|
Post by snow on May 22, 2015 13:51:36 GMT -5
Maryhig, I have long ago reasoned that those who believe in God will interpret these kinds of things as proof of a God, when I would just see it as a coincidence. I think there is a very major difference in the way non believers process these kinds of things in comparison to believers. I'm not saying that to negate what you said, I just think it's fact that the two groups seem to process same events quite differently. Right or wrong, we just think differently. I don't have the ability to just have faith in something being true for the most part. I need proof, tangible proof. I don't have to experience it to believe it's true, but I do need to have concrete proof. So what type of fallacy would that be under Snow how can it be a coincidence? My son asked me "how is God everywhere?" And 3 to 4 hours later in the meeting my uncle whilst reading the bible stopped, pointed at my son and said " good question, how is God everywhere? " and then answered him, neither of us had discussed it since our conversation earlier. And I left the house with my son and he hadn't talked about it to anyone! I know God is there, it's no fallacy whatsoever! It may be to you but I'm the one who's lived it! I have complete faith in God! Furthermore I've had a whole lot more that happened to me too! You have no idea! But one thing I do know. God is everywhere! I believe you that you totally believe it. I was just letting you know how I would process it. I thought it was interesting and probably a reason why some are believers and some are not. We simply process things differently. Wasn't saying you were wrong, or wrong for believing, just giving you insight into my thoughts. Never mind I was just thinking out loud/in writing...
|
|
|
Post by maryhig on May 23, 2015 0:29:11 GMT -5
Snow how can it be a coincidence? My son asked me "how is God everywhere?" And 3 to 4 hours later in the meeting my uncle whilst reading the bible stopped, pointed at my son and said " good question, how is God everywhere? " and then answered him, neither of us had discussed it since our conversation earlier. And I left the house with my son and he hadn't talked about it to anyone! I know God is there, it's no fallacy whatsoever! It may be to you but I'm the one who's lived it! I have complete faith in God! Furthermore I've had a whole lot more that happened to me too! You have no idea! But one thing I do know. God is everywhere! I believe you that you totally believe it. I was just letting you know how I would process it. I thought it was interesting and probably a reason why some are believers and some are not. We simply process things differently. Wasn't saying you were wrong, or wrong for believing, just giving you insight into my thoughts. Never mind I was just thinking out loud/in writing... Thats good, because I'm being honest I don't just believe it. I also know Gods there and things like that don't happen everyday! It was unreal! I've had some things happen in my life that are inexplicable! God has blessed me by showing me wonders from heaven. I could never deny him. He is my father and my God!
|
|
|
Post by withlove on May 23, 2015 0:42:59 GMT -5
So did only Trinitarians vote on this poll? It's nearly evenly split.
|
|
|
Post by maryhig on May 23, 2015 0:44:27 GMT -5
So did only Trinitarians vote on this poll? It's nearly evenly split. I can't find any poll, is that because I'm on tapatalk? Where it's it?
|
|
|
Post by withlove on May 23, 2015 0:49:58 GMT -5
Sorry that you can't see it, Mary! It is at the top of every page on this thread.
Is Jesus still a man? Yes, Jesus will eternally remain as a man. 2nd 4 votes (40.00%) No, Jesus was a man only while on the Earth. 1st 6 votes (60.00%) There have been 10 votes by 10 voters.
|
|
|
Post by maryhig on May 23, 2015 1:45:37 GMT -5
Sorry that you can't see it, Mary! It is at the top of every page on this thread. Is Jesus still a man? Yes, Jesus will eternally remain as a man. 2nd 4 votes (40.00%) No, Jesus was a man only while on the Earth. 1st 6 votes (60.00%) There have been 10 votes by 10 voters. Oh I'm with the Jesus was only a man whilst on earth vote. so that's 7
|
|
|
Post by fixit on May 23, 2015 3:06:53 GMT -5
Sorry that you can't see it, Mary! It is at the top of every page on this thread. Is Jesus still a man? Yes, Jesus will eternally remain as a man. 2nd 4 votes (40.00%) No, Jesus was a man only while on the Earth. 1st 6 votes (60.00%) There have been 10 votes by 10 voters. Oh I'm with the Jesus was only a man whilst on earth vote. so that's 7 Did you tick the box? It hasn't gone to seven yet!
|
|
|
Post by maryhig on May 23, 2015 3:12:27 GMT -5
Oh I'm with the Jesus was only a man whilst on earth vote. so that's 7 Did you tick the box? It hasn't gone to seven yet! I can't find it here on tapatalk, Hang on I'll go to the website and look,
|
|
|
Post by maryhig on May 23, 2015 3:15:53 GMT -5
Oh I'm with the Jesus was only a man whilst on earth vote. so that's 7 Did you tick the box? It hasn't gone to seven yet! Found it the poll doesn't show up on the Tapatalk app, but it's easier for me to use that app on my phone! Maybe others can't see it too?
