Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 27, 2015 16:30:15 GMT -5
You are wrong. You have no more right to destroy the hotel's bible than you would have to destroy their sheets, chairs, or the TV because it had programs that had not received your imprimatur. You are wrong. You have no more right to destroy the hotel's bible than you would have to destroy their sheets, chairs, or the TV because it had programs that had not received your imprimatur. You are wrong! Those bibles are NOT the property of the hotel like sheets, chairs, or the TV! Those bibles are the property exclusively of the Gideon society. Why Are There Gideon Bibles in Hotel Rooms? Because the Gideons put them there!
The Gideon Bible is not some special version or translation of the Bible that hotels really like (the books are usually plain old King James Versions); they're named for the group that distributes them.
Gideons International got its start in 1898, when two traveling businessmen, John H. Nicholson and Samuel E. Hill, arrived at the crowded Central Hotel in Boscobel, Wisconsin, for the night.
The two had never met, but there was only one double room left, so they decided to share it. The men got to talking and found they shared a common faith and had both toyed with the idea of creating an evangelical association for Christian businessmen.
They decided to give it a shot together. They called a meeting the following year for men who were interested in joining together for “mutual recognition, personal evangelism, and united service for the Lord.” Only one other person showed up to that meeting—William J. Knights, who suggested they name their organization after Gideon, an Old Testament judge who led a small band of men to defeat a much larger army.
As the group expanded in its first few years, most of the new members were men who frequently traveled for work and spent many of their nights in hotel rooms. They wondered how they might be more effective witnesses for Christ on the road, and hit upon the idea of providing Bibles to hotels. They could be used not only by the Gideons’ members as they traveled around the country, but also borrowed by other guests in need of them. They started with the Superior Hotel in Superior, Montana, then set out to put a Bible in every hotel room in America. Since 1908, they’ve distributed more than 1.7 billion Bibles, expanding beyond the U.S. to more than 190 other countries. Passing Them Out
The Gideons don’t go room to room themselves, slipping the books in nightstands like Bible elves. When a hotel opens, local Gideons members will present a Bible to the hotel's general manager in a small ceremony and then give enough books for each room and some extras to the housekeeping staff for distribution. In addition to hotel rooms, the Gideons also give Bibles to military bases, hospitals, nursing homes, prisons and to students on college campuses.
Each Bible handed out is free of charge, and the project is funded entirely by donations to the group. The Gideons will also replace any books that go missing or get worn out, and the group says that the books have a six-year life expectancy, on average. They don’t get bent out of shape when people ignore the “thou shalt not steal” rule when it comes to the Bibles, either. They’d rather you just take the book if you need it that badly.
Based on the success of the Gideons’ Bible project -- the group’s own statistics claim 25% of the people who check into a hotel room will read the Bible placed there -- other religious groups have begun distributing their own free literature to hotels. The Marriott hotel chain, founded by a Mormon, places the The Book of Mormon in many of its rooms, and many hotels also offer Buddhist, Hindu, Christian Scientist or Scientologist books along with the standard Gideon Bible.
that's still vandalism...
|
|
|
Post by rational on May 27, 2015 17:03:44 GMT -5
You are wrong. You have no more right to destroy the hotel's bible than you would have to destroy their sheets, chairs, or the TV because it had programs that had not received your imprimatur. You are wrong! Those bibles are NOT the property of the hotel like sheets, chairs, or the TV! Those bibles are the property exclusively of the Gideon society.
From your post: When a hotel opens, local Gideons members will present a Bible to the hotel's general manager in a small ceremony and then give enough books for each room and some extras to the housekeeping staff for distribution. In addition to hotel rooms, the Gideons also give Bibles to military bases, hospitals, nursing homes, prisons and to students on college campuses.
|
|
|
Post by rational on May 27, 2015 19:06:37 GMT -5
You are wrong. You have no more right to destroy the hotel's bible than you would have to destroy their sheets, chairs, or the TV because it had programs that had not received your imprimatur. You are wrong! Those bibles are NOT the property of the hotel like sheets, chairs, or the TV! Those bibles are the property exclusively of the Gideon society.
