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Post by blacksheep on Dec 15, 2014 7:38:58 GMT -5
I don't really know what you mean. What are you referring to as the "word"? Could it be "Thunderbird"?
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Post by snow on Dec 15, 2014 11:25:40 GMT -5
Well if that is how you interpret what I have written, so be it. I was not referring to progress and improvements in the area of human rights etc. I was referring to the slippage in standards of morality and the respect for parents and elders and teachers and those in authority, police officers for example; the drop in standards that allow school children to take guns to school, and we have recent examples of how that turned out, also mindless vandalism of properties, vulgarity on line etc. You make some fair points and I don't claim that everything is better now. Even as a young adult, some of the trends I see from younger people today are disturbing. All this rioting, and ghetto mentality of some people just needing something to protest and get violent about instead of trying to abide by the laws in the first place...really disturbing. My only point is that society has always had significant problems throughout time. You mention respect for parents, but I think it all comes down to having good respectful parents. There are plenty of good kids these days, and they usually have good parents. The disrespectful and trouble-making kids usually have a sketchy parental situation. There obviously are outliers and mental illness situations, but by and large a kid with 2 loving parents will turn out just fine. Often kids can rise above bad parenting too, but it's much more of a challenge. Kids usually imitate what they see adults doing. If kids are worse now then we have only ourselves to blame for being such hypocritical models. Do as I say not as I do really doesn't work, but adults don't seem to get that!!!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2014 13:58:30 GMT -5
You make some fair points and I don't claim that everything is better now. Even as a young adult, some of the trends I see from younger people today are disturbing. All this rioting, and ghetto mentality of some people just needing something to protest and get violent about instead of trying to abide by the laws in the first place...really disturbing. My only point is that society has always had significant problems throughout time. You mention respect for parents, but I think it all comes down to having good respectful parents. There are plenty of good kids these days, and they usually have good parents. The disrespectful and trouble-making kids usually have a sketchy parental situation. There obviously are outliers and mental illness situations, but by and large a kid with 2 loving parents will turn out just fine. Often kids can rise above bad parenting too, but it's much more of a challenge. Kids usually imitate what they see adults doing. If kids are worse now then we have only ourselves to blame for being such hypocritical models. Do as I say not as I do really doesn't work, but adults don't seem to get that!!!l Yes on the most part I agree; however time and again we have seen children up in juvenile courts accused and charged with some awful things. Then we hear that the family members and some experts testifying,as character references, that they are very surprised because the accused juvenile was brought up in a stable home with a decent family as good role models, they live in good neighbourhoods and that the accused acted " out of character and contrary to upbringing." Sometimes the courts send them for mental assessments.
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rs
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Post by rs on Dec 15, 2014 15:13:13 GMT -5
The disrespectful and trouble-making kids usually have a sketchy parental situation. define sketchy?
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 15, 2014 18:39:55 GMT -5
Well if that is how you interpret what I have written, so be it. I was not referring to progress and improvements in the area of human rights etc. I was referring to the slippage in standards of morality and the respect for parents and elders and teachers and those in authority, police officers for example; the drop in standards that allow school children to take guns to school, and we have recent examples of how that turned out, also mindless vandalism of properties, vulgarity on line etc. You make some fair points and I don't claim that everything is better now. Even as a young adult, some of the trends I see from younger people today are disturbing. All this rioting, and ghetto mentality of some people just needing something to protest and get violent about instead of trying to abide by the laws in the first place...really disturbing. My only point is that society has always had significant problems throughout time. You mention respect for parents, but I think it all comes down to having good respectful parents. There are plenty of good kids these days, and they usually have good parents. The disrespectful and trouble-making kids usually have a sketchy parental situation. There obviously are outliers and mental illness situations, but by and large a kid with 2 loving parents will turn out just fine. Often kids can rise above bad parenting too, but it's much more of a challenge. I agree with you. I learned a lot about the "goodness" and "respect" of really bad kids when I was teaching them. There was not a single gang member that I was afraid of, and they were more honest than most other students. They were the ones who hugged me the day I retired. What happened to them was either bad parenting or complete lack of proper parenting. When you see homeless 12-year olds getting themselves to school every day on time, it breaks your heart that they've been robbed of their childhood. Most of the time when they cuss you out, it's because they need someone's, anyone's attention. At least if they can get a response out of someone by scaring them they know they aren't completely alone in the world, and have at least one edge up on some people. Somehow people take it a lot better when it's an adult who is cussing them out. Strange about that.
