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Post by faune on Aug 20, 2014 18:27:15 GMT -5
Thanks for pointing that out. Sorry - I corrected it. I meant to write TMBers. Cherie ~ Thanks for the correcting your mistake ~ you had me wondering there for a moment.
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Post by emy on Aug 20, 2014 19:31:25 GMT -5
I'm fine with those who have made their choice to leave. I'm not so fine with them "blaming" it on "those inquiring about missing members." That takes in STR, Snow, Yknot, Dennis, Fixit, Faune and other believers.
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Post by SharonArnold on Aug 20, 2014 20:00:54 GMT -5
Yeah. This may be a ship that has sailed. I've seen similar happenings again and again through the years with these kinds of forums. I am another person where a light has died with the departure of Clearday and Edgar from TMB. When I told Clearday that I thought this situation had the power to bring down this board, he replied "That was never my intention." Nevertheless. IMO, if you want to continuously debate the existence/non-existence of "God", go do it on a board unrelated to 2X2ism. Or if you have an overwhelming need to be right, find another forum. Or talk to yourself in an empty room. Seriously. But, perhaps the 2x2/ex-2X2 world has evolved to such a degree that a board like this is no longer necessary. If that is the case, then I am happy. Or, it's time for a re-birth in a slightly different format. Issues are different, people are different, from even 5 years ago. Time will tell. If that is what is needed, then that is what will happen. I am reminded of the Bertrand Russell quote "The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt." The specifics may have shifted in the intervening years, but the underlying truth has not. Why should I have to "go do it on a board unrelated to 2X2ism, Sharon? Do you think that I am NOT an ex-2x2's?
Should I have no place here to posts my opinions, my journey away from the 2x2's & the conclusion that I came to?
And must we put up with someone twisting our comments, which CD did that apparently some of you still can't see? Were we supposed just let them stand as he had twisted them as if they were in indeed what we had said? Your comment: "if you want to continuously debate the existence/non-existence of "God", go do it on a board unrelated to 2X2ism. Or if you have an overwhelming need to be right, find another forum. Or talk to yourself in an empty room. Seriously." is a slap in the face to all of us here just trying to tell our story of our exit from the 2x2's & how we got to where we are!
PS: I suppose that you know of "Why I Am Not A Christian," lecture by Bertrand RussellQuite aware of the “Why I am not a Christian” lecture. Thanks. Also quite aware that these days, in the time of the “cult of Richard Dawkins” that someone could deliver a similar lecture on atheism. It’s not so much about the specifics of belief – it’s more about attitudes. Now, it’s not that I am defending Christianity – and there are many Christians who would label me as more atheist than Christian. But not all would. I’m okay, either way. It’s not about you posting your opinions, your journey away from 2X2ism, your conclusions that is a problem. Far from it. Indeed, it is that very thing, expressed from an open heart, that gives forums like this (or 2X2 meetings, or any other human interaction, for that matter) any kind of power. These days, I am learning about advocacy in a well-entrenched system (totally unrelated to 2X2ism). I am learning that no matter how convinced I am of my rightness, nor how articulate (or strident) I am, no matter how good my arguments are, there are people who will NEVER EVER see things the way I see them. I am trying to learn how to accept this with grace, and still effect change, as best I can. (Now, unlike Snow, I could never legitimately be accused of having any kind of grace.) But somehow, it is basically about having respect for other people, and acknowledging their entitlement to their own opinion – even if it is not the way I see it. 2X2’s/ex-2X2’s are my tribe. Whether I like it or not, it is bone deep, it exists in me at a cellular level. I care about these people. It’s partly because I still have friends and family in the system, but it is far greater than that – and not something I can easily articulate. When I see people moving towards greater freedom and accountability, whether still part of the system or not, my heart gives a silent cheer. When I see communication being shut down, I do not see that as a good thing. But in the end, whatever happens to this forum, I think of the words of that song “The moving finger writes and then moves on… There’s nothing left to say, for it is all just perfect anyway.”