From your post: When a hotel opens, local Gideons members will present a Bible to the hotel's general manager in a small ceremony and then give enough books for each room and some extras to the housekeeping staff for distribution. In addition to hotel rooms, the Gideons also give Bibles to military bases, hospitals, nursing homes, prisons and to students on college campuses.They do not rent, loan, or lease the books to the hotel. At the point point they are given they become the property of the establishment. If I were to give the hotel a painting and they hung it in your room and you did not find it to your liking and destroyed it it would not be property that belonged to me that you were destroying. The Lincoln Bible was given to the Library of Congress by the Lincoln family. The bible no longer belongs to the Lincoln family.
|
|
|
Post by dmmichgood on May 27, 2015 21:36:37 GMT -5
You are wrong! Those bibles are NOT the property of the hotel like sheets, chairs, or the TV! Those bibles are the property exclusively of the Gideon society. Why Are There Gideon Bibles in Hotel Rooms? Because the Gideons put them there!
The Gideon Bible is not some special version or translation of the Bible that hotels really like (the books are usually plain old King James Versions); they're named for the group that distributes them.
Gideons International got its start in 1898, when two traveling businessmen, John H. Nicholson and Samuel E. Hill, arrived at the crowded Central Hotel in Boscobel, Wisconsin, for the night.
The two had never met, but there was only one double room left, so they decided to share it. The men got to talking and found they shared a common faith and had both toyed with the idea of creating an evangelical association for Christian businessmen.
They decided to give it a shot together. They called a meeting the following year for men who were interested in joining together for “mutual recognition, personal evangelism, and united service for the Lord.” Only one other person showed up to that meeting—William J. Knights, who suggested they name their organization after Gideon, an Old Testament judge who led a small band of men to defeat a much larger army.
As the group expanded in its first few years, most of the new members were men who frequently traveled for work and spent many of their nights in hotel rooms. They wondered how they might be more effective witnesses for Christ on the road, and hit upon the idea of providing Bibles to hotels. They could be used not only by the Gideons’ members as they traveled around the country, but also borrowed by other guests in need of them. They started with the Superior Hotel in Superior, Montana, then set out to put a Bible in every hotel room in America. Since 1908, they’ve distributed more than 1.7 billion Bibles, expanding beyond the U.S. to more than 190 other countries. Passing Them Out
The Gideons don’t go room to room themselves, slipping the books in nightstands like Bible elves. When a hotel opens, local Gideons members will present a Bible to the hotel's general manager in a small ceremony and then give enough books for each room and some extras to the housekeeping staff for distribution. In addition to hotel rooms, the Gideons also give Bibles to military bases, hospitals, nursing homes, prisons and to students on college campuses.
Each Bible handed out is free of charge, and the project is funded entirely by donations to the group. The Gideons will also replace any books that go missing or get worn out, and the group says that the books have a six-year life expectancy, on average. They don’t get bent out of shape when people ignore the “thou shalt not steal” rule when it comes to the Bibles, either. They’d rather you just take the book if you need it that badly.
Based on the success of the Gideons’ Bible project -- the group’s own statistics claim 25% of the people who check into a hotel room will read the Bible placed there -- other religious groups have begun distributing their own free literature to hotels. The Marriott hotel chain, founded by a Mormon, places the The Book of Mormon in many of its rooms, and many hotels also offer Buddhist, Hindu, Christian Scientist or Scientologist books along with the standard Gideon Bible.
that's still vandalism... Perhaps it is "vandalism": "action involving deliberate destruction of or damage to public or private property."
However, it isn't destroying hotel property, in which they have invested money. I don't destroy or purloin hotel linens to replenish my home linen cupboard with hotel towels.
|
|
|
Post by rational on May 27, 2015 21:58:54 GMT -5
that's still vandalism... Perhaps it is "vandalism": "action involving deliberate destruction of or damage to public or private property."However, it isn't destroying hotel property, in which they have invested money. Oh come on. If someone gives you a TV and I decide to destroy it because I don't like the content would you say I am not destroying your property simply because you have not invested money in it? Suppose it was a piece of fulgurite that was given to you. No monetary investment yet you still would own the piece. But, of course, you are right. It is not destroying hotel property in which they have invested money. By the same token you are not destroying hotel property that they colored bright pink either. But you are destroying hotel property. Was there a question that you had?
|
|
|
Post by dmmichgood on May 28, 2015 0:19:48 GMT -5
You are wrong! Those bibles are NOT the property of the hotel like sheets, chairs, or the TV! Those bibles are the property exclusively of the Gideon society.