|
|
|
Post by withlove on May 23, 2015 17:38:06 GMT -5
Oh I'm with the Jesus was only a man whilst on earth vote. so that's 7 Did you tick the box? It hasn't gone to seven yet! Is this poll open to everyone or just Trinitarians?
|
|
|
Post by dmmichgood on May 23, 2015 20:38:30 GMT -5
No, it is not logical fallacy of circular reasoning; it is the logical fallacy of Appeal to Emotion An Appeal to Emotion is a fallacy with the following structure:
Favorable emotions are associated with X. Therefore, X is true.
This fallacy is committed when someone manipulates peoples' emotions in order to get them to accept a claim as being true. More formally, this sort of "reasoning" involves the substitution of various means of producing strong emotions in place of evidence for a claim.
If the favorable emotions associated with X influence the person to accept X as true because they "feel good about X," then he has fallen prey to the fallacy. Google Logical Fallacies to see what I mean.
How about me talking to my son about God, a question he asked and I couldn't explain. Then a few hours later, someone giving him not only the answer, but also the question he asked earlier.
Without even knowing what we had been talking about.
Because this happened to me and my son. So I can't deny God! I know he's there!
So what type of fallacy would that be under? One of these types of Fallacies
Fallacies of Presumption Presumption of truth without proof can cause a logical fallacy. Examples include: Affirming the Consequent (Poorly formed argument without reasonable premise) Arguing from Ignorance (Inference of truth to argument just because it is not known to be false) Begging the Question / Circular Reasoning (Conclusion is among the premises) Complex Question Fallacy (Involves questionable assumption) *Cum Hoc Fallacy (Poorly assumed correlation of two things) False Dilemma / Bifurcation Fallacy (Requiring a choice between only two choices when another is available) *Hasty Generalisation Fallacy (Uses only one, abnormal situation) "No True Scotsman" Fallacy (Reinterpretation of evidence) *Post Hoc Fallacy (Assumption of cause and effect) Slippery Slope Fallacy (False assumption of consequences of action) Sweeping Generalisation Fallacy (Too broad of an application of a premise) *Subjectivist Fallacy (Lack of questioning of premises) Tu Quoque Fallacy (The concept of “someone else did it so I can”) By considering these different types of logic errors and logical fallacy, it is easier to spot these errors when they occur and to avoid making these errors in logic yourself. *Anyone of those by the star could be the fallacy that was used to arrive at the presumption that you did.
|
|
|
Post by maryhig on May 23, 2015 20:49:26 GMT -5
How about me talking to my son about God, a question he asked and I couldn't explain. Then a few hours later, someone giving him not only the answer, but also the question he asked earlier.
Without even knowing what we had been talking about.
Because this happened to me and my son. So I can't deny God! I know he's there!
So what type of fallacy would that be under? One of these types of Fallacies
Fallacies of Presumption Presumption of truth without proof can cause a logical fallacy. Examples include: Affirming the Consequent (Poorly formed argument without reasonable premise) Arguing from Ignorance (Inference of truth to argument just because it is not known to be false) Begging the Question / Circular Reasoning (Conclusion is among the premises) Complex Question Fallacy (Involves questionable assumption) *Cum Hoc Fallacy (Poorly assumed correlation of two things) False Dilemma / Bifurcation Fallacy (Requiring a choice between only two choices when another is available) *Hasty Generalisation Fallacy (Uses only one, abnormal situation) "No True Scotsman" Fallacy (Reinterpretation of evidence) *Post Hoc Fallacy (Assumption of cause and effect) Slippery Slope Fallacy (False assumption of consequences of action) Sweeping Generalisation Fallacy (Too broad of an application of a premise) *Subjectivist Fallacy (Lack of questioning of premises) Tu Quoque Fallacy (The concept of “someone else did it so I can”) By considering these different types of logic errors and logical fallacy, it is easier to spot these errors when they occur and to avoid making these errors in logic yourself. *Anyone of those by the star could be the fallacy that was used to arrive at the presumption that you did.As I said in another post, I've lived without fallacies for nearly 50 years, I think I can carry on without them thanks. I prefer to have faith and believe!
