|
Post by elizabethcoleman on Jan 23, 2015 23:06:02 GMT -5
Looking around on the web today, I stumbled across the "Church you read about in the Bible". Wouldn't you know it, they don't have a name, and are non-denominational. They don't teach doctrines of men or man-made creeds. Oh, and they're the only true church (of course). Warning - reading the following may result in severe episodes of deja vu. "The church you can read about in the Bible!"
Our view of the Bible The Holy Bible is inspired by the Holy Spirit and is the only complete record of God's will for man on earth. It is understandable by the common man by simply reading it. Contained in the pages of the New Testament is a complete record of the first century church. This is the church that Jesus Christ shed his blood for, the Apostles preached about and the early Christians were members of. Wouldn't you like to learn more about this church that was established in 33 A.D.? We feel that the solution to the vast religious division is for the Bible to be the only source of religious authority for worship, doctrine & morality. We believe that human creeds, catechisms & statements of faith cause religious division because they compete with the authority of the Bible and cloud people's ability to clearly see what the Bible actually says. Churches are not divided over what is in the Bible, but what is not in the Bible. Jesus likened the Bible to seed in the parable of the sower. We believe that if anyone plants the pure seed of the word of God, that it will produce exactly the same first century church every time. We are determined to be simply Christians. We have no ambition to be anything more and we cannot be content to be anything less. For this reason, we are not interested in man-made church doctrines but only in the New Testament blueprint. With the Bible as our only guide, we seek to find what that original church was like and restore it exactly. Our way of life The Bible contains a complete blueprint or pattern for how we should live our lives. Many think the Bible is an outdated book unable to provide answers for today's modern world. Yet within the Bible there is a wealth of timeless information on every vital subject for personal happiness. The basic needs of men have not changed. Learning from the example of the life of Jesus. Asking questions about the purpose of life and finding answers. Applying the Bible to our lives. God's word is Bible medicine for hurting homes in a wicked world. Our doctrine: We are trying to speak where the Bible speaks and to be silent where the Bible is silent, and to call Bible things by Bible names, and to do Bible things in Bible ways. Tit 2:1; 1 Corinthians 4:6; 2 John 9 In essentials, we maintain unity. In opinions, liberty. And in all things, love. We are truly a non-denominational church that has no written standard of doctrinal authority other than the Bible. Our worship: Our assembled worship procedures are simple, spiritual and orderly, keynoted by the words of Jesus, who said, "true worshippers shall worship in spirit and in truth." Jn 4:23. Each element of worship finds its origin in the commands and examples found in the Bible. Emphasizes the spiritual over the social. Engages in fascinating midweek Bible studies instead of merely having a social hour. We praise our divine savior Jesus Christ our Lord. Our organization: We are an independent non-denominational, self-governing local church who earnestly desires to follow our divine savior Jesus Christ. Although we have no organization larger than the local church with no world headquarters, we have thousands of sister congregations all over the world. Click here to locate an assembly of Christians near you! www.bible.ca/seek-church.htmThere is no man or group of men, who legislate doctrine for the church. We have no one to answer to but Christ. He is the head of the church which leaves no room for any human head. We do have a body of men who oversee each local congregation called "elders or bishops or shepherds". These three terms are synonymous and refer to a single office in each local church. Click here for more. As was true in the first century, so also there is no inter-congregational organization, but rather independent congregations in different locations with Christ as Lord and Master. Our local churches are organized autonomously. Whereas denominations have a human creed or catechism to enforce unity, our unifying force is that each congregation uses the Bible alone without creeds. Because the church of the first century had no denominational name, neither do we. However, because the New Testament described the assemblies of Christians as "the church" Ephesians 1:22; "the churches of Christ" Romans 16:16; "the church of God" Acts 20:28 and many other descriptions, the "name on the sign" will always be one found in the Bible. Below is our local church building. The sign on the front says, "Christians Meet Here" on the side it says, "Doing Bible Things In Bible Ways". How we are different: We are different from modern churches because we are the same as the church of the Bible. We are not inter-denominational but completely non-denominational! It is our desire to wear no other name than Christ's and to be known simply as Christians, members of the body of Christ. We are people of a restoration spirit who want to restore, in our time, the original New Testament church. While each denomination creates their own unique blueprint (human creeds and statements of faith) we call upon all to honor God's original blueprint found in the Bible. We emphasize that going back to the Bible does not mean the establishing of another denomination, but rather a return and restoration to the original church of the Bible. You too can be just a Christian and serve God without belonging to any denomination bound by no denominational laws or obligations. If such freedom appeals to you, please visit us! We invite you to investigate the Bible with us and join us in bringing unity to the religious world through the Bible's simple message apart from the creeds of men.