From your post: When a hotel opens, local Gideons members will present a Bible to the hotel's general manager in a small ceremony and then give enough books for each room and some extras to the housekeeping staff for distribution. In addition to hotel rooms, the Gideons also give Bibles to military bases, hospitals, nursing homes, prisons and to students on college campuses.They do not rent, loan, or lease the books to the hotel. At the point point they are given they become the property of the establishment.If I were to give the hotel a painting and they hung it in your room and you did not find it to your liking and destroyed it it would not be property that belonged to me that you were destroying. The Lincoln Bible was given to the Library of Congress by the Lincoln family. The bible no longer belongs to the Lincoln family. Indeed you have a point, rational. Since the hotel received them as a "gift" from the Gideons, -they are now the property of that hotel.
The hotel puts them into the rooms which the hotel will then rent out as living space. I have paid money to rent that living space. I am renting the hotel room in which I hope to feel as comfortable as possibly to my own home
When I am ready to go to sleep & I open the drawer of the bedside table in order to place my own personal items into the drawer as I would have in my own bedside table in my own bedroom in my own home.
There staring me in the face is a BIBLE, -a book of a belief system of which I not only do not believe to be a moral way to live, -but it represents a belief system of which has caused me great deal of pain.
Sure, that is my personal problem and I should not let it bother me, but never-the-less it does, - to the point that I know I am not going to get to sleep as soon as I had hoped. This is NOT what I had paid for. I had paid to have a quiet living space as analogous to my own home as possible. I have options.
-Take this book that I wouldn't have in my bedside table at home and pitch it in the nearest trash can.
- get back into clothes other than my bedtime wear & take the BOOK down to the office, hunt down the attendant & file a complaint. -see it as an opportunity to "teach" those that rent the room after me by underlining some of the choice verses such as 1 Sam.15:3 and put a book mark there that says "read this,"
But then, I have a very real moral dilemma, worst than destroying a book. Could I be doing something to some future person who rented that room with the same expectations as I had, something just as distressing as I had just experienced?
I plead guilty to destroying hotel property.
|
|
|
Post by dmmichgood on May 28, 2015 0:24:10 GMT -5
Perhaps it is "vandalism": "action involving deliberate destruction of or damage to public or private property."However, it isn't destroying hotel property, in which they have invested money. Oh come on. If someone gives you a TV and I decide to destroy it because I don't like the content would you say I am not destroying your property simply because you have not invested money in it? Suppose it was a piece of fulgurite that was given to you. No monetary investment yet you still would own the piece. But, of course, you are right. It is not destroying hotel property in which they have invested money. By the same token you are not destroying hotel property that they colored bright pink either. But you are destroying hotel property. Was there a question that you had? No rational, -no one had asked such a question.
It was in a reply I made to Wally.
Is this a court of law where I can only reply to questions?
|
|
|
Post by rational on May 28, 2015 0:59:42 GMT -5
Indeed you have a point, rational. Since the hotel received them as a "gift" from the Gideons, -they are now the property of that hotel. The hotel puts them into the rooms which the hotel will then rent out as living space. I have paid money to rent that living space. I am renting the hotel room in which I hope to feel as comfortable as possibly to my own home When I am ready to go to sleep & I open the drawer of the bedside table in order to place my own personal items into the drawer as I would have in my own bedside table in my own bedroom in my own home. There staring me in the face is a BIBLE, -a book of a belief system of which I not only do not believe to be a moral way to live, -but it represents a belief system of which has caused me great deal of pain. Sure, that is my personal problem and I should not let it bother me, but never-the-less it does, - to the point that I know I am not going to get to sleep as soon as I had hoped. This is NOT what I had paid for. I had paid to have a quiet living space as analogous to my own home as possible. I believe you are mistaken. In general, there is a mutual relationship implied between guests and owners consisting of reciprocal duties and obligations. The owner's duty is to furnish proper accommodations, and to exercise care for the safety and tranquility of the guest. The guest must exercise due care to refrain from any boisterous, disruptive, or offensive conduct. For more details, all of this comes under ARTICLE 2 - SALES of the Uniform Commercial Code. Next time you go to a hotel take copy of the UCC and start reading it. Sleep will follow very fast! You moved it from the night stand to the trash bin and that is all it took? Why not put it under the dresser drawer? [/span]- get back into clothes other than my bedtime wear & take the BOOK down to the office, hunt down the attendant & file a complaint.[/quote]Call the front desk and have the offending material removed. You could open a Rationalization Hotline that people would call when their moral compass has deviated from the ethical path and you could provide them rationalization for their behavior! The result of rash behavior.
