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Post by terfly4fun on May 14, 2015 12:49:04 GMT -5
I can see witchcraft being "wrong" perhaps; but, is astrology wrong?
Neither shall ye use enchantment, nor observe times. Leviticus 19:26 There shall not be found among you any ... that useth divination, or an observer of times.... For all that do these things are an abomination unto the LORD. Deuteronomy 18:10-12.
Let now the astrologers, the stargazers, the monthly prognosticators, stand up, and save thee from these things that shall come upon thee. Behold, they shall be as stubble; the fire shall burn them; they shall not deliver themselves from the power of the flame: there shall not be a coal to warm at, nor fire to sit before it. Isaiah 47:13-14 Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them. Jeremiah 10:2
I will cut off ... them that worship the host of heaven. Zephaniah 1:4-5
What about the STAR IN THE EAST WHEN CHRIST WAS BORN? When Jesus was born, “wise men” (astrologers?) saw his star. Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem, Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him. Matthew 2:1-2
I've always thought that God created the stars, at least in part, as "signs."
And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years. Genesis 1:14
When God inspired Jael to pound a tent stake through the sleeping Sisera’s skull, he did so with the help of the stars. The stars in their courses fought against Sisera. Judges 5:20
And Jesus said there would be “signs” in the sun, moon, and stars to proclaim the end of the world. And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars. Luke 21:25
Also, what about the use of "mediums" ... e.g. "psychics" to solve crimes? Doesn't that border at least on divination? Is the psychic who solved the crime, for example, of a missing child going to hell?!
Somebody please clarify to me who came up with these ideas and who was on the crack pipe and who wasn't!!!
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Post by terfly4fun on May 14, 2015 12:54:04 GMT -5
... and what about weather forecasters? They're looking at signs by observance of the different types of clouds, for example mama clouds, to predict tornadoes, and thunderstorm activity etc. They're observing the sky, the clouds, the atmosphere, temperature, dew point, etc then "predicting" the weather!!! Is that "wrong?" Are weather forecasters going to get their heads hacked off in hell for predicting the weather?
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2015 14:10:39 GMT -5
When God inspired Jael to pound a tent stake through the sleeping Sisera’s skull, he did so with the help of the stars. The stars in their courses fought against Sisera. Judges 5:20
Jael was actually a woman, and it doesn't say that she was reading the stars. It's more like fate conspired against him.
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Post by snow on May 14, 2015 18:29:08 GMT -5
I can see witchcraft being "wrong" perhaps; but, is astrology wrong?
Neither shall ye use enchantment, nor observe times. Leviticus 19:26 There shall not be found among you any ... that useth divination, or an observer of times.... For all that do these things are an abomination unto the LORD. Deuteronomy 18:10-12.
Let now the astrologers, the stargazers, the monthly prognosticators, stand up, and save thee from these things that shall come upon thee. Behold, they shall be as stubble; the fire shall burn them; they shall not deliver themselves from the power of the flame: there shall not be a coal to warm at, nor fire to sit before it. Isaiah 47:13-14 Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them. Jeremiah 10:2
I will cut off ... them that worship the host of heaven. Zephaniah 1:4-5
What about the STAR IN THE EAST WHEN CHRIST WAS BORN? When Jesus was born, “wise men” (astrologers?) saw his star. Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem, Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him. Matthew 2:1-2
I've always thought that God created the stars, at least in part, as "signs."
And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years. Genesis 1:14
When God inspired Jael to pound a tent stake through the sleeping Sisera’s skull, he did so with the help of the stars. The stars in their courses fought against Sisera. Judges 5:20
And Jesus said there would be “signs” in the sun, moon, and stars to proclaim the end of the world. And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars. Luke 21:25
Also, what about the use of "mediums" ... e.g. "psychics" to solve crimes? Doesn't that border at least on divination? Is the psychic who solved the crime, for example, of a missing child going to hell?!
Somebody please clarify to me who came up with these ideas and who was on the crack pipe and who wasn't!!!
Actually a lot of religious history is based on astrology. Christianity is no different. The 12 tribes of Israel, the 12 apostles, the 12 signs of the zodiac is one example. Easter is not Christian but pagan. Christmas is pagan not Christian. Some of the things that Christians celebrate come from earlier religions, one being the Egyptian Isis with Osiris and Horus for example. Nothing new under the sun/son.