|
|
|
Post by dmmichgood on Jan 23, 2015 23:59:09 GMT -5
Looking around on the web today, I stumbled across the "Church you read about in the Bible". Wouldn't you know it, they don't have a name, and are non-denominational. They don't teach doctrines of men or man-made creeds. Oh, and they're the only true church (of course). Warning - reading the following may result in severe episodes of deja vu. "The church you can read about in the Bible!"
And what is YOUR belief, Elizabeth Coleman?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2015 0:22:53 GMT -5
Of course it's quote unquote "deja vu" It's the description of the Apostolic Church!! Anyone who has a cursory understanding of the NT will recognize this. The problem is that people want to build something else upon this "primitive foundation."
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2015 0:32:57 GMT -5
Not true Bert, same foundation, just a better building. Think it may be 2x2 that want to be different. Use a lot of their own spin.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2015 0:43:09 GMT -5
Same foundation but a better building? Would those Apostle want to serve in this building you build? Recall what they had to say about holy days, symbolic worship, the priesthood, temples made with hands, the unpaid itinerate ministry etc..
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2015 0:54:56 GMT -5
Not true Bert, same foundation, just a better building. Think it may be 2x2 that want to be different. Use a lot of their own spin. why would God want a better building?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2015 2:30:31 GMT -5
Same foundation but a better building? Would those Apostle want to serve in this building you build? Recall what they had to say about holy days, symbolic worship, the priesthood, temples made with hands, the unpaid itinerate ministry etc.. You really don't know much about it unless you go in the door, and see what is inside. You may get a pleasant surprise, and get an education. I have been in many, learnt a lot.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2015 3:56:40 GMT -5
Same foundation but a better building? Would those Apostle want to serve in this building you build? Recall what they had to say about holy days, symbolic worship, the priesthood, temples made with hands, the unpaid itinerate ministry etc.. You really don't know much about it unless you go in the door, and see what is inside. You may get a pleasant surprise, and get an education. I have been in many, learnt a lot. is it what God wants you to learn?
|
|
|
Post by elizabethcoleman on Jan 24, 2015 4:06:02 GMT -5
Looking around on the web today, I stumbled across the "Church you read about in the Bible". Wouldn't you know it, they don't have a name, and are non-denominational. They don't teach doctrines of men or man-made creeds. Oh, and they're the only true church (of course). Warning - reading the following may result in severe episodes of deja vu. "The church you can read about in the Bible!"
And what is YOUR belief, Elizabeth Coleman?I'm a Christian, D. But you knew that.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2015 4:43:36 GMT -5
There were a number of different Christians in the NT You read of them in Revelations, Galatians etc.. That's not enough to say "I'm a Christian."
|
|
|
Post by elizabethcoleman on Jan 24, 2015 5:08:48 GMT -5
There were a number of different Christians in the NT You read of them in Revelations, Galatians etc.. That's not enough to say "I'm a Christian." Yes, Bert, I know you believe that no one is a Christian unless they do everything exactly according to the workers. I get that. Yes, I know you believe the workers do everything according to the NT which is what makes them right. Did you notice this is exactly what "The Church you can read about in the Bible" (posted above) believes also?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2015 5:14:01 GMT -5
You really don't know much about it unless you go in the door, and see what is inside. You may get a pleasant surprise, and get an education. I have been in many, learnt a lot. is it what God wants you to learn? Yes.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2015 5:51:03 GMT -5
Lord have mercy on us. It seems like people spend more time arguing about religion and who is right and who is wrong than actually serving God in Spirit and In Truth. Believers, please, please look after your own salvation with fear an trembling, God will not ask us about anyone else but ourselves. Quit bickering about the scriptures and seek to have a personal relationship with God. He will direct our paths if we allow Him to. If you have a personal relationship with God, it probably would not even matter which particular church you assemble yourselves in the name of Jesus if your hearts are right and your focus is on Jesus and His teachings, just earnestly meditate with a purpose.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2015 14:45:13 GMT -5
Lord have mercy on us. It seems like people spend more time arguing about religion and who is right and who is wrong than actually serving God in Spirit and In Truth. Believers, please, please look after your own salvation with fear an trembling, God will not ask us about anyone else but ourselves. Quit bickering about the scriptures and seek to have a personal relationship with God. He will direct our paths if we allow Him to. If you have a personal relationship with God, it probably would not even matter which particular church you assemble yourselves in the name of Jesus if your hearts are right and your focus is on Jesus and His teachings, just earnestly meditate with a purpose. Hear,Hear partaker,you are spot on. My thoughts exactly. When you find God, you put religion in its place.