|
|
|
Post by rational on May 28, 2015 1:07:32 GMT -5
No rational, -no one had asked such a question. It was in a reply I made to Wally. Is this a court of law where I can only reply to questions? Not at all. I was just wondering why you would blurt out that you were innocent of a crime if no one had accused you.
|
|
|
Post by dmmichgood on May 28, 2015 2:29:35 GMT -5
Indeed you have a point, rational. Since the hotel received them as a "gift" from the Gideons, -they are now the property of that hotel. The hotel puts them into the rooms which the hotel will then rent out as living space. I have paid money to rent that living space. I am renting the hotel room in which I hope to feel as comfortable as possibly to my own home When I am ready to go to sleep & I open the drawer of the bedside table in order to place my own personal items into the drawer as I would have in my own bedside table in my own bedroom in my own home. There staring me in the face is a BIBLE, -a book of a belief system of which I not only do not believe to be a moral way to live, -but it represents a belief system of which has caused me great deal of pain. Sure, that is my personal problem and I should not let it bother me, but never-the-less it does, - to the point that I know I am not going to get to sleep as soon as I had hoped. This is NOT what I had paid for. I had paid to have a quiet living space as analogous to my own home as possible. I believe you are mistaken. In general, there is a mutual relationship implied between guests and owners consisting of reciprocal duties and obligations. The owner's duty is to furnish proper accommodations, and to exercise care for the safety and tranquility of the guest. The guest must exercise due care to refrain from any boisterous, disruptive, or offensive conduct.For more details, all of this comes under ARTICLE 2 - SALES of the Uniform Commercial Code. Next time you go to a hotel take copy of the UCC and start reading it. Sleep will follow very fast! You moved it from the night stand to the trash bin and that is all it took? Why not put it under the dresser drawer? [/span]- get back into clothes other than my bedtime wear & take the BOOK down to the office, hunt down the attendant & file a complaint.[/quote]Call the front desk and have the offending material removed. You could open a Rationalization Hotline that people would call when their moral compass has deviated from the ethical path and you could provide them rationalization for their behavior! The result of rash behavior. [/quote] "rash behavior"Ah, yes! That is a hard thing to have to admit for someone like me who is usually so with it that nothing fazes me.
Oh, it does indeed require me to to refrain from any "boisterous, disruptive, or offensive conduct ," like throwing the book at the walls or through the window, but I just try to take a few deep breaths and maintain my cool.
"Why not put it under the dresser drawer?" Great idea ! I'll try that next time. ( but wouldn't that make the dresser drawer get stuck and that might cause someone to swear? - causing me of another moral dilemma?
"You could open a Rationalization Hotline that people would call when their moral compass has deviated from the ethical path and you could provide them rationalization for their behavior!"
Another great idea, Rational! Would it be a moral problem if I charged a fee for advise, -you know, -just a very small fee of course?
I do like the idea of "hid the bible."
Trying to think of places: behind that painting you gave to the hotel? under the mattress? Head or foot? (don't want there to be lump that might bother someone's sleep.) behind the bed headboard? No, (that is usually attached to the wall) in the toilet tank ? OH, NO! THAT MIGHT CAUSE THE BATH ROOM TO FLOOD! between the toilet tank & wall would be ok! set the TV on top of it on top of the curtain valance taped under the chair or table or anything else. (of course you need to remember to pack some duck tape in your stuff)
NOT CLOSE TO ANY LIGHTS! YOU DON'T WANT TO START A FIRE!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 28, 2015 3:58:07 GMT -5
The hotel puts them into the rooms which the hotel will then rent out as living space. I have paid money to rent that living space. I am renting the hotel room in which I hope to feel as comfortable as possibly to my own home
When I am ready to go to sleep & I open the drawer of the bedside table in order to place my own personal items into the drawer as I would have in my own bedside table in my own bedroom in my own home.
There staring me in the face is a BIBLE, -a book of a belief system of which I not only do not believe to be a moral way to live, -but it represents a belief system of which has caused me great deal of pain.
Sure, that is my personal problem and I should not let it bother me, but never-the-less it does, - to the point that I know I am not going to get to sleep as soon as I had hoped. This is NOT what I had paid for. I had paid to have a quiet living space as analogous to my own home as possible. I have options.
-Take this book that I wouldn't have in my bedside table at home and pitch it in the nearest trash can.