|
|
|
Post by dmmichgood on May 23, 2015 23:24:29 GMT -5
One of these types of Fallacies
Fallacies of Presumption Presumption of truth without proof can cause a logical fallacy. Examples include: Affirming the Consequent (Poorly formed argument without reasonable premise) Arguing from Ignorance (Inference of truth to argument just because it is not known to be false) Begging the Question / Circular Reasoning (Conclusion is among the premises) Complex Question Fallacy (Involves questionable assumption) *Cum Hoc Fallacy (Poorly assumed correlation of two things) False Dilemma / Bifurcation Fallacy (Requiring a choice between only two choices when another is available) *Hasty Generalisation Fallacy (Uses only one, abnormal situation) "No True Scotsman" Fallacy (Reinterpretation of evidence) *Post Hoc Fallacy (Assumption of cause and effect) Slippery Slope Fallacy (False assumption of consequences of action) Sweeping Generalisation Fallacy (Too broad of an application of a premise) *Subjectivist Fallacy (Lack of questioning of premises) Tu Quoque Fallacy (The concept of “someone else did it so I can”) By considering these different types of logic errors and logical fallacy, it is easier to spot these errors when they occur and to avoid making these errors in logic yourself. *Anyone of those by the star could be the fallacy that was used to arrive at the presumption that you did.As I said in another post, I've lived without fallacies for nearly 50 years, I think I can carry on without them thanks. I prefer to have faith and believe! I just couldn't resist saying this! Sorry!
I think it is the other way round; that you have "lived WITH fallacies! "
You will have to live with what is comfortable for YOU, I guess.
|
|
|
Post by maryhig on May 23, 2015 23:26:10 GMT -5
As I said in another post, I've lived without fallacies for nearly 50 years, I think I can carry on without them thanks. I prefer to have faith and believe! I just couldn't resist saying this! Sorry!
I think it is the other way round; that you have "lived WITH fallacies! "
You will have to live with what is comfortable for YOU, I guess.
Thank you
|
|
|
Post by Greg on May 23, 2015 23:47:27 GMT -5
Biblically, Jesus was the son of God, but not God . . . the image of God, but not God . . . filled with the Holy Spirit, but not God . . . one with the Father (God), but not God.
I think I have the right mind on this. If you cannot see it . . wait for it . . . it's a progressive learning. If you cannot understand, then understand that it is a mystery. If you refuse this understanding, you might be swayed by a cult or pseudo-Christian set.
|
|
|
Post by fixit on May 24, 2015 1:50:35 GMT -5
Is this poll open to everyone or just Trinitarians? Open to anyone who understands the questions on the poll. The questions on the Poll is very confusing! and NOT very clear in what it means. Is Jesus still a man? 1) Yes, Jesus will eternally remain as a man. 2) No, Jesus was a man only while on the Earth. ~~ How can Jesus remains eternally as a man when flesh and blood can't enter in the kingdom of heaven? Unless he entered the kingdom of heaven with his resurrection body. Historically, and forever more Jesus had two natures with Him God and Man.I don't know how I could word it better Nathan. Do you? Here's the post that prompted the question: Jesus Christ is the Word (God) who became a man. He added human nature to His divine nature. He is both human and divine and, therefore, has two natures. Yet, He is one person--not two. He is not part God and part man. He is presently a man, one person, with two natures where one nature is wholly God and the other wholly man. (Phil. 2:5-11; Col. 2:9; 1 Tim. 3:16; Heb. 1:5-13; John 1:1-3, 14). Jesus will eternally remain as a man and intercedes for us eternally as a high priest after the order of Melchizedek. (Heb. 6:20; 7:25). Is there anything a professing person can find wrong in the statement of beliefs which CARM adheres to? carm.org/statement-faithMary asked if we can find anything wrong with CARM's beliefs. I believe heaven to be a spiritual realm. Man is designed for this world. "Orthodox" Christians have made the man Christ Jesus into God, and they've made God into man.
|
|
|
Post by fixit on May 24, 2015 15:24:48 GMT -5
Mary was not the mother of Christ, but she was the mother of Jesus...
|
|
|
Post by fixit on May 25, 2015 23:24:05 GMT -5
So there's only four votes so far for the theology that God changed forever at the incarnation to incorporate a human component (100% human and 100% god).
