ted
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Apr 29, 2015 8:17:43 GMT -5
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Post by ted on Apr 29, 2015 8:17:43 GMT -5
I've heard from a friend in Ireland that a lady has been turned away from fellowship because in her past life she had a boyfriend for 3 months apparently the workers say they consider her married to that boyfriend on eyes of God. Her husband has been told he can't go to meetings either and he has been professing for the last few years. Are the Irish head workers gone so hypocrical?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2015 9:39:25 GMT -5
I've heard from a friend in Ireland that a lady has been turned away from fellowship because in her past life she had a boyfriend for 3 months apparently the workers say they consider her married to that boyfriend on eyes of God. Her husband has been told he can't go to meetings either and he has been professing for the last few years. Are the Irish head workers gone so hypocrical? This has already been discussed on this forum - the original poster seems to have removed his posts but they're still visible in the comments. professing.proboards.com/thread/22924/marriageThere's nothing hypocritical about explaining the scriptures. I'm sure if your friend asks the Irish workers about it they'll explain it to him too.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2015 10:57:54 GMT -5
I've heard from a friend in Ireland that a lady has been turned away from fellowship because in her past life she had a boyfriend for 3 months apparently the workers say they consider her married to that boyfriend on eyes of God. Her husband has been told he can't go to meetings either and he has been professing for the last few years. Are the Irish head workers gone so hypocrical? I don't understand where these workers come up with such ridiculous ideas which are NOT taught by Jesus or the apostles. Jesus didn't turn away from the Samaritan woman at the well who was living with a man NOT her husband. Jesus said to the woman caught in the act of adultery, "Go and sin no more."
Paul wrote in I Cor. 7:13-14 And the woman which hath an husband that believeth not, and if he be pleased to dwell with her, let her not leave him. For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.
I Cor. 14:23-24 If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those that are unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad? But if all prophesy, and there come in one that believeth not, or one unlearned, he is convinced of all, he is judged of all:Many of the brothers and sisters workers had boyfriends, girlfriends before they went in the work. Many of these workers left the work and got married so do they think in the eyes of God these workers had committed adultery?Nathan, to clarify what Ted wrote: He used the term " boyfriend" but the other person who posted about this particular case said they were living together (living together as man and wife/ cohabiting/ having a sexual relationship - however you like to phrase it) not just dating each other. I very much doubt that these people have been "turned away from fellowship" - that's not the same thing as having the scriptures explained to you, and choosing not to fulfil the conditions - or not being willing to "go and sin no more".
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2015 12:37:16 GMT -5
I don't understand where these workers come up with such ridiculous ideas which are NOT taught by Jesus or the apostles. Jesus didn't turn away from the Samaritan woman at the well who was living with a man NOT her husband. Jesus said to the woman caught in the act of adultery, "Go and sin no more."
Paul wrote in I Cor. 7:13-14 And the woman which hath an husband that believeth not, and if he be pleased to dwell with her, let her not leave him. For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.
I Cor. 14:23-24 If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those that are unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad? But if all prophesy, and there come in one that believeth not, or one unlearned, he is convinced of all, he is judged of all:Many of the brothers and sisters workers had boyfriends, girlfriends before they went in the work. Many of these workers left the work and got married so do they think in the eyes of God these workers had committed adultery? Nathan, to clarify what Ted wrote: He used the term " boyfriend" but the other person who posted about this particular case said they were living together (living together as man and wife/ cohabiting/ having a sexual relationship - however you like to phrase it) not just dating each other. I very much doubt that these people have been "turned away from fellowship" - that's not the same thing as having the scriptures explained to you, and choosing not to fulfil the conditions - or not being willing to "go and sin no more".abe If they are not married but are cohabitating, that is, living a fornicated life in sin then that would be unacceptable. Go and sin no more means, get married, correct the sinful lifestyle. That is what Jesus said to the woman taken in adultery, go and sin no more.