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Post by fixit on Aug 20, 2014 20:13:45 GMT -5
Quite aware of the “Why I am not a Christian” lecture. Thanks. Also quite aware that these days, in the time of the “cult of Richard Dawkins” that someone could deliver a similar lecture on atheism. It’s not so much about the specifics of belief – it’s more about attitudes. Now, it’s not that I am defending Christianity – and there are many Christians who would label me as more atheist than Christian. But not all would. I’m okay, either way. It’s not about you posting your opinions, your journey away from 2X2ism, your conclusions that is a problem. Far from it. Indeed, it is that very thing, expressed from an open heart, that gives forums like this (or 2X2 meetings, or any other human interaction, for that matter) any kind of power. These days, I am learning about advocacy in a well-entrenched system (totally unrelated to 2X2ism). I am learning that no matter how convinced I am of my rightness, nor how articulate (or strident) I am, no matter how good my arguments are, there are people who will NEVER EVER see things the way I see them. I am trying to learn how to accept this with grace, and still effect change, as best I can. (Now, unlike Snow, I could never legitimately be accused of having any kind of grace.) But somehow, it is basically about having respect for other people, and acknowledging their entitlement to their own opinion – even if it is not the way I see it. 2X2’s/ex-2X2’s are my tribe. Whether I like it or not, it is bone deep, it exists in me at a cellular level. I care about these people. It’s partly because I still have friends and family in the system, but it is far greater than that – and not something I can easily articulate. When I see people moving towards greater freedom and accountability, whether still part of the system or not, my heart gives a silent cheer. When I see communication being shut down, I do not see that as a good thing. But in the end, whatever happens to this forum, I think of the words of that song “The moving finger writes and then moves on… There’s nothing left to say, for it is all just perfect anyway.” Well said Sharon. I'd like to nominate this as post of the week!
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Post by rational on Aug 20, 2014 20:40:41 GMT -5
could the reason be the Secularisation of the TMB ?? Folks who want to discuss 2x2 church issues don't always want to debate the existence of God. In the vast majority of the cases it is a theist who raises the question regarding the existence of god. Posts stating that "There must be a god because...well, just look at the stars" or something along that line. If you post your statements that you feel prove there is a god in most cases someone will want to discuss those with you. When someone posts that atheists have no morals because morality comes from god - someone will be happy to discuss the issue. If you don't wish to discuss the existence of god don't bring it up and don't make negative statements regarding atheists.
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Post by placid-void on Aug 20, 2014 20:41:50 GMT -5
I'll second the motion by fixit.
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Post by faune on Aug 20, 2014 20:58:15 GMT -5
Sharon ~ I second Fixit's remark about nominating you last comment as "post of the week." The insights you espounded are truly amazing and right on target. I personally could relate to a lot of what you shared and how you may find yourself even being viewed due to your open-mindedness. However, standing true to what resonants within your heart is truly a virtue worth cultivating regardless what beliefs we adhere to in this life.
From facilitating small groups in the past, I could really relate to what you shared about this forum changing in its focus and perhaps that's a good thing? It shows growth and maturity taking place and willingness to consider another's point of view for what it has to offer, even if we don't agree entirely with the person making the comments. I have noticed in this past year that the climate on TMB has definitely changed from past years as I remembered it and I appreciated that fact. That's one reason why I'm still posting here, because I see meaningful change and improvement in the topics being discussed and the interactions between members. Maybe more tolerance and respect could be developed over time, but I feel TMB is on the right track regardless of the opinions of some that are less favorable. I feel we all can work together to make this a pleasant place to hang out and discuss our concerns and share our opinions without "butting heads" over the small stuff that really doesn't matter. Hopefully, meaningful change will develop over time and TMB will become more involved in advocacy and helping one another to better understand their own beliefs and the possibility of change within any system regardless how entrenched some attitudes may appear to be? JMT Sharon shared earlier...
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Post by placid-void on Aug 20, 2014 21:15:37 GMT -5
I feel a caustic.
Perhaps it comes from within.
Reflecting on my own motivations I am unable to distinguish a personal desire to convince another or be convinced by another of any particular point of view.