- get back into clothes other than my bedtime wear & take the BOOK down to the office, hunt down the attendant & file a complaint. -see it as an opportunity to "teach" those that rent the room after me by underlining some of the choice verses such as 1 Sam.15:3 and put a book mark there that says "read this,"
But then, I have a very real moral dilemma, worst than destroying a book. Could I be doing something to some future person who rented that room with the same expectations as I had, something just as distressing as I had just experienced?
I plead guilty to destroying hotel property.
So, using your reasoning, if I was staying in a hotel would I be justified in pitching the TV into the nearest trashcan? Or should I just hide the 'remote' thingy?
|
|
|
Post by magpie on May 28, 2015 5:53:16 GMT -5
Dear ol'Rationale, Atheists DONT have a Satanic Bible,that is the Satinists,you can buy one via Amazon... Also Atheists have their own,they deny Satins existance also. Two different,cant say Faiths for Atheists they have none, Satinists have a Faith in opposites to Judaic/Christian followers.
|
|
|
Post by dmmichgood on May 28, 2015 16:20:45 GMT -5
The hotel puts them into the rooms which the hotel will then rent out as living space. I have paid money to rent that living space. I am renting the hotel room in which I hope to feel as comfortable as possibly to my own home
When I am ready to go to sleep & I open the drawer of the bedside table in order to place my own personal items into the drawer as I would have in my own bedside table in my own bedroom in my own home.
There staring me in the face is a BIBLE, -a book of a belief system of which I not only do not believe to be a moral way to live, -but it represents a belief system of which has caused me great deal of pain.
Sure, that is my personal problem and I should not let it bother me, but never-the-less it does, - to the point that I know I am not going to get to sleep as soon as I had hoped. This is NOT what I had paid for. I had paid to have a quiet living space as analogous to my own home as possible. I have options.
-Take this book that I wouldn't have in my bedside table at home and pitch it in the nearest trash can.
- get back into clothes other than my bedtime wear & take the BOOK down to the office, hunt down the attendant & file a complaint. -see it as an opportunity to "teach" those that rent the room after me by underlining some of the choice verses such as 1 Sam.15:3 and put a book mark there that says "read this,"
But then, I have a very real moral dilemma, worst than destroying a book. Could I be doing something to some future person who rented that room with the same expectations as I had, something just as distressing as I had just experienced?
I plead guilty to destroying hotel property.
So, using your reasoning, if I was staying in a hotel would I be justified in pitching the TV into the nearest trashcan? Or should I just hide the 'remote' thingy? NO, you would not be justified in pitching the TV into the nearest trashcan. Sorry. The TV cost the hotel money to begin with and would cost them money to replace the TV.
The Gideons would replace the bibles as needed free of charge to the hotel.
Even though the bibles are the hotel's "property," - they were a "gift" to them from an outside group, the Gideons who are using the hotel to proselytize a certain belief system.
|
|
|
Post by xna on May 28, 2015 17:11:51 GMT -5
So, using your reasoning, if I was staying in a hotel would I be justified in pitching the TV into the nearest trashcan? Or should I just hide the 'remote' thingy? NO, you would not be justified in pitching the TV into the nearest trashcan. Sorry. The TV cost the hotel money to begin with and would cost them money to replace the TV.
The Gideons would replace the bibles as needed free of charge to the hotel.
Even though the bibles are the hotel's "property," - they were a "gift" to them from an outside group, the Gideons who are using the hotel to proselytize a certain belief system.
"Gideons actually want you to steal the Gideon Bible from your hotel room" www.slate.com/blogs/quora/2013/06/06/hotel_travel_when_is_it_stealing_to_take_items_from_your_hotel_room.html
|
|
|
Post by emy on May 28, 2015 21:16:26 GMT -5
So, using your reasoning, if I was staying in a hotel would I be justified in pitching the TV into the nearest trashcan? Or should I just hide the 'remote' thingy? GOOD one!
|
|
|
Post by emerald on May 28, 2015 21:30:25 GMT -5
So, using your reasoning, if I was staying in a hotel would I be justified in pitching the TV into the nearest trashcan? Or should I just hide the 'remote' thingy? NO, you would not be justified in pitching the TV into the nearest trashcan. Sorry. The TV cost the hotel money to begin with and would cost them money to replace the TV.
The Gideons would replace the bibles as needed free of charge to the hotel.
Even though the bibles are the hotel's "property," - they were a "gift" to them from an outside group, the Gideons who are using the hotel to proselytize a certain belief system.