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Post by BobWilliston on Apr 29, 2015 16:02:18 GMT -5
I've heard from a friend in Ireland that a lady has been turned away from fellowship because in her past life she had a boyfriend for 3 months apparently the workers say they consider her married to that boyfriend on eyes of God. Her husband has been told he can't go to meetings either and he has been professing for the last few years. Are the Irish head workers gone so hypocrical? There is so much missing in this that I can't even understand what's going on. There is no time line, the term "boyfriend" is not explained, and it's not clear why either one of them was forbidden to come to meetings. Sounds like the three of them might have been having threesomes.
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ted
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Apr 30, 2015 8:57:09 GMT -5
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Post by ted on Apr 30, 2015 8:57:09 GMT -5
I will have to get more info but what I've heard is that the wife had a boyfriend over 15 years ago they were not living together but he did stay in her house from time to time!! Her husband was total outsider and professed some years back. This lady professed at a mission and was accepted then the head workers came and told her she can't go to fellowship because of an allegation she was married before in Gods eyes because she had a boyfriend and slept together a few times . The other sad thing is that her husband who professed is told not to go to fellowship either as they consider her married before. Truth is falling these poor people who tried to do right hv been humiliated by the head workers . There is talk that there will be war over this
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2015 10:15:17 GMT -5
I will have to get more info but what I've heard is that the wife had a boyfriend over 15 years ago they were not living together but he did stay in her house from time to time!! Her husband was total outsider and professed some years back. This lady professed at a mission and was accepted then the head workers came and told her she can't go to fellowship because of an allegation she was married before in Gods eyes because she had a boyfriend and slept together a few times . The other sad thing is that her husband who professed is told not to go to fellowship either as they consider her married before. Truth is falling these poor people who tried to do right hv been humiliated by the head workers . There is talk that there will be war over this You obviously don't know the facts of the case, so it's pointless to speculate about things you don't understand. Who's going to start the war? There's nothing to fight over. The workers can't change the Bible to make it easier for people. What's written is written. We'll be judged by the words of Jesus, whether we like them or not. The workers are just fulfilling the scriptures - "for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account".
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ted
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Post by ted on Apr 30, 2015 10:39:32 GMT -5
She wasn't married before the teachings of jesus are love mercy forgiveness end of
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Post by bendle on Apr 30, 2015 17:37:10 GMT -5
I was told a few years ago by a professing relative, based on some conversations he had had with 'workers' that in the uk and Ireland there was a fear that the 'church' could get as liberal in its view of relationships, marriage, divorce, re-marriage as south Africa, Australia, nz, us, etc and the feeling was that there would be a clampdown. Perhaps that is what has happened. I know when i was a teenager and had a girlfriend, her parents put pressure on her to end it as we were not either of us professing. My brother after he professed was told to stop taking part in meetings because his girlfriend, though from a 'church' family, had not professed at that point. A lass I know married an outsider who refused to have anything to do with the 'church' with no apparent ill effects though so perhaps there isn't a level playing field.
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Post by Gene on Apr 30, 2015 18:58:17 GMT -5
I will have to get more info but what I've heard is that the wife had a boyfriend over 15 years ago they were not living together but he did stay in her house from time to time!! Her husband was total outsider and professed some years back. This lady professed at a mission and was accepted then the head workers came and told her she can't go to fellowship because of an allegation she was married before in Gods eyes because she had a boyfriend and slept together a few times . The other sad thing is that her husband who professed is told not to go to fellowship either as they consider her married before. Truth is falling these poor people who tried to do right hv been humiliated by the head workers . There is talk that there will be war over this So are the workers there making a rule that if a person has sex before marriage, the only person they can legitimately marry is the first person they ever had sex with? That's going to go over well.
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Post by matisse on Apr 30, 2015 19:01:06 GMT -5
I will have to get more info but what I've heard is that the wife had a boyfriend over 15 years ago they were not living together but he did stay in her house from time to time!! Her husband was total outsider and professed some years back. This lady professed at a mission and was accepted then the head workers came and told her she can't go to fellowship because of an allegation she was married before in Gods eyes because she had a boyfriend and slept together a few times . The other sad thing is that her husband who professed is told not to go to fellowship either as they consider her married before. Truth is falling these poor people who tried to do right hv been humiliated by the head workers . There is talk that there will be war over this So are the workers there making a rule that if a person has sex before marriage, the only person they can legitimately marry is the first person they ever had sex with? That's going to go over well. Especially if the first person they had sex with was a worker....