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Post by snow on Dec 15, 2014 20:31:04 GMT -5
Kids usually imitate what they see adults doing. If kids are worse now then we have only ourselves to blame for being such hypocritical models. Do as I say not as I do really doesn't work, but adults don't seem to get that!!!l Yes on the most part I agree; however time and again we have seen children up in juvenile courts accused and charged with some awful things. Then we hear that the family members and some experts testifying,as character references, that they are very surprised because the accused juvenile was brought up in a stable home with a decent family as good role models, they live in good neighbourhoods and that the accused acted " out of character and contrary to upbringing." Sometimes the courts send them for mental assessments. You know what. I have heard that time and time again but I bet it isn't always true. How many times to we also hear 'they seemed like such a nice family' or 'he seemed like such a good father' etc. The we find out what went on behind closed doors in a nice neighborhood was pretty horrific and kept quiet. Even how parents talk about other people in front of their kids will color how they view the world and how they act in it. We can't always be sure they do have good role models by outward appearances.
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Post by dmmichgood on Dec 15, 2014 21:11:45 GMT -5
Well if that is how you interpret what I have written, so be it. I was not referring to progress and improvements in the area of human rights etc. I was referring to the slippage in standards of morality and the respect for parents and elders and teachers and those in authority, police officers for example; the drop in standards that allow school children to take guns to school, and we have recent examples of how that turned out, also mindless vandalism of properties, vulgarity on line etc. You make some fair points and I don't claim that everything is better now. Even as a young adult, some of the trends I see from younger people today are disturbing. All this rioting, and ghetto mentality of some people just needing something to protest and get violent about instead of trying to abide by the laws in the first place...really disturbing. My only point is that society has always had significant problems throughout time. You mention respect for parents, but I think it all comes down to having good respectful parents. There are plenty of good kids these days, and they usually have good parents. The disrespectful and trouble-making kids usually have a sketchy parental situation. There obviously are outliers and mental illness situations, but by and large a kid with 2 loving parents will turn out just fine. Often kids can rise above bad parenting too, but it's much more of a challenge. When I see rioting, I am more prone to ask why! I figure that those people are not just needing something to protest but probably HAVE something to protest about. I have the feeling that those "laws" that they are expected to live by are often not for their benefit but made to "keep them in their place."
A common denominator is that they are poor.
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 15, 2014 22:16:35 GMT -5
You make some fair points and I don't claim that everything is better now. Even as a young adult, some of the trends I see from younger people today are disturbing. All this rioting, and ghetto mentality of some people just needing something to protest and get violent about instead of trying to abide by the laws in the first place...really disturbing. My only point is that society has always had significant problems throughout time. You mention respect for parents, but I think it all comes down to having good respectful parents. There are plenty of good kids these days, and they usually have good parents. The disrespectful and trouble-making kids usually have a sketchy parental situation. There obviously are outliers and mental illness situations, but by and large a kid with 2 loving parents will turn out just fine. Often kids can rise above bad parenting too, but it's much more of a challenge. When I see rioting, I am more prone to ask why! I figure that those people are not just needing something to protest but probably HAVE something to protest about. I have the feeling that those "laws" that they are expected to live by are often not for their benefit but made to "keep them in their place."
A common denominator is that they are poor.
