPPENING IN ANY CONVENTION HERE IN THE USA.
MUST HAVE BEEN AN AUSTRALIAN THING.
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Post by Alan Vandermyden on Jul 2, 2015 5:05:32 GMT -5
I have a picture of you and me were at the same convention in Walla, Walla, Washington convention in 1991 or 92. Yes, it probably was Walla Walla, Nathan. I can picture talking with you in the quarters, but wasn't sure if it was Walla Walla or Parma, as a carload of us young California workers went to both that year. I'm thinking '93, as I was out in the Marshall Islands from early '90 to the summer of '92.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2015 10:42:35 GMT -5
I remember in 1994 or 1995 we left the Silverdale convention ground near Sydney after lunch on the Saturday to go visit a local relative who was not well.
We didn't ask anyone whether or not we could go (as we found it over the top) but on returning we were asked by a male worker whose permission we had sought.
I nicely responded that I'd sought permission from myself but was reminded that we shouldn't leave the grounds without permission. *** WOW I never heard such things in the US. It was often stated that we could lose the spirit of convention if we left the grounds. But I never remembered being ridiculed for leaving the grounds as we did it often. The layout of most grounds in the US would make it hard to monitor who came and went due to long parking lots. And people would go out and check on their motels. I go back to the 70s in memories.
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Post by BobWilliston on Jul 2, 2015 16:20:55 GMT -5
I remember in 1994 or 1995 we left the Silverdale convention ground near Sydney after lunch on the Saturday to go visit a local relative who was not well. We didn't ask anyone whether or not we could go (as we found it over the top) but on returning we were asked by a male worker whose permission we had sought. I nicely responded that I'd sought permission from myself but was reminded that we shouldn't leave the grounds without permission. *** WOW I never heard such things in the US. It was often stated that we could lose the spirit of convention if we left the grounds. But I never remembered being ridiculed for leaving the grounds as we did it often. The layout of most grounds in the US would make it hard to monitor who came and went due to long parking lots. And people would go out and check on their motels. I go back to the 70s in memories. One time when I was about 10 I was hanging out with two kids my age, and the father of one of them volunteered to take us to the store down the road with him. Turned out he bought each of us a candy bar and himself a girlie magazine. I was quite shocked.
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Post by BobWilliston on Jul 2, 2015 16:22:31 GMT -5
What is "day-only" about them? Daytime meetings only? One-day conventions? As I understand it the Brisbane convention grounds at Rochedale were sold. So they are having 2 weekends of meetings instead - meetings at a hall or a school over just Sat/Sunday and the same the following weekend (I may be wrong on the venue). Queenslanders on this board will know the details... I believe I heard that once before. Maybe they will find it sufficiently cost and labor effective to keep the idea.
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Post by whyisitso on Jul 2, 2015 16:30:29 GMT -5
As I understand it the Brisbane convention grounds at Rochedale were sold. So they are having 2 weekends of meetings instead - meetings at a hall or a school over just Sat/Sunday and the same the following weekend (I may be wrong on the venue). Queenslanders on this board will know the details... I believe I heard that once before. Maybe they will find it sufficiently cost and labor effective to keep the idea. Yes, Rochdale was sold a couple of years ago so now instead of having the usual 4 day convention, two weeks in a row they now have two weekend conventions. One is on the north side of Brisbane and one on the south side. Two consecutive weekends. Swapping workers over for each weekend. 3 meetings each day. Everyone just packs their lunch etc as they would for special meetings.
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Post by BobWilliston on Jul 2, 2015 16:34:44 GMT -5
I believe I heard that once before. Maybe they will find it sufficiently cost and labor effective to keep the idea. Yes, Rochdale was sold a couple of years ago so now instead of having the usual 4 day convention, two weeks in a row they now have two weekend conventions. One is on the north side of Brisbane and one on the south side. Two consecutive weekends. Swapping workers over for each weekend. 3 meetings each day. Everyone just packs their lunch etc as they would for special meetings. So this in effect replaces 2 Rochdale conventions -- am I right that there used to be 2 conventions there?