So someone donates a valuable painting to an hotel you happen to stay in and you don't like it. By your reasoning you feel you are within your rights to take a knife to it and slash it. That's childish, vindictive and destructive. Can't you just put the Bible somewhere out of sight? Or are your sensiblilies so delicate that you have to destroy things you don't like?
|
|
|
Post by dmmichgood on May 29, 2015 1:23:32 GMT -5
NO, you would not be justified in pitching the TV into the nearest trashcan. Sorry. The TV cost the hotel money to begin with and would cost them money to replace the TV.
The Gideons would replace the bibles as needed free of charge to the hotel.
Even though the bibles are the hotel's "property," - they were a "gift" to them from an outside group, the Gideons who are using the hotel to proselytize a certain belief system.
So someone donates a valuable painting to an hotel you happen to stay in and you don't like it. By your reasoning you feel you are within your rights to take a knife to it and slash it. That's childish, vindictive and destructive. Can't you just put the Bible somewhere out of sight? Or are your sensiblilies so delicate that you have to destroy things you don't like? If it were a valuable painting, there wouldn't be one in every room in the hotel and easily replaced by the extras copies from the housekeeping staff.
When I pay money to rent a space to rest, as I do when I rent a hotel room, I believe that I have a right to not have to confront something that is nothing for my benefit & is only proselytizing someone elses religious belief. "When a hotel opens, local Gideons members will present a Bible to the hotel's general manager in a small ceremony and then give enough books for each room and some extras to the housekeeping staff for distribution."
You might want to consider this:
"Based on the success of the Gideons’ Bible project -- --other religious groups have begun distributing their own free literature to hotels.
The Marriott hotel chain, founded by a Mormon, places the The Book of Mormon in many of its rooms, and many hotels also offer Buddhist, Hindu, Christian Scientist or Scientologist books along with the standard Gideon Bible."
Suppose that you have gone through your bedtime routine, your are yawning and ready to sleep. You open the bedside drawer to put your bible in the drawer so you have it ready to read in the morning.
There is The Book of Mormon or a book on the beliefs of Scientology, or the Quran.
If nothing else, -it would remind you that your Christian god wasn't the only god other people in the world worshiped & just might disturb you a little.
|
|
|
Post by maryhig on May 29, 2015 1:47:50 GMT -5
So someone donates a valuable painting to an hotel you happen to stay in and you don't like it. By your reasoning you feel you are within your rights to take a knife to it and slash it. That's childish, vindictive and destructive. Can't you just put the Bible somewhere out of sight? Or are your sensiblilies so delicate that you have to destroy things you don't like? If it were a valuable painting, there wouldn't be one in every room in the hotel and easily replaced by the extras copies from the housekeeping staff.
When I pay money to rent a space to rest, as I do when I rent a hotel room, I believe that I have a right to not have to confront something that is nothing for my benefit & is only proselytizing someone elses religious belief. "When a hotel opens, local Gideons members will present a Bible to the hotel's general manager in a small ceremony and then give enough books for each room and some extras to the housekeeping staff for distribution."
You might want to consider this:
"Based on the success of the Gideons’ Bible project -- --other religious groups have begun distributing their own free literature to hotels.
The Marriott hotel chain, founded by a Mormon, places the The Book of Mormon in many of its rooms, and many hotels also offer Buddhist, Hindu, Christian Scientist or Scientologist books along with the standard Gideon Bible."
Suppose that you have gone through your bedtime routine, your are yawning and ready to sleep. You open the bedside drawer to put your bible in the drawer so you have it ready to read in the morning.
There is The Book of Mormon or a book on the beliefs of Scientology, or the Quran.
If nothing else, -it would remind you that your Christian god wasn't the only god other people in the world worshiped & just might disturb you a little.
It wouldn't disturb me, but if i felt disturbed by anything in the drawer, I'd just put it in the cupboard below, neatly!
|
|
|
Post by BobWilliston on May 29, 2015 1:51:12 GMT -5
How did atheists get changed to Satanists?
But since we're talking about Satanists -- their scripture is the Holy Bible, particularly the New Testament. Their concept of and belief in Satan comes from their Christian origins (who else has a Satan like that), and they quote the Bible in their preaching -- as many times as I've heard them preaching. They're actually an offshoot of Christianity.
|
|
|
Post by dmmichgood on May 29, 2015 3:58:26 GMT -5
If it were a valuable painting, there wouldn't be one in every room in the hotel and easily replaced by the extras copies from the housekeeping staff.