I'm actually surprised at the rarity of protests and rioting in the US. SO many people take so much crap from so many directions.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2014 4:22:19 GMT -5
When I see rioting, I am more prone to ask why! I figure that those people are not just needing something to protest but probably HAVE something to protest about. I have the feeling that those "laws" that they are expected to live by are often not for their benefit but made to "keep them in their place."
A common denominator is that they are poor.
I'm actually surprised at the rarity of protests and rioting in the US. SO many people take so much crap from so many directions. I have only visited America on two occasions for short periods 1986 and 2005 , so I cannot really accurately comment on life there, I base my comments on hear-say or what I have read about in the news. I remember walking in Manhattan 1986 with my brother-in- law sort of window shopping and I took out my wallet to check how much money was in it and he shouted "put that away, you don't do that sort of thing here, a hand would come over your shoulder and snatch it from you in no time at all." That kind of shocked me because I never expected to find or encounter invisible folks there.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2014 5:59:02 GMT -5
Reminiscing.
In the late sixties, circumstances of life forced me to spend a while in NYC. Of course, I was influenced in belief by what I was told by my hosts about conditions there. Being 6'3", 212 pounds of rather lean, fighting, martial arts machine and rather highly trained and experiencepp in unarmed hand to hand combat, I wasn't really fearful for myself, however this one was part of a rather ignorant society of that time.
So, striking off by myself for a day of sight seeing in the big Apple, I did so with much fearful advice about the hazards in so doing, and a t least some trepidation. It was a weekday, sun shining, mid-morning, rather glorious fall day. Amazed (and somewhat pleased) to find my surroundings as I "hit the streets" nearly void of any of the lsome 7,000,000 inhabitants, I began walking toward the nearest subway entrance. Alert as always, I heard footsteps behind me, so I picked up the pace a bit. So did those footsteps!
Unconcerned, I reached the entrance only to find nobody in sight. Having to make a rather lengthy trek from the gate to the loading platform far below, I still saw no need to even make a casual glimpse to my "six." However, by then perceptions began ramping upwards so I began racing towards what lay ahead. Upon seeing the loading platform also completely vacant. I "beat feet" to the just arriving train, scampering in only to simultaneously discover it too was empty and those footsteps behind me also pounded into that "car." unknowing what to expect, but responding to earlier training and multiple warnings, I whirled around, demanding with a loud voice, "what do YOU want?"
One very terrified, trembling and very black man, responded "nutten, ahs from Georgia!" Seeing he was far more terrified of me than I was of him, in my relief I began to laugh, told him I was from Seattle, introduced myself telling him of all the warnings I had been given regarding my days outing in NCY. He also saw the humor in the situation and the equally Dire warnings he had been given.
We became instant friends, joined up, spent the entire day together, and toured as much of the City as we could in the time we had, having a marvelous outing. Needless to say, upon returning to my hosts' home that night, I was repeatedly told of the imagined risks and dangers that had faced me that day, and how concerned they had all been for my safety, etc. Thinking maybe I'd even been killed as I was arriving back well after dark, when all good NYC'ers were safe in their homes.
Perspective! Much preferring my own here in the USA Pacific Northwest, looking out my front window at 130 miles of mountain range horizon, including several active volcano peaks! Country life, country living, even with all it's limitations!
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 16, 2014 17:52:49 GMT -5
I'm actually surprised at the rarity of protests and rioting in the US. SO many people take so much crap from so many directions. I have only visited America on two occasions for short periods 1986 and 2005 , so I cannot really accurately comment on life there, I base my comments on hear-say or what I have read about in the news. I remember walking in Manhattan 1986 with my brother-in- law sort of window shopping and I took out my wallet to check how much money was in it and he shouted "put that away, you don't do that sort of thing here, a hand would come over your shoulder and snatch it from you in no time at all." That kind of shocked me because I never expected to find or encounter invisible folks there. Ironically, Americans very often expect those kinds of things to happen in other countries -- "not in my neighborhood".