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Post by whyisitso on Apr 30, 2015 21:00:31 GMT -5
I will have to get more info but what I've heard is that the wife had a boyfriend over 15 years ago they were not living together but he did stay in her house from time to time!! Her husband was total outsider and professed some years back. This lady professed at a mission and was accepted then the head workers came and told her she can't go to fellowship because of an allegation she was married before in Gods eyes because she had a boyfriend and slept together a few times . The other sad thing is that her husband who professed is told not to go to fellowship either as they consider her married before. Truth is falling these poor people who tried to do right hv been humiliated by the head workers . There is talk that there will be war over this You obviously don't know the facts of the case, so it's pointless to speculate about things you don't understand. Who's going to start the war? There's nothing to fight over. The workers can't change the Bible to make it easier for people. What's written is written. We'll be judged by the words of Jesus, whether we like them or not. The workers are just fulfilling the scriptures - "for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account". So in this case the workers get to be judge & jury? I guess God will be thankful for the help!.... Or maybe God would show mercy to a person who possibly never knew any better?
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Post by dmmichgood on Apr 30, 2015 22:47:34 GMT -5
The workers can't change the Bible to make it easier for people. What's written is written. We'll be judged by the words of Jesus, whether we like them or not. The workers are just fulfilling the scriptures - "for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account". Except, of course the workers do change the bible.
I remember all the years when someone whose husband had left them couldn't re-marry anyone else. If they did they could no longer take part in meeting. Until, -until! Someone was allowed to re -marry & still take part in the meeting! Guess the gender of that person? Yes, yes! -of course! A man!
All those years that it was women who had had to live he rest of their lives alone, -but along comes a man & viola! It is ok.
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2015 4:23:07 GMT -5
The workers can't change the Bible to make it easier for people. What's written is written. We'll be judged by the words of Jesus, whether we like them or not. The workers are just fulfilling the scriptures - "for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account". Except, of course the workers do change the bible.
I remember all the years when someone whose husband had left them couldn't re-marry anyone else. If they did they could no longer take part in meeting. Until, -until! Someone was allowed to re -marry & still take part in the meeting! Guess the gender of that person? Yes, yes! -of course! A man!
All those years that it was women who had had to live he rest of their lives alone, -but along comes a man & viola! It is ok.
That doesn't make it right. And it doesn't change the Bible.
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Post by snow on May 1, 2015 10:03:28 GMT -5
Except, of course the workers do change the bible.
I remember all the years when someone whose husband had left them couldn't re-marry anyone else. If they did they could no longer take part in meeting. Until, -until! Someone was allowed to re -marry & still take part in the meeting! Guess the gender of that person? Yes, yes! -of course! A man!
All those years that it was women who had had to live he rest of their lives alone, -but along comes a man & viola! It is ok.
That doesn't make it right. And it doesn't change the Bible. Prove the bible is right. Judging others based on the bible is just judging and using an old book to justify that judgment.
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Post by Roselyn T on May 2, 2015 2:01:35 GMT -5
Except, of course the workers do change the bible.
I remember all the years when someone whose husband had left them couldn't re-marry anyone else. If they did they could no longer take part in meeting. Until, -until! Someone was allowed to re -marry & still take part in the meeting! Guess the gender of that person? Yes, yes! -of course! A man!
All those years that it was women who had had to live he rest of their lives alone, -but along comes a man & viola! It is ok.
That doesn't make it right. And it doesn't change the Bible. Wow Felicity ! I hope your marriage never breaks down ! So quick to judge & have an opinion on something !
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2015 5:40:01 GMT -5
That doesn't make it right. And it doesn't change the Bible. Wow Felicity ! I hope your marriage never breaks down ! So quick to judge & have an opinion on something ! You're right Roselyn. I guess my comment was a little abrupt, and didn't make any reference to the misery and heartbreak felt by anyone whose marriage has broken down. It hasn't happened to me, but to someone I am close to (not in any way connected to the situation the OP is talking about), so I have felt the pain and shared some of the tears. Betrayal is a terrible thing to have to cope with. That still doesn't change my personal convictions, and nothing can change what's written in the word of God, but I'm sorry if I came across as unfeeling.