When I pay money to rent a space to rest, as I do when I rent a hotel room, I believe that I have a right to not have to confront something that is nothing for my benefit & is only proselytizing someone elses religious belief. "When a hotel opens, local Gideons members will present a Bible to the hotel's general manager in a small ceremony and then give enough books for each room and some extras to the housekeeping staff for distribution."
You might want to consider this:
"Based on the success of the Gideons’ Bible project -- --other religious groups have begun distributing their own free literature to hotels.
The Marriott hotel chain, founded by a Mormon, places the The Book of Mormon in many of its rooms, and many hotels also offer Buddhist, Hindu, Christian Scientist or Scientologist books along with the standard Gideon Bible."
Suppose that you have gone through your bedtime routine, your are yawning and ready to sleep. You open the bedside drawer to put your bible in the drawer so you have it ready to read in the morning.
There is The Book of Mormon or a book on the beliefs of Scientology, or the Quran.
If nothing else, -it would remind you that your Christian god wasn't the only god other people in the world worshiped & just might disturb you a little.
It wouldn't disturb me, but if i felt disturbed by anything in the drawer, I'd just put it in the cupboard below, neatly! Of course you would! And you haven't been disturbed by some things said on this board that challenged your beliefs either, have you?
|
|
|
Post by dmmichgood on May 29, 2015 4:05:30 GMT -5
The satanists have their own Bible. The Satanic Bible consists of 4 books such as The book of Satan, The book of Lucifer etc. Look on the Internet. Never-the-less, there wouldn't have been Satanists if there hadn't been Christian belief in a Satan to begin with.
s
|
|
|
Post by magpie on May 29, 2015 7:04:01 GMT -5
Gideons- Are Christians from most Countries ,of so many persuasions working together, to get into all the World with the Word,preaching as we all know is not the only way the word is spread. Our own personal witness is one. Many Hotels refuse the word,gladly many dont, in the top draw,the donts is because they are weak and think it may be offensive to many travellers. Of course you Irvinites of the Secret Sect wont have,BUT, so many of us have heard people saying that it was those lonley nights in their travels that when alone they started to read the word. (DO YOU DONATE TO HELP THE $ MILLIONS NEEDED BY THIS WORLDWIDE SERVICE THE GIDEONS AND THOUSANDS OF VOLUNTEERS COST ARE COSTS?) Many have been revitalised,but many the first time scripture came into their life. Glad they didnt wait for a 2x2 Secret Sect representative to turn up to Oodnatta or Tahiti to speak to them. Look up Gideons then you can all comment.I know people who keep themselves quite possession poor because they provide so much of their time and resourses to this wonderfull service in spreading GODS WORD free to so many WORLD WIDE.
|
|
|
Post by magpie on May 29, 2015 7:36:13 GMT -5
Me again, Well look up Gideons International on Wikipedia. This year April 2 (TWO) billionth Bible distributed,since 1905. 200 countries and over 90 languages (they wont all be KJV). Look them up,study what it's reason is? TO SPREAD THE GOSPEL INTO ALL THE WORLD,and note they are not on Wings submission to Australias Royal Commission regards the CSA Deviants in 2x2 Ministry,worrying about closing in on their few,shrinking numbers,to save face,"NO" they the volunteers of Gideons and the Bible Society fan OUT to expand the coverage of the Gospel.You will find their bibles in prison liberies and cells. Remember one mans conversion story,He would read a page then tear it into cigerette papers,one day he was released,walking down the street he wanted to approach a known House of Ladies something held him,he at that moment was able to recognise the power of the Holy Spirit. Now he preaches to prisoners,many congregations often invited to speak at Corporate gatherings---the pages he read before he smoked them. "GIDEONS & BIBLE SOCIETY"
|
|
|
Post by rational on May 29, 2015 7:52:28 GMT -5
If it were a valuable painting, there wouldn't be one in every room in the hotel and easily replaced by the extras copies from the housekeeping staff. If I didn't know better I would think you are equating the morality of destroying the property of another based on the amount they paid for the object or the ease with which it can be replaced. I sent you a link to the UCC that outlines your rights. In reading it I did not see '...destruction of hotel property is allowed if the customer determines the property does nothing for their benefit and either has a small monetary value or is readily replaced.'