|
|
|
Post by Mary on Jan 24, 2015 15:32:04 GMT -5
Your post is an exaggeration, partaker. When you look at how many hours there are in a week I am sure that Elizabeth and Bert spend many more hours serving God than arguing about religion. I rarely see Elizabeth here. We have a God given responsibility to speak out against what we consider wrong, whether it is about religion or whatever it is. Interesting, that people can speak out against everything else being wrong e.g. Charlie thread, etc. but when it comes to religion people try to shut them down. It used to be that you don't talk about religion, politics and what ever else, but we have moved past that these days and people encourage debates even about religion. This thread is probably more to the theme of this board which is about the 2x2s, than most of the other threads.
Really they are not debating religion, they are debating churches and this thread is no different from other threads on this board where people disagree.
|
|
|
Post by dmmichgood on Jan 24, 2015 15:36:42 GMT -5
And what is YOUR belief, Elizabeth Coleman? I'm a Christian, D. But you knew that. I know that on this forum you say that you are a "Christian," however, I don't KNOW that you are.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2015 16:36:36 GMT -5
Your post is an exaggeration, partaker. When you look at how many hours there are in a week I am sure that Elizabeth and Bert spend many more hours serving God than arguing about religion. I rarely see Elizabeth here. We have a God given responsibility to speak out against what we consider wrong, whether it is about religion or whatever it is. Interesting, that people can speak out against everything else being wrong e.g. Charlie thread, etc. but when it comes to religion people try to shut them down. It used to be that you don't talk about religion, politics and what ever else, but we have moved past that these days and people encourage debates even about religion. This thread is probably more to the theme of this board which is about the 2x2s, than most of the other threads. Really they are not debating religion, they are debating churches and this thread is no different from other threads on this board where people disagree. You are probably right about it being an exaggeration, but my general statement includes many of the other threads on the forum, it is not reserved for this particular one alone. People have the right to disagree but that does not invalidate my statement at all. By the way I very much appreciate what Elizabeth has posted, mine is in no way a put down on what she has written. I am not an exclusivist and I do not adversely judge other churches at all; variety is the spice of life. All I am trying to point out that much time is expended on debating religeous organisations/churches and their differences, time that might be more profitable to the spiritual well being by meditating and serving God.
|
|
|
Post by Mary on Jan 24, 2015 17:07:56 GMT -5
I like your last post but I am sure that those who have written on this thread do the later too. To me giving our points of view is serving God which also requires meditation. Bert's posts are also useful in that they show me that I am not missing anything and glad that I am not so controlled that I cannot think for myself. The things he says are so ridiculous that I think he must be joking half the time. I don't take him seriously.
To keep quiet or speak out? My belief is that to keep quiet is to side with the perpetrators. Maybe Jesus would have been better to have spent more time with the Father rather than going to the temple and over throwing the money tables or looking at how much the poor woman gave. Get my point. There is a time and place for everything and natural things are also important and part of our life.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2015 17:43:06 GMT -5
I like your last post but I am sure that those who have written on this thread do the later too. To me giving our points of view is serving God which also requires meditation. Bert's posts are also useful in that they show me that I am not missing anything and glad that I am not so controlled that I cannot think for myself. The things he says are so ridiculous that I think he must be joking half the time. I don't take him seriously. To keep quiet or speak out? My belief is that to keep quiet is to side with the perpetrators. Maybe Jesus would have been better to have spent more time with the Father rather than going to the temple and over throwing the money tables or looking at how much the poor woman gave. Get my point. There is a time and place for everything and natural things are also important and part of our life. I do appreciate your point of view.Yes, sometimes I have a little difficulty in following Bert's lines of argument.Some times I have to think deeply to see where he is coming from. We read in scripture that the Pharisee also serve God in their own way, but Jesus warned that unless our righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the Pharisee, we will no way enter the Kingdom of Heaven. I think most of the time Berts seems to try to remind us of this in his own way.We must do it right, get it right.