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Post by magpie on May 14, 2015 21:55:07 GMT -5
Hi Snow Easter/Christmas "REPLACED"pagan dates. These chosen days are times we now have used to hi-lite these such important events in the Christian A.D. callender. Sadly commercialism is/has taken over so much,even Coca Cola put St Nicholas (Santa)in red.But it is a time we get the real chance to explain icons and symbals meanings. A Bosnian Muslam girl(tall 6ft blond) asked what all the Christmas things meant,my wife explained what we celebrate. She was sad over the fact that they had no colourful meaningful celebrations for their Holy Days,especially the women.In Russia icons outside mant buildings meant many were able to explain them to following generations,the days after the Iron Curtain dropped the Church Buildings poened and many current generations fill them now,because the story was handed downfrom generation to generation (we have been to Russia and seen the results of this)We can knock dates but let God use them through us to spread the founding Biblical Stories. And yes the Maji (Wise Men)knew to follow a Star.Like God using Cyrus to release His people,Cyrus did not worship the God of Hebrews? Hope this enlightens us both a bit,your question is a good study. Interesting to see others point of view?
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Post by magpie on May 14, 2015 21:56:49 GMT -5
OH YES SNOW,, Witch of Endor,and Mandrakes get a mention also,Regards Maggpie
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2015 23:08:48 GMT -5
I can see witchcraft being "wrong" perhaps; but, is astrology wrong?
Neither shall ye use enchantment, nor observe times. Leviticus 19:26 There shall not be found among you any ... that useth divination, or an observer of times.... For all that do these things are an abomination unto the LORD. Deuteronomy 18:10-12.
Let now the astrologers, the stargazers, the monthly prognosticators, stand up, and save thee from these things that shall come upon thee. Behold, they shall be as stubble; the fire shall burn them; they shall not deliver themselves from the power of the flame: there shall not be a coal to warm at, nor fire to sit before it. Isaiah 47:13-14 Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them. Jeremiah 10:2
I will cut off ... them that worship the host of heaven. Zephaniah 1:4-5
What about the STAR IN THE EAST WHEN CHRIST WAS BORN? When Jesus was born, “wise men” (astrologers?) saw his star. Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem, Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him. Matthew 2:1-2
I've always thought that God created the stars, at least in part, as "signs."
And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years. Genesis 1:14
When God inspired Jael to pound a tent stake through the sleeping Sisera’s skull, he did so with the help of the stars. The stars in their courses fought against Sisera. Judges 5:20
And Jesus said there would be “signs” in the sun, moon, and stars to proclaim the end of the world. And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars. Luke 21:25
Also, what about the use of "mediums" ... e.g. "psychics" to solve crimes? Doesn't that border at least on divination? Is the psychic who solved the crime, for example, of a missing child going to hell?!
Somebody please clarify to me who came up with these ideas and who was on the crack pipe and who wasn't!!!
here is an answer I thought was good:
"Yes, here's why........ in astrology, each "sign" has positive and negative character traits. Every single one of those negative character traits the Bible tells us to stop and have nothing to do with. With help from Jesus, every negative character trait can be removed completely from your personality. Astrology, however, tells you to "embrace" the negative character traits of your sign. Astrology tells you that you can't do anything about them anyway because that's how you were born. The only possibility for changing negative character traits (according to astrology) would be to wait til a certain planet is in "better alignment" with another planet..... which in most cases will take anywhere from 185-732 years from now. Feel like waiting that long? Me neither. Jesus gets us where we want to be SO MUCH FASTER. Amen and Amen! Thank God, Amen." from yahoo answers
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Post by bestastro26 on Aug 3, 2015 7:54:07 GMT -5
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Post by rational on Aug 3, 2015 8:23:38 GMT -5
The career astrology produces your occupation or functioning outline based on the zodiac signs of the Vedic astrology. It confirms further about your occupation outline and the unusual types of works that ensemble your qualities. I think it is time to put on some rubber boots!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2015 8:46:38 GMT -5
Is astrology wrong? Are fairies real? Do aliens exist? What about angels?