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 16, 2014 18:05:44 GMT -5
When I see rioting, I am more prone to ask why! I figure that those people are not just needing something to protest but probably HAVE something to protest about. I have the feeling that those "laws" that they are expected to live by are often not for their benefit but made to "keep them in their place."
A common denominator is that they are poor.
I ask "why" also. As in, "why" do rioters think that destroying the local businesses that people have poured their lives into will help solve their problems? "Why" do they think large scale violent criminal activity like this will cause people to listen to their message? When MLK and others is that era made a difference, it was through peaceful protests and powerful speeches, rising above the awful oppression to which they were subject. Now, a cop kills a criminal who is trying to take his gun, and the people want it to be the 60's all over again. And of course the media race baiters hype the case up to instigate it further. Ignoring the hundreds of other of cases (that don't fit their desired white cop / black civilian profile) where cops kill people because they are forced to make split-second decisions that sometimes come down to killing a criminal or taking the chance that the criminal may kill them. You're onto something with the common denominator being "poor". People that grow up in crummy/ghetto neighborhoods definitely have the cards of life stacked against them. Not by the police though, just by their own parents (or lack thereof) and violent surroundings. This is true regardless of their race, however the media only cares about the "struggle" of the black poor people, and want to turn this into a race war. There are people in the media literally calling it a "genocide" on black people. By the way, what laws are keeping poor people down? You're away off base by blaming the black parents for their children's fate. This society is rigged against them. Ironically, no one is blaming the middle class white parents in this country who have mostly lost their ability to give their kids the education that can keep them out of the ghettos -- that's always the president's fault, never their own. The problem in this country is that the very poor white people are still privileged ahead of the very poor black people. And the notion that a successful black person is an "uppity black" is slow to fade away. I was given the "fear the black man" message loud and clear when I first went to work in Boston (from the Maritimes). I met a lot of loonies and crooks in the big city, but the time my check book and letters with signed checks in them fell out of my pocket in the subway, the biggest meanest black man sitting beside me mailed the check book to me and all the checks ended up where they were supposed to.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2014 18:16:16 GMT -5
The problem is, whether black or white we are too darn quick to judge the book by the cover and that is a human weakness.
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Post by dmmichgood on Dec 16, 2014 19:01:38 GMT -5
AN interesting aside When we were in Rome our guide pointed out that although there wasn't a lot of crime in Rome, there was a lot of petty theft when tourists weren't paying attention. She warned us to keep our ID's & money very close to our bodies.
She told us they would even use tricks with children to distract people. I pictured in my mind maybe a child having a tantrum or something.
This is the scene.
Two babies were put down on the steps, of all places St Peter's & urged to crawl toward one another. Of course we all watched. Then after a bit, in unison the adults picked up the babies & disappeared.
I didn't even think about it as it was happening.
ONly later did I think about how many parents would actually put their baby on steps where everyone's feet had trampled!
I wondered how much money those people made that time.
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 16, 2014 19:16:19 GMT -5
AN interesting aside When we were in Rome our guide pointed out that although there wasn't a lot of crime in Rome, there was a lot of petty theft when tourists weren't paying attention. She warned us to keep our ID's & money very close to our bodies.
She told us they would even use tricks with children to distract people. I pictured in my mind maybe a child having a tantrum or something.
This is the scene.
Two babies were put down on the steps, of all places St Peter's & urged to crawl toward one another. Of course we all watched. Then after a bit, in unison the adults picked up the babies & disappeared.
I didn't even think about it as it was happening.
ONly later did I think about how many parents would actually put their baby on steps where everyone's feet had trampled!
I wondered how much money those people made that time.
This is really how it is. Tourists don't normally wander around in quiet residential districts -- residents do.
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Post by open mind on Dec 16, 2014 20:28:41 GMT -5
Yet according to the workers, the way remains the same as it has always been, and is the same the world over...although in Aus a girl wearing pannts or short skirt to preps/convention would be marched off the ground...even bare shoulders get frowned upon..but sounds acceptable elsewhere..yep the same!