|
|
|
Post by dmmichgood on Jan 24, 2015 18:19:34 GMT -5
Lord have mercy on us. It seems like people spend more time arguing about religion and who is right and who is wrong than actually serving God in Spirit and In Truth. Believers, please, please look after your own salvation with fear an trembling, God will not ask us about anyone else but ourselves. Quit bickering about the scriptures and seek to have a personal relationship with God. He will direct our paths if we allow Him to. If you have a personal relationship with God, it probably would not even matter which particular church you assemble yourselves in the name of Jesus if your hearts are right and your focus is on Jesus and His teachings, just earnestly meditate with a purpose. Never-the-less, partaker, "arguing about religion and who is right and who is wrong" is the very reason that there are 1000's of "Christian" denominations in world!
In fact they wasn't even just "one" church of "believers in Jesus" right from the beginning!
That so-called "personal relationship with God" is what?
Different than every one elses "personal relationship with God?"
I have heard that expression, "personal relationship with God," only in the last 50 years .
Why is that so?
There has been such a rapid proliferation of fundamentalist churches.
I believe that people used the term, "personal relationship with God," to try & make themselves believe that they were different from others.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2015 20:15:44 GMT -5
I think partaker is saying stop the argument, don't let it interfere in your relationship with God. The argument is irrelevant. All Christian Doctrine is based on Christ, there will be variation, so what. That is human intervention. Doctrine in both Politics and Religion are influenced by society. Society changes, so does doctrine. God never changes, stick with God.
A great inspiration to myself is "Desiderata", that is why I have a copy on toilet wall. Read it every day, sometimes several times. I quote,
"Therefore, be at peace with God, whatever you conceive him to be. And whatever your labours and aspirations in the noisy confusion of life, keep peace in your soul. With all its sham, drudgery and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be cheerful."
Need I say more, wonderful words of wisdom. Our relationship with God is individual, not as told by others. When you find that, you are very happy and cheerful and praise God for that.
I am so glad that I have many Christian friends, both 2x2 and other faiths. They remain friends, we never debate doctrine. Like to go to Church, never look at the sign on the door.
|
|
|
Post by dmmichgood on Jan 24, 2015 21:38:27 GMT -5
I think partaker is saying stop the argument, don't let it interfere in your relationship with God. The argument is irrelevant. All Christian Doctrine is based on Christ, there will be variation, so what. That is human intervention. Doctrine in both Politics and Religion are influenced by society. Society changes, so does doctrine. God never changes, stick with God. A great inspiration to myself is "Desiderata", that is why I have a copy on toilet wall. Read it every day, sometimes several times. I quote, "Therefore, be at peace with God, whatever you conceive him to be. And whatever your labours and aspirations in the noisy confusion of life, keep peace in your soul. With all its sham, drudgery and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be cheerful." Need I say more, wonderful words of wisdom. Our relationship with God is individual, not as told by others. When you find that, you are very happy and cheerful and praise God for that. I am so glad that I have many Christian friends, both 2x2 and other faiths. They remain friends, we never debate doctrine. Like to go to Church, never look at the sign on the door. That is the only sentence in the Max Ehrmann's , "Desiderata" that I have a problem with. That is the use of the word "God."
Otherwise, I have it listed to be read at my funeral.
"Therefore be at peace, with God, whatever you conceive Him to be, and whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul. With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be cheerful. Strive to be happy." Max Ehrmann, "Desiderata".
You don't need a god for it to be true & good advice.
Just leave that out & you have very good advice in all of the poem.
Desiderata
Go placidly amid the noise and haste, and remember what peace there may be in silence. As far as possible without surrender be on good terms with all persons. Speak your truth quietly and clearly; and listen to others, even the dull and ignorant; they too have their story. Avoid loud and aggressive persons, they are vexations to the spirit. If you compare yourself with others, you may become vain and bitter; for always there will be greater and lesser persons than yourself.