Good to see I'm not the only one whose faith is in a non-human God.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 26, 2015 3:36:30 GMT -5
So there's only four votes so far for the theology that God changed forever at the incarnation to incorporate a human component (100% human and 100% god). Good to see I'm not the only one whose faith is in a non-human God. So there you have it .... all decided by a TMB poll. Seriously, as Mary pointed out, what will our King will look like when he returns as the Son of Man and reigns on earth. Presumably he'll still be in his glorified (human) body as the Scriptures suggest. Why is a physical resurrection important? Why are our bodies raised from the grave? ? Who says our bodies are raised from the grave? I do not agree with the theory that there'll be human flesh in heaven, but like I posted already I do not know what the immortal body will look like. However, I don't think anyone was implying that the human body we're born with was going to be raised from the grave?
|
|
|
Post by maryhig on May 26, 2015 3:48:18 GMT -5
So there's only four votes so far for the theology that God changed forever at the incarnation to incorporate a human component (100% human and 100% god). Good to see I'm not the only one whose faith is in a non-human God. So there you have it .... all decided by a TMB poll. Seriously, as Mary pointed out, what will our King will look like when he returns as the Son of Man and reigns on earth. Presumably he'll still be in his glorified (human) body as the Scriptures suggest. Why is a physical resurrection important? Why are our bodies raised from the grave? That glorified flesh is us that he's returning in! Romans 8 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together. Romans 11 But if the spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead, dwell in you: he that raised up Christ from the dead, shall also quicken your mortal bodies, by his spirit that dwelleth in you. Colossians 1:27 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory: We are the human body that he's glorified in, when we let him into our hearts and he is resurrected in us and with us! And we let his light shine through us as we put away our old life, and are born anew in Christ! I don't know about the natural, but Christ Jesus is already spiritually risen in our hearts. And our physical resurrection is here and now with him in our hearts! Colossians 3 If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God. Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth. For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God. When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 26, 2015 4:06:07 GMT -5
? Who says our bodies are raised from the grave? I do not agree with the theory that there'll be human flesh in heaven, but like I posted already I do not know what the immortal body will look like. However, I don't think anyone was implying that the human body we're born with was going to be raised from the grave? It will be the same resurrection body which Jesus had after he was raised from the dead. That could eat food, appear and disappear at will, going up in the sky.That gives rise to more questions than it answers. How can we eat without a digestive system? I can't imagine there'll be perishable food in heaven. I think there are a lot of questions we'll just have to wait to find out when life as we know it is over.
|
|
|
Post by maryhig on May 26, 2015 4:08:34 GMT -5
? Who says our bodies are raised from the grave? I do not agree with the theory that there'll be human flesh in heaven, but like I posted already I do not know what the immortal body will look like. However, I don't think anyone was implying that the human body we're born with was going to be raised from the grave? It will be the same resurrection body which Jesus had after he was raised from the dead. That could eat food, appear and disappear at will, going up in the sky. Whatever body Jesus has the believers will have the same kind of bodies like he does.Nathan, he went up into heaven, not the sky.
|
|
|
Post by dmmichgood on May 26, 2015 4:16:51 GMT -5
It will be the same resurrection body which Jesus had after he was raised from the dead. That could eat food, appear and disappear at will, going up in the sky. Whatever body Jesus has the believers will have the same kind of bodies like he does. Nathan, he went up into heaven, not the sky. Acts 1:9 describes the Ascension as follows: "And when he had said these things, as they were looking, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight."
ehum... clouds in heaven?
|
|
|
Post by maryhig on May 26, 2015 4:17:42 GMT -5
Nathan, he went up into heaven, not the sky. Acts 1:9 describes the Ascension as follows: "And when he had said these things, as they were looking, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight."
ehum... clouds in heaven?
Yes, clouds in heaven
|
|
|
Post by dmmichgood on May 26, 2015 4:30:23 GMT -5
Acts 1:9 describes the Ascension as follows: "And when he had said these things, as they were looking, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight."
ehum... clouds in heaven?
Yes, clouds in heaven Clouds indicate not "sunny."
Strange; From some where I had gotten the impression that all was "sunshine" in "heaven!"
|
|
|
Post by maryhig on May 26, 2015 4:32:09 GMT -5
Yes, clouds in heaven Clouds indicate not "sunny."
Strange; From some where I had gotten the impression that all was "sunshine" in "heaven!"
Clouds indicate water, and there's plenty of water in heaven!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 26, 2015 14:37:58 GMT -5
I think there is some truth to what Maryhig is saying, but also that Jesus will also return visibly, in a glorified body, at his second coming. Yes, Jesus may return spiritually into our heats. But, I think it's pretty clear in the bible that he'll also return literally in the future.
|
|
|
Post by fixit on May 26, 2015 15:04:46 GMT -5
So there's only four votes so far for the theology that God changed forever at the incarnation to incorporate a human component (100% human and 100% god). Good to see I'm not the only one whose faith is in a non-human God. So there you have it .... all decided by a TMB poll. Seriously, as Mary pointed out, what will our King will look like when he returns as the Son of Man and reigns on earth. Presumably he'll still be in his glorified (human) body as the Scriptures suggest. Why is a physical resurrection important? Why are our bodies raised from the grave? Do we believe God can put a body back together than has been cremated?
|
|