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Post by fixit on Dec 16, 2014 22:48:52 GMT -5
Yet according to the workers, the way remains the same as it has always been, and is the same the world over...although in Aus a girl wearing pannts or short skirt to preps/convention would be marched off the ground...even bare shoulders get frowned upon..but sounds acceptable elsewhere..yep the same! The Way i.e. Jesus will always remain the same "in every age and clime".
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Post by Deleted on Dec 17, 2014 5:19:18 GMT -5
Yet according to the workers, the way remains the same as it has always been, and is the same the world over...although in Aus a girl wearing pannts or short skirt to preps/convention would be marched off the ground...even bare shoulders get frowned upon..but sounds acceptable elsewhere..yep the same! The Way i.e. Jesus will always remain the same "in every age and clime". The same Jesus (man) will return. Marvel not at this.
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 17, 2014 17:45:03 GMT -5
You're away off base by blaming the black parents for their children's fate. This society is rigged against them. Ironically, no one is blaming the middle class white parents in this country who have mostly lost their ability to give their kids the education that can keep them out of the ghettos -- that's always the president's fault, never their own. The problem in this country is that the very poor white people are still privileged ahead of the very poor black people. And the notion that a successful black person is an "uppity black" is slow to fade away. I was given the "fear the black man" message loud and clear when I first went to work in Boston (from the Maritimes). I met a lot of loonies and crooks in the big city, but the time my check book and letters with signed checks in them fell out of my pocket in the subway, the biggest meanest black man sitting beside me mailed the check book to me and all the checks ended up where they were supposed to. There are great parents and terrible parents of all races and all degrees of wealth. I am not blaming poor black parents, I'm blaming parents of any color that don't care enough about their children to do everything within their power to give them a good life. I can only speak for the Upper Midwest, but I do not think black people have the deck stacked against them here. Have you heard of affirmative action? Assuming all qualifications and education are equal among job candidates, women and minorities will often be preferred over white males for the sake of diversification (at least in the white male dominated engineering field which I am most familiar with). There are also an abundance of scholarship opportunities for women and minorities (with limited competition) pursuing technological careers. These may seem unattainable for those living in poverty, but if the proper effort and parental guidance is given towards a child's free K-12 education the opportunities are endless. But, education isn't cool and as you said, successful black people are "uppity blacks". You seem to imply it's white people that attach that label, but I don't think that's the case. Whites don't accuse successful, educated, well-spoken black men of being "not black enough". nypost.com/2014/10/27/barkleys-brilliance-slams-acting-white-idiocy/FWIW -- The standard speech from the tower of white privilege, unfortunately.
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 17, 2014 17:52:14 GMT -5
By the way, what laws are keeping poor people down? No. The laws are made so that discrimination against "undesirables" can quietly flourish largely undetected.
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Post by dmmichgood on Dec 17, 2014 18:10:11 GMT -5
There are great parents and terrible parents of all races and all degrees of wealth. I am not blaming poor black parents, I'm blaming parents of any color that don't care enough about their children to do everything within their power to give them a good life. I can only speak for the Upper Midwest, but I do not think black people have the deck stacked against them here. Have you heard of affirmative action? Assuming all qualifications and education are equal among job candidates, women and minorities will often be preferred over white males for the sake of diversification (at least in the white male dominated engineering field which I am most familiar with). There are also an abundance of scholarship opportunities for women and minorities (with limited competition) pursuing technological careers. These may seem unattainable for those living in poverty, but if the proper effort and parental guidance is given towards a child's free K-12 education the opportunities are endless. But, education isn't cool and as you said, successful black people are "uppity blacks". You seem to imply it's white people that attach that label, but I don't think that's the case. Whites don't accuse successful, educated, well-spoken black men of being "not black enough". nypost.com/2014/10/27/barkleys-brilliance-slams-acting-white-idiocy/FWIW -- The standard speech from the tower of white privilege, unfortunately. Correct, Bob. The usual rationalization from those of white privilege.