|
|
|
Post by terfly4fun on May 29, 2015 12:23:16 GMT -5
Speaking of stealing ... would atheists steal? I mean ... where/what is their reference to "moral conduct?" Would an atheist feel any shame based on lying, stealing, cheating, or killing? If not, why not? If so, why? It seems to me that if atheists were in charge of the world all would be complete anarchy ... I mean ... do they believe in any moral code at all, or just laws? If they believe in laws, heck, laws change all the time. I've seen Gideon Bibles in motel rooms with profanity written in them, some of the pages torn out, ketchup all over them, and worse, much worse, on them, an I believe like someone said, they want you to take their Bible, really, because they want the sincere to read it. I'd guess they'd prefer someone who is desperately searching for Biblical help take the Bible than some immoral person writing profanity in it, tearing the pages out, etc. I'm not trying to start an argument here, but if that is what it comes to ... let's have at it! Otherwise, I'm sincerely trying to understand exactly how it would be if atheists were in charge. I don't think I really want to find out.
|
|
|
Post by applesandbacon on May 29, 2015 13:11:22 GMT -5
If it were a valuable painting, there wouldn't be one in every room in the hotel and easily replaced by the extras copies from the housekeeping staff. If I didn't know better I would think you are equating the morality of destroying the property of another based on the amount they paid for the object or the ease with which it can be replaced. I sent you a link to the UCC that outlines your rights. In reading it I did not see '...destruction of hotel property is allowed if the customer determines the property does nothing for their benefit and either has a small monetary value or is readily replaced.' Maybe it's the hotel's responsibility to make sure there's nothing of interest in the trash before they take it out (bibles, babies, etc.)? After all, dmmichgood didn't steal or destroy the bible, she simply placed it in a different part of the room!
|
|
|
Post by snow on May 29, 2015 14:49:39 GMT -5
Speaking of stealing ... would atheists steal? I mean ... where/what is their reference to "moral conduct?" Would an atheist feel any shame based on lying, stealing, cheating, or killing? If not, why not? If so, why? It seems to me that if atheists were in charge of the world all would be complete anarchy ... I mean ... do they believe in any moral code at all, or just laws? If they believe in laws, heck, laws change all the time. I've seen Gideon Bibles in motel rooms with profanity written in them, some of the pages torn out, ketchup all over them, and worse, much worse, on them, an I believe like someone said, they want you to take their Bible, really, because they want the sincere to read it. I'd guess they'd prefer someone who is desperately searching for Biblical help take the Bible than some immoral person writing profanity in it, tearing the pages out, etc. I'm not trying to start an argument here, but if that is what it comes to ... let's have at it! Otherwise, I'm sincerely trying to understand exactly how it would be if atheists were in charge. I don't think I really want to find out. Lol, of course some will do all of those things just like theists. Some will not, just like theists. Morality is not based on fear of going to hell. Morality is based on compassion and respect for other human beings and all of creation. I don't really understand why theists think morality is based on a threat of hell? Personally I believe in treating people with respect and dignity. It is not respectful to take what is not mine, to lie etc. I try to base things on how I would feel if it happened to me and go from there. I tend to do things based on how it would affect those around me and society in general. I like living in a world where people respect each other not a world that divides humanity into groups which happens a lot with theists btw. I don't believe it is moral to discriminate against someone because of the color of their skin, their gender or their sexual identity but I know theists that definitely do. I am an atheist and believe that we need to protect the rights of all people with different beliefs as long as their beliefs do not cause hurt or harm to others. I find what theists do to be downright scary myself. xna posted a video on things that happened because of religion for just one month and it goes to show you that theists are no more moral then atheists. It depends on the person not what people label them as (theists or atheists).
|
|
|
Post by rational on May 29, 2015 19:57:42 GMT -5
Speaking of stealing ... would atheists steal? No more than theists.You mean because an atheist is not worried that a paranormal will see the deed and whack them? It may come as a surprise to you but some atheists actually have a moral compass that leads them to make ethical choices. This is in contrast to some theists who are merely following orders found in a variety of ancient texts. Who do you think has the stronger moral code? Do you feel shame for essentially accusing atheists of being immoral? Given that the majority of people are not atheists are you suggesting it was atheists who defaced the bibles? Can you think of a motive an atheist might have?Destroying property that belongs to someone else is illegal. Most would consider it immoral. I am having some difficulty following where you are going.I don't think there will be much of an argument unless you have some new data regarding the morality of atheists vs. theists. The atheist writing this uses the ethic of reciprocity as a base for his moral compass. I think the first thing you need to do is some research. You might start here.
|
|