Rather, I come to the board to share ideas. I hold some ideas with conviction and others are still in the process of maturing. My greatest need is for a responsive sounding board; intelligent people sharing their life experiences, their knowledge, their sensibilities, their sense of the sublime and the absurd.
We all have access to so many different venues that will confirm our prejudices and allow us to hold-forth on our most treasured dogmas. What is more difficult to find is a safe harbor to feel, learn, grow and share without the rancor that masquerades so convincingly as intelligent discourse.
To those most intrigued by the journey and not the destination, may I say, “. . . . whither thou goest . . . “
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Post by bubbles on Aug 20, 2014 21:29:18 GMT -5
This is sad.
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Post by dmmichgood on Aug 20, 2014 21:47:51 GMT -5
Why should I have to "go do it on a board unrelated to 2X2ism, Sharon? Do you think that I am NOT an ex-2x2's?
Should I have no place here to posts my opinions, my journey away from the 2x2's & the conclusion that I came to?
And must we put up with someone twisting our comments, which CD did that apparently some of you still can't see? Were we supposed just let them stand as he had twisted them as if they were in indeed what we had said? Your comment: "if you want to continuously debate the existence/non-existence of "God", go do it on a board unrelated to 2X2ism. Or if you have an overwhelming need to be right, find another forum. Or talk to yourself in an empty room. Seriously." is a slap in the face to all of us here just trying to tell our story of our exit from the 2x2's & how we got to where we are!
PS: I suppose that you know of "Why I Am Not A Christian," lecture by Bertrand Russell Quite aware of the “Why I am not a Christian” lecture. Thanks. Also quite aware that these days, in the time of the “cult of Richard Dawkins” that someone could deliver a similar lecture on atheism. It’s not so much about the specifics of belief – it’s more about attitudes.Now, it’s not that I am defending Christianity – and there are many Christians who would label me as more atheist than Christian. But not all would. I’m okay, either way. It’s not about you posting your opinions, your journey away from 2X2ism, your conclusions that is a problem. Far from it. Indeed, it is that very thing, expressed from an open heart, that gives forums like this (or 2X2 meetings, or any other human interaction, for that matter) any kind of power. These days, I am learning about advocacy in a well-entrenched system (totally unrelated to 2X2ism). I am learning that no matter how convinced I am of my rightness, nor how articulate (or strident) I am, no matter how good my arguments are, there are people who will NEVER EVER see things the way I see them. I am trying to learn how to accept this with grace, and still effect change, as best I can. (Now, unlike Snow, I could never legitimately be accused of having any kind of grace.) But somehow, it is basically about having respect for other people, and acknowledging their entitlement to their own opinion – even if it is not the way I see it. 2X2’s/ex-2X2’s are my tribe. Whether I like it or not, it is bone deep. It exists in me at a cellular level. I care about these people. It’s partly because I still have friends and family in the system, but it is far greater than that – and not something I can easily articulate. When I see people moving towards greater freedom and accountability, whether still part of the system or not, my heart gives a silent cheer. When I see communication being shut down, I do not see that as a good thing. But in the end, whatever happens to this forum, I think of the words of that song “The moving finger writes and then moves on… There’s nothing left to say, for it is all just perfect anyway.” Thank you for your response.
Those who have left the 2x2's & moved to another religion discuss here why they left & what they now believe & why they believe it . Why should atheists not also be able to do the same, post what we now believe & why we believe it?
As for this comment you made, "It’s not so much about the specifics of belief – it’s more about attitudes." Attitudes? How many times has anyone professing heard that same comment from a worker, or elder, that the problem wasn't specifics, "but our attitude." How can one pin down a problem & solve it when faced with such a nebulous concept as "attitude?"
Of course, I also know that there are people who will never see things the way I see them. I don't really post for them. I hope others will think about something different than they have ever heard expressed before.
2X2’s/ex-2X2’s are my tribe as well! I also care about these people! I also have friends and family still in the system!