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Post by whyisitso on Jul 2, 2015 17:05:54 GMT -5
Yes, Rochdale was sold a couple of years ago so now instead of having the usual 4 day convention, two weeks in a row they now have two weekend conventions. One is on the north side of Brisbane and one on the south side. Two consecutive weekends. Swapping workers over for each weekend. 3 meetings each day. Everyone just packs their lunch etc as they would for special meetings. So this in effect replaces 2 Rochdale conventions -- am I right that there used to be 2 conventions there? Yes. Rochedale 1st & 2nd
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Post by Gene on Jul 3, 2015 15:47:10 GMT -5
I remember in 1994 or 1995 we left the Silverdale convention ground near Sydney after lunch on the Saturday to go visit a local relative who was not well. We didn't ask anyone whether or not we could go (as we found it over the top) but on returning we were asked by a male worker whose permission we had sought. I nicely responded that I'd sought permission from myself but was reminded that we shouldn't leave the grounds without permission. *** WOW I never heard such things in the US. It was often stated that we could lose the spirit of convention if we left the grounds. But I never remembered being ridiculed for leaving the grounds as we did it often. The layout of most grounds in the US would make it hard to monitor who came and went due to long parking lots. And people would go out and check on their motels. I go back to the 70s in memories. One time when I was about 10 I was hanging out with two kids my age, and the father of one of them volunteered to take us to the store down the road with him. Turned out he bought each of us a candy bar and himself a girlie magazine. I was quite shocked. You mean like "Good Housekeeping" or "Vogue"?
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hberry
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Post by hberry on Jul 3, 2015 15:57:15 GMT -5
One time when I was about 10 I was hanging out with two kids my age, and the father of one of them volunteered to take us to the store down the road with him. Turned out he bought each of us a candy bar and himself a girlie magazine. I was quite shocked. You mean like "Good Housekeeping" or "Vogue"? It would have to be Good Housekeeping....Vogue would be too worldly.
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Post by Alan Vandermyden on Jul 3, 2015 17:23:13 GMT -5
One time when I was about 10 I was hanging out with two kids my age, and the father of one of them volunteered to take us to the store down the road with him. Turned out he bought each of us a candy bar and himself a girlie magazine. I was quite shocked. Shocked that he bought you a candy bar??
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Post by BobWilliston on Jul 3, 2015 17:25:11 GMT -5
One time when I was about 10 I was hanging out with two kids my age, and the father of one of them volunteered to take us to the store down the road with him. Turned out he bought each of us a candy bar and himself a girlie magazine. I was quite shocked. You mean like "Good Housekeeping" or "Vogue"? I don't know. I never got past the pictures.
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Post by BobWilliston on Jul 3, 2015 17:26:58 GMT -5
One time when I was about 10 I was hanging out with two kids my age, and the father of one of them volunteered to take us to the store down the road with him. Turned out he bought each of us a candy bar and himself a girlie magazine. I was quite shocked. Shocked that he bought you a candy bar?? I had never seen one of them before either.
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Post by Alan Vandermyden on Jul 3, 2015 18:52:03 GMT -5
We younger brother workers more than once had pizza delivered (or someone went and picked it up?) to our quarters - "Struggle Inn" - on the Santee grounds, on Sunday evening after Santee II. It was the end of the last convention of the season, and, as much as we all looked forward to preps and conventions, we were all ready to change gears by then . . . I can't remember what toppings we bought, but it went okay with the "hootch" someone made there in Struggle Inn, from apple or other juice.
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Post by Gene on Jul 3, 2015 18:56:18 GMT -5
We younger brother workers more than once had pizza delivered (or someone went and picked it up?)to our quarters - "Struggle Inn" - on the Santee grounds, on Sunday evening after Santee II. It was the end of the last convention of the season, and, as much as we all looked forward to preps and conventions, we were all ready to change gears by then . . . I can't remember what toppings we bought, but it went okay with the "hootch" someone made there in Struggle Inn, from apple or other juices. Hootch?! You mean, like, fermented? I always heard those California friends were on the edge, but, Hootch?!?!?
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Post by Alan Vandermyden on Jul 3, 2015 18:58:44 GMT -5
We younger brother workers more than once had pizza delivered (or someone went and picked it up?)to our quarters - "Struggle Inn" - on the Santee grounds, on Sunday evening after Santee II. It was the end of the last convention of the season, and, as much as we all looked forward to preps and conventions, we were all ready to change gears by then . . . I can't remember what toppings we bought, but it went okay with the "hootch" someone made there in Struggle Inn, from apple or other juices. Hootch?! You mean, like, fermented? I always heard those California friends were on the edge, but, Hootch?!?!? Yep, I mean, like, fermented. Edgy.
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