Honestabe quote: "People that grow up in crummy/ghetto neighborhoods definitely have the cards of life stacked against them. Not by the police though, just by their own parents (or lack thereof) and violent surroundings. "
Honestabe, do you ever ask why they have to live in the "crummy/ghetto neighborhoods" to start with? Do you think that is where they really want to live?
BTW, where do you live?
Urban, rural, lily white, racially diverse, middle class, wealthy? Where?
Have you ever lived in a "ghetto?"
In a lot of European countries prior to WWII, Jews were kept in ghettos with actual walls around them. In our country now we have walls although invisible around black/poor ghettos.
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 17, 2014 18:22:30 GMT -5
FWIW -- The standard speech from the tower of white privilege, unfortunately. Correct, Bob. The usual rationalization from those of white privilege.
Honestabe quote: "People that grow up in crummy/ghetto neighborhoods definitely have the cards of life stacked against them. Not by the police though, just by their own parents (or lack thereof) and violent surroundings. "
Honestabe, do you ever ask why they have to live in the "crummy/ghetto neighborhoods" to start with? Do you think that is where they really want to live?
BTW, where do you live?
Urban, rural, lily white, racially diverse, middle class, wealthy? Where?
Have you ever lived in a "ghetto?"
In a lot of European countries prior to WWII, Jews were kept in ghettos with actual walls around them. In our country now we have walls although invisible around black/poor ghettos.
I would remind Honestabe that I have a black niece whose black father lives in the Upper Midwest, and he has never let his daughter join him there for her own safety -- she grew up with her mother in Canada. She would go to visit her relatives in the US and was freaked out by the way she was "looked at" when they were out in public. I often say that the privilege of being a minority is that you get an honest view of the underside of the upper class.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 17, 2014 21:10:13 GMT -5
Knew a woman once who was sold into prostitution while just a child by her mother and gandparents because she was the child of a French man and Thai-Vietnamese woman. Later after escaping as a teenager, she found the English, Thai, and Vietnamese languages to be her way out by becoming a U.S. translator. She served very well until stepping on a land mine.
Previously, in the USA we had refused to eat where a Negro Man was denied service.
Later, as I already recounted, there was my experience in NYC with someone from Georgia.
Even later Ylva, the children and I looked up a former M.D. of mine in Houma, La. taking him, is wife and children out to dinner. His wife said had she known people like us lived in South West Washington State, she would never have pressed him so severely to return to southern La.
Yes, there are still creeps on both sides of such issues, Like the one who killed my wife's policeman nephew in Tupelo Missippi, Gale Stauffer on last Christmas eve day merely because he could. People who want justification for such unjust deeds on either side simply will not find it from me.
It is saddening to me that any form of political fodder comes from such actions, and then frequently compounded by reporters seeking "bylines."
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Post by snow on Dec 17, 2014 22:16:53 GMT -5
In terms of parental situations, there are a number of things that could make it sketchy: Having one or both parents that want nothing to do with the child. Single mothers that see a child as a source of income via child support or welfare checks. Parents that selfishly put their own needs ahead of the needs of their children. Parents that are too immature to know what their children need in order to become a productive member of society. Parents that don't value education. Parents that let their children get away with everything, and instill no discipline or moral values. Parents that abuse their kids in any form. Parents that spoil their kids way too much and never make them work for anything in their life. Parents who instill prejudice, hate, or violence in their children. Sketchy as I used it is basically a very all-encompassing term to describe something that is less than desirable. Honestabe, it wasn't me that needed a definition of 'sketchy'.
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rs
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Post by rs on Dec 18, 2014 16:56:02 GMT -5
Honestabe, it wasn't me that needed a definition of 'sketchy'. I know, the quoting was all messed up. It made it look like rs was asking you for a definition, even though I was the one that used it. So this was supposed to be in reply to rs, I thought. Sorry, yes was me - think I was caught at a bad moment, as single mother to two young children kind of jumped at the idea that may mean we are more likely to have problems ahead, no worries, am aware of the stats...