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2015 8:26:00 GMT -5
It seems to me that there is a difference between doing something wrong knowingly and doing something wrong in ignorance. "For the times of this ignorance God winked at" ...
For the love of God is broader than the measure of man's mind And the heart of the eternal is most wonderfully kind.
But we make His love too narrow with false limits of our own And we magnify its strictness with a zeal He will not own.
"Blessed are the merciful ..."
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Post by snow on May 2, 2015 10:12:12 GMT -5
Wow Felicity ! I hope your marriage never breaks down ! So quick to judge & have an opinion on something ! You're right Roselyn. I guess my comment was a little abrupt, and didn't make any reference to the misery and heartbreak felt by anyone whose marriage has broken down. It hasn't happened to me, but to someone I am close to (not in any way connected to the situation the OP is talking about), so I have felt the pain and shared some of the tears. Betrayal is a terrible thing to have to cope with. That still doesn't change my personal convictions, and nothing can change what's written in the word of God, but I'm sorry if I came across as unfeeling. Doesn't it give you pause to have to defend the bible because it is unfeeling? Maybe it's not the best book in the world to live your life by. just sayin
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2015 12:59:13 GMT -5
It seems to me that there is a difference between doing something wrong knowingly and doing something wrong in ignorance. "For the times of this ignorance God winked at" ... That's only part of the verse - it continues with " but now commandeth all men every where to repent"
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2015 13:31:12 GMT -5
You're right Roselyn. I guess my comment was a little abrupt, and didn't make any reference to the misery and heartbreak felt by anyone whose marriage has broken down. It hasn't happened to me, but to someone I am close to (not in any way connected to the situation the OP is talking about), so I have felt the pain and shared some of the tears. Betrayal is a terrible thing to have to cope with. That still doesn't change my personal convictions, and nothing can change what's written in the word of God, but I'm sorry if I came across as unfeeling. Doesn't it give you pause to have to defend the bible because it is unfeeling? Maybe it's not the best book in the world to live your life by. just sayin The Bible isn't unfeeling. It's the greatest love story in the world. And the only book to live my life by. just sayin
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2015 14:21:25 GMT -5
It seems to me that there is a difference between doing something wrong knowingly and doing something wrong in ignorance. "For the times of this ignorance God winked at" ... That's only part of the verse - it continues with " but now commandeth all men every where to repent" Indeed. There needs to be repentance for past sins. But if God accepts the repentant heart (and sets aside the sin), who are men to take a different view? David asked God to "remember not the sins of my youth, nor my transgressions ...". The sins of my youth are covered now by the precious blood of Christ and nobody (whether worker or not) has the right to resurrect things done in ignorance years ago for which I have repented. Why should any man try to bring back something that the Lord has taken away? And the Lamb of God takes away our sin (as if it had never happened) if we are truly contrite and try now to walk in the light as He is in the light. Sex before marriage is a sin in God's sight (the sin of fornication). But nowhere in the bible does it say that sex before marriage actually constitutes marriage. And nowhere in the bible does it say that this is a sin which is not capable of being forgiven and covered by the blood of Christ.
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Post by bubbles on May 2, 2015 18:47:12 GMT -5
That's only part of the verse - it continues with " but now commandeth all men every where to repent" Indeed. There needs to be repentance for past sins. But if God accepts the repentant heart (and sets aside the sin), who are men to take a different view? David asked God to "remember not the sins of my youth, nor my transgressions ...". The sins of my youth are covered now by the precious blood of Christ and nobody (whether worker or not) has the right to resurrect things done in ignorance years ago for which I have repented. Why should any man try to bring back something that the Lord has taken away. And the Lamb of God takes away our sin (as if it had never happened) if we are truly contrite and try now to walk in the light as He is in the light. There is another verse about repentance where the lord himself forgets and sends it into the sea of forgetfulness. Micah 7:19 "He will again have compassion on us and subdue our iniquities. You will cast all our sin into the depths of the sea." Isaiah 1: 18 "Come now and let us reason together says the lord, though your sins are like scarlet, they shall be white as snow. Though they are read like crimson they shall be as wool. Psl 103:12 "As far as the east is from the west so far as he has removed our transgressions from us.." Strangely when I read these words 'come let us reason together" they reminded me of our dear friend ratz..!