Interesting - they are all, oddly enough, different questions.
Yes, astrology is "wrong" on all different levels. And stupid, too.
Fairies don't exist. We have explored this whole world and haven't found any. They seem to violate a few laws of physics too, ie their wings and diminutive size.
And aliens? We can't tell. We have no reason to doubt they are "out there."
And biblical angels? That's even harder because they are, by definition, "other worldly", ie even more "other worldly" than aliens. Our aliens at least, if they exist, are still in "this universe."
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Post by xna on Aug 3, 2015 9:30:06 GMT -5
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Post by snow on Aug 3, 2015 10:20:52 GMT -5
Is astrology wrong? Are fairies real? Do aliens exist? What about angels?
Interesting - they are all, oddly enough, different questions.
Yes, astrology is "wrong" on all different levels. And stupid, too.
Fairies don't exist. We have explored this whole world and haven't found any. They seem to violate a few laws of physics too, ie their wings and diminutive size.
And aliens? We can't tell. We have no reason to doubt they are "out there."
And biblical angels? That's even harder because they are, by definition, "other worldly", ie even more "other worldly" than aliens. Our aliens at least, if they exist, are still in "this universe." So what exactly are you saying? Angels don't exist? I'm pretty sure I saw a leprechaun once ... right after he ran away with my pot of gold!
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Post by snow on Aug 3, 2015 10:23:06 GMT -5
The 12 zodiac signs, 12 months of the year, 12 tribes of Israel, 12 apostles ... for example? Jesus was in the age of Pisces and what do Christians use as their symbol? Well a fish of course.
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Post by xna on Aug 3, 2015 10:31:12 GMT -5
The 12 zodiac signs, 12 months of the year, 12 tribes of Israel, 12 apostles ... for example? Astrology is a rich story, with a lot's of symbolism. The sky was the big screen for thousands of years. Until recently, I hadn't realized how much astrology had influenced so many religions. I wonder how many with a Jesus fish on their car realize the history?
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Post by snow on Aug 3, 2015 11:32:11 GMT -5
The 12 zodiac signs, 12 months of the year, 12 tribes of Israel, 12 apostles ... for example? Astrology is a rich story, with a lot's of symbolism. The sky was the big screen for thousands of years. Until recently, I hadn't realized how much astrology had influenced so many religions. I wonder how many with a Jesus fish on their car realize the history? Yes, when I was doing research into what I was writing regarding the histories of religions, it was surprising to me too. I learned so much from that research. Some of it was pretty revealing about the Hebrew religion and how it is very similar to the Egyptian beliefs. Shouldn't be surprising of course since they shared a region. I thought it was interesting reading about how the temple and the pillars etc reflected Egyptian beliefs and are also similar to the Masons. The Hebrew people were very influenced by their neighbors and it becomes quite clear when you study what the neighbors believed. I find the belief in God and the story of how they became a 'one God' religion quite interesting. That was also a reflection on the one Egyptian Pharaoh (Akhenaten) that decided to worship only one God. That didn't last after his reign of course.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2015 17:19:32 GMT -5
Quote - "So what exactly are you saying? Angels don't exist? I'm pretty sure I saw a leprechaun once ... right after he ran away with my pot of gold!"
I said... angels by definition, like God Himself, lie outside science. Their claim, as per the bible, is that they exist outside of the universe itself. They can neither be proven nor disproven - unlike fairies and astrology. (strange but the word "disproven" comes up as an error here.)
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Post by howitis on Aug 3, 2015 17:44:39 GMT -5
To me being 'born again' of the holy Spirit does away with our natural star sign. The star sign perhaps determines our personality in a natural sense to those who look upon us naturally. The Holy Spirit determines our personality and our destiny once we are born again of that Spirit.