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Post by dmmichgood on Dec 18, 2014 18:05:25 GMT -5
Correct, Bob. The usual rationalization from those of white privilege.
Honestabe quote: "People that grow up in crummy/ghetto neighborhoods definitely have the cards of life stacked against them. Not by the police though, just by their own parents (or lack thereof) and violent surroundings. "
Honestabe, do you ever ask why they have to live in the "crummy/ghetto neighborhoods" to start with? Do you think that is where they really want to live?
BTW, where do you live?
Urban, rural, lily white, racially diverse, middle class, wealthy? Where?
Have you ever lived in a "ghetto?"
In a lot of European countries prior to WWII, Jews were kept in ghettos with actual walls around them. In our country now we have walls although invisible around black/poor ghettos. My guess is that most of them were raised in those neighborhoods. Poverty/violence/substance abuse can be a vicious cycle to break out of if that's all you've ever known. But that's true for whites also. These people have very difficult lives as a result of circumstance (or accident of birth, as Matt10 might say) not as a result of the color of their skin or Hitler-esque cops trying to wipe out every black person they see. I live in the suburbs of a major US city. My home shares a wall with a mixed race family. I have black and Asian co-workers. Whites are the majority, but there are a fair % of first-generation immigrants from Asia, Europe, and Africa in my community. No I have never lived in a ghetto, but despite what you might think I have great empathy for those who do. My heart breaks for the underprivileged. I try to give money whenever I see a homeless person on the street. Don't try painting me as this white supremacist, you're far off base. I am not trying to paint you as anything. All I have to go by in your own posts. Rhetoric such as: "My home shares a wall with a mixed race family. I have black and Asian co-workers." or " I have a good friend who is black," etc. etc. are often used as an attempt to try make oneself & others believe that they are not guilty of any pregjudice toward anyone.
It is not the way just one individual acts, it is a institutional action and the mindset that people have to rationalize why people live as they do. It is the cases of how the POOR are judged that I am talking about.
The fact that one can live a better life in a good community themselves & blame the poor for not being able to do the same, discounts the many advantages in their lives that have enabled them to live that better life.
Male, white, middle class, able to get at least a good basic education, which leads to a higher paying job, Maybe A union to support better health & other benefits(which, by the way, lifts the the benefits of non-union workers as it lifts the union workers)
I am:
female, white, raised on a farm, able get a good education led to job as a nurse no union support.
I am able to understand the advantages I had, (white, middle class, good education, good vocation) & disadvantages of a ( black female, raise in a ghetto, with overcrowded poor schools)
Giving money to street people doesn't address the institutional problems that causes them to be street people in the first place.
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 18, 2014 21:37:37 GMT -5
No. The laws are made so that discrimination against "undesirables" can quietly flourish largely undetected. So you're telling me it's all just a bunch of hand-waving that nobody can put a finger on but it must be there? So far not a single actual thing has been said on how blacks/minorities that want to succeed and move on from "the ghetto" are being kept down by "the system". You haven't been listening. Did you follow the discussion on grand juries, and how many WHITE people didn't know how they work? ? The poverty is not the real problem. The mechanisms that keep poor people poor are the tyranny that hasn't yet reached established white people. It's coming. Yes. For lots of reasons. But most obvious is the fact that white faces are a lot less scary than black faces. Similarly "Joe" gets called for interviews far more often than "José". Of course, white people can't see that happening, so they don't think it's a problem.
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Post by BobWilliston on Dec 18, 2014 21:40:04 GMT -5
FWIW -- The standard speech from the tower of white privilege, unfortunately. FWIW -- It's an Ivory Tower I live in, get your baseless accusations right. I recognized where you live by what you wrote. If you lived anywhere else in this country you'd never have made that statement. You are more transparent than you think.
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