Enjoy your achievements as well as your plans. Keep interested in your career, however humble; it is a real possession in the changing fortunes of time. Exercise caution in your business affairs; for the world is full of trickery. But let this not blind you to what virtue there is; many persons strive for high ideals; and everywhere life is full of heroism.
Be yourself. Especially, do not feign affection. Neither be critical about love; for in the face of all aridity and disenchantment it is as perennial as the grass.
Take kindly the counsel of the years, gracefully surrendering the things of youth. Nurture strength of spirit to shield you in sudden misfortune. But do not distress yourself with imaginings. Many fears are born of fatigue and loneliness. Beyond a wholesome discipline, be gentle with yourself.
You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.
Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be, and whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul. With all its sham, drudgery and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy.
© Max Ehrmann 1927
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2015 21:41:59 GMT -5
Not true Bert, same foundation, just a better building. Think it may be 2x2 that want to be different. Use a lot of their own spin. why would God want a better building? any chance of an answer?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2015 21:48:17 GMT -5
Although we have no organization larger than the local church with no world headquarters, we have thousands of sister congregations all over the world. Click here to locate an assembly of Christians near you! www.bible.ca/seek-church.htmcan't find any in kiwi land
|
|
|
Post by elizabethcoleman on Jan 24, 2015 22:27:03 GMT -5
Although we have no organization larger than the local church with no world headquarters, we have thousands of sister congregations all over the world. Click here to locate an assembly of Christians near you! www.bible.ca/seek-church.htmcan't find any in kiwi land Ha, I couldn't find many in Oz, either. Certainly not within several hundred kms.
|
|
|
Post by elizabethcoleman on Jan 24, 2015 22:30:20 GMT -5
I'm a Christian, D. But you knew that. I know that on this forum you say that you are a "Christian," however, I don't KNOW that you are.
Well, I guess there's a lot we don't know. If I'm not, you'll just have to "prove it"!
|
|
|
Post by elizabethcoleman on Jan 24, 2015 22:46:06 GMT -5
Your post is an exaggeration, partaker. When you look at how many hours there are in a week I am sure that Elizabeth and Bert spend many more hours serving God than arguing about religion. I rarely see Elizabeth here. We have a God given responsibility to speak out against what we consider wrong, whether it is about religion or whatever it is. Interesting, that people can speak out against everything else being wrong e.g. Charlie thread, etc. but when it comes to religion people try to shut them down. It used to be that you don't talk about religion, politics and what ever else, but we have moved past that these days and people encourage debates even about religion. This thread is probably more to the theme of this board which is about the 2x2s, than most of the other threads. Really they are not debating religion, they are debating churches and this thread is no different from other threads on this board where people disagree. You are probably right about it being an exaggeration, but my general statement includes many of the other threads on the forum, it is not reserved for this particular one alone. People have the right to disagree but that does not invalidate my statement at all. By the way I very much appreciate what Elizabeth has posted, mine is in no way a put down on what she has written. I am not an exclusivist and I do not adversely judge other churches at all; variety is the spice of life. All I am trying to point out that much time is expended on debating religeous organisations/churches and their differences, time that might be more profitable to the spiritual well being by meditating and serving God. I guess what fascinates me is when I find/see the exact same mentality (of two-by-twos), right down to the same phrases, in other exclusive groups. Here are some more from a different group (The Twelve Tribes). Does any of this sound familiar? Perhaps the same spirit?!? Perhaps some of the current two-by-twos might recognise this spirit?! ... on the earth again, like a felled tree sprouting. Something old is being born! We follow the Old and New Testaments, but in a new and living way. It is a life together, something that costs you everything to get, but it is so worth it.
… began from a few people with childlike hearts who left the popular culture of the world, walking away from their old lives. At that time it was mainly young single people, but soon there were families with children, and even grandparents.
According to … the Son of God, there is a broad gate and a narrow gate, a broad way and a narrow way. He said that only a few would find the narrow way, and that most would prefer the broad way, which leads to death. The narrow way leads to life, but few will travel on it to its destiny. Most are unwilling to pay the high cost of love.
… We make no apology for our way of life. We believe it to be the best thing on earth, and we are all so grateful to live this way.
|
|
|
Post by Mary on Jan 24, 2015 23:27:50 GMT -5
dmm....How do we know you are an atheist just because you say you are?
|
|