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Post by snow on Aug 3, 2015 18:41:19 GMT -5
Quote - "So what exactly are you saying? Angels don't exist? I'm pretty sure I saw a leprechaun once ... right after he ran away with my pot of gold!" I said... angels by definition, like God Himself, lie outside science. Their claim, as per the bible, is that they exist outside of the universe itself. They can neither be proven nor disproven - unlike fairies and astrology. (strange but the word "disproven" comes up as an error here.)Ah okay, I understand what you mean then. Thing is there is no way of knowing if anything exists outside of our universe (which I think you are also saying?). I guess my question has always been: why do people want to believe in something beyond proof? I really don't understand that. What is the draw of believing in an invisible being that lives outside any possible proof that judges us and sends us to hell or heaven?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2015 19:26:42 GMT -5
Quote - ...my question has always been: why do people want to believe in something beyond proof? I really don't understand that. What is the draw of believing in an invisible being that lives outside any possible proof that judges us and sends us to hell or heaven? It works both ways When people talk about the "anthropic principle or what initiated the Big Bang they are also delving into the miracle.
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Post by xna on Aug 3, 2015 19:56:29 GMT -5
Quote - ...my question has always been: why do people want to believe in something beyond proof? I really don't understand that. What is the draw of believing in an invisible being that lives outside any possible proof that judges us and sends us to hell or heaven? It works both ways When people talk about the "anthropic principle or what initiated the Big Bang they are also delving into the miracle. youtu.be/MsUo2_Z7Uog
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Post by rational on Aug 3, 2015 20:08:27 GMT -5
Quote - ...my question has always been: why do people want to believe in something beyond proof? I really don't understand that. What is the draw of believing in an invisible being that lives outside any possible proof that judges us and sends us to hell or heaven? It works both ways When people talk about the "anthropic principle or what initiated the Big Bang they are also delving into the miracle.I don't think they are delving into a miracle since that is easily answered by providing a god of the gap(s). I see what is being done is the development of a hypothesis/theory and looking for the data to support it, fill in the missing pieces, and determine the errors. Over time, theories become more developed and, until new data is discovered that calls them into question, they remain as the explanation of the event - almost considered as a law.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2015 20:12:16 GMT -5
Agreed Rational. I do have a science background. But I also understand the 1 - limits of science 2 - the arrogance of science (not by scientists generally but by people who hold it has the answers to everything, and can vanquish religion.)
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Post by rational on Aug 3, 2015 20:34:03 GMT -5
2 - the arrogance of science (not by scientists generally but by people who hold it has the answers to everything, and can vanquish religion.)Science certainly does not have all the answers but I think there is the possibility that it can, over time, provide the answers. The goal of science is not to vanquish religion but, in the course of providing answers the things and events that people believed in through faith are sometimes replaced by the discovered answers. The vanquishing of religion is collateral damage.
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Post by bubbles on Aug 3, 2015 20:42:10 GMT -5
Agreed Rational. I do have a science background. But I also understand the 1 - limits of science 2 - the arrogance of science (not by scientists generally but by people who hold it has the answers to everything, and can vanquish religion.) Then I hope you watched QandA last night Prueb
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Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2015 20:42:41 GMT -5
I was reading Genesis last night - the story of Jacob. His family, his landscape and his culture are all quite strange to us today. In fact - this was all strange to readers in the later nation of Israel, three thousand years ago. It has been pointed out that people in Israel had no knowledge of Jacob's time, other than what was in their Torah. There's few references to that Bronze Age, and a lot of what we know today comes from archaeology - something those ancient Jews didn't have.
People make the logic fallacy of saying all creation myths are the same. Certainly the bible makes a case for historic validity.
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Post by xna on Aug 3, 2015 20:44:16 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2015 20:53:34 GMT -5
Yes, I too like the NOMA. When people say "It all started with the Big Bang" they are saying that our universe sprang into being with all its intricate and precisely arrayed variables which made our world. Only, they are saying that this Big Bang was caused by magic, ie no space, no time, no laws, no energy, no matter. It just happened - it was a miracle greater than the one we read of in the bible.
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Post by jondough on Aug 3, 2015 20:57:55 GMT -5
Yes, I too like the NOMA. When people say "It all started with the Big Bang" they are saying that our universe sprang into being with all its intricate and precisely arrayed variables which made our world. Only, they are saying that this Big Bang was caused by magic, ie no space, no time, no laws, no energy, no matter. It just happened - it was a miracle greater than the one we read of in the bible. Jack Price use to say: "The chance of the Big Bang Theory happening is the same as an explosion happening at a printing press and the result being Websters Dictionary"
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