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Post by emy on May 2, 2015 20:00:05 GMT -5
That's only part of the verse - it continues with " but now commandeth all men every where to repent" Indeed. There needs to be repentance for past sins. But if God accepts the repentant heart (and sets aside the sin), who are men to take a different view? David asked God to "remember not the sins of my youth, nor my transgressions ...". The sins of my youth are covered now by the precious blood of Christ and nobody (whether worker or not) has the right to resurrect things done in ignorance years ago for which I have repented. Why should any man try to bring back something that the Lord has taken away? And the Lamb of God takes away our sin (as if it had never happened) if we are truly contrite and try now to walk in the light as He is in the light. Sex before marriage is a sin in God's sight (the sin of fornication). But nowhere in the bible does it say that sex before marriage actually constitutes marriage. And nowhere in the bible does it say that this is a sin which is not capable of being forgiven and covered by the blood of Christ.Reading the last verses of 1 Cor. 6 may give a slightly different impression. Is fornication with someone else different than with a harlot? in the sight of God? But yes, it is a sin that can be forgiven, because it can be repented from.
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Post by snow on May 2, 2015 23:48:45 GMT -5
Doesn't it give you pause to have to defend the bible because it is unfeeling? Maybe it's not the best book in the world to live your life by. just sayin The Bible isn't unfeeling. It's the greatest love story in the world. And the only book to live my life by. just sayin From where I'm standing it's very hard to believe that anyone could believe that about that book. Just goes to show you the diverse variations in interpretations of this book. I guess it makes it more understandable for me why Muslims think the Quran is a book of peace too. Christians think the bible is a love story and Muslims think the Quran is a book of peace. I think they are both the reason why this world is currently experiencing so much turmoil.
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Post by dmmichgood on May 3, 2015 0:08:54 GMT -5
Doesn't it give you pause to have to defend the bible because it is unfeeling? Maybe it's not the best book in the world to live your life by. just sayin The Bible isn't unfeeling. It's the greatest love story in the world. And the only book to live my life by. just sayin I can't understand how anyone could possibly see the bible as "greatest love story in the world" -that book with all it's blood & gore, with it's genocide, with it's killing of innocent children; -and all of it ordered by the very god that supposedly authored the book!
I can't imagine living my life by such a blood thirsty tome as the bible.
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Post by Roselyn T on May 3, 2015 0:48:20 GMT -5
Wow Felicity ! I hope your marriage never breaks down ! So quick to judge & have an opinion on something ! You're right Roselyn. I guess my comment was a little abrupt, and didn't make any reference to the misery and heartbreak felt by anyone whose marriage has broken down. It hasn't happened to me, but to someone I am close to (not in any way connected to the situation the OP is talking about), so I have felt the pain and shared some of the tears. Betrayal is a terrible thing to have to cope with. That still doesn't change my personal convictions, and nothing can change what's written in the word of God, but I'm sorry if I came across as unfeeling. Felicity, 15 years ago I used to think the same way as you do..... but sometimes life has a way of turning things around and making us question everything we have ever believed. Through these experiences I believe we learn compassion for others and learn that everything is not black & white !
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Post by Roselyn T on May 3, 2015 0:49:44 GMT -5
Except, of course the workers do change the bible.
I remember all the years when someone whose husband had left them couldn't re-marry anyone else. If they did they could no longer take part in meeting. Until, -until! Someone was allowed to re -marry & still take part in the meeting! Guess the gender of that person? Yes, yes! -of course! A man!
All those years that it was women who had had to live he rest of their lives alone, -but along comes a man & viola! It is ok.
That doesn't make it right. And it doesn't change the Bible. So does that mean that the workers are wrong ?
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