If you really don't want to see communication being shut down, why did you tell us, "if you want to continuously debate the existence/non-existence of "God", go do it on a board unrelated to 2X2ism. Or if you have an overwhelming need to be right, find another forum. Or talk to yourself in an empty room. Seriously." ?
PS:
this is this is accurate quote of the "moving finger" quote by Omar Khayyam
The Moving Finger
The Moving Finger writes; and, having writ, Moves on: nor all your Piety nor Wit Shall lure it back to cancel half a Line, Nor all your Tears wash out a Word of it
-- Omar Khayyam
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Post by slowtosee on Aug 20, 2014 21:55:23 GMT -5
Agreed, very sad. I think of many precious people, like the ones from Vietnam, who have been greatly helped in not feeling so alone in their hard experiences, by finding a forum like this where they could share their journey and find encouragement. Maybe the ship has sailed, I dunno, but maybe it just needs a little time in harbour, and then can be useful and a help to those in need. Keep the lower lights burning....some poor fainting struggling seaman....... thanks for all those who have helped me here. Alvin Kroeker
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Post by dmmichgood on Aug 20, 2014 22:17:04 GMT -5
I feel a caustic. Perhaps it comes from within. Reflecting on my own motivations I am unable to distinguish a personal desire to convince another or be convinced by another of any particular point of view. Rather, I come to the board to share ideas. I hold some ideas with conviction and others are still in the process of maturing. My greatest need is for a responsive sounding board; intelligent people sharing their life experiences, their knowledge, their sensibilities, their sense of the sublime and the absurd.
We all have access to so many different venues that will confirm our prejudices and allow us to hold-forth on our most treasured dogmas. What is more difficult to find is a safe harbor to feel, learn, grow and share without the rancor that masquerades so convincingly as intelligent discourse. To those most intrigued by the journey and not the destination, may I say, “. . . . whither thou goest . . . “ I agree, yknot. That is why I have been captivated by this TMB board.
A bit of a different take on your quote. With me it more "there goest I except for the fortunate circumstances that I have experienced in life."
Had I not had the parents that were determined that we could get the best education possible.. Had I gone to a meeting where there was a sex offender... (there one in a meeting that was actually closer to us ) Had I not been white...
On & on.
I see a woman having to live on the street and I think, "except for my good fortune there goest I."
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Post by bubbles on Aug 20, 2014 23:06:24 GMT -5
Agreed, very sad. I think of many precious people, like the ones from Vietnam, who have been greatly helped in not feeling so alone in their hard experiences, by finding a forum like this where they could share their journey and find encouragement. Maybe the ship has sailed, I dunno, but maybe it just needs a little time in harbour, and then can be useful and a help to those in need. Keep the lower lights burning....some poor fainting struggling seaman....... thanks for all those who have helped me here. Alvin Kroeker Correct. We have no idea other than the words typed how a person is coping when they come to this site.
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Post by warriorwalrus on Aug 20, 2014 23:40:19 GMT -5
Who remembers the good old days when spiderman and the like were on here... Edgar was there, Snow might have been. Good times! I first joined back then, and have returned about 7 years later to see what is up. I also noticed there may be a new board, or one I am unaware of... TLC? Anyone care to tell me what is up with that one?
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Post by CherieKropp on Aug 21, 2014 0:24:41 GMT -5
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Post by sharingtheriches on Aug 21, 2014 9:04:22 GMT -5
RAM is OK - We emailed back and forth quite a bit last week. He sent me some photos of Scotland. He is very busy and short on time. He's a writer, volunteer and has family he takes care of. We met with him for an enjoyable dinner when we visited Scotland in April. Unless he changes his mind...CD wont be back. He wrote me... It's not going to happen. The exit may seem sudden but it had been coming for some time. Some may think it was a emotional departure or something but there is no anger or hurt involved. To summarize, my "mission" on TMB has been evaporating over the last couple of years so as a result, my tolerance for wasted time and hostile nonsense has dropped precipitously.....so that particular situation of a huge waste of time in a hostile setting was merely a catalyst. I would have stayed around without a mission for friendly banter and fewer posts but that sort of friendly environment doesn't exist, or at least not to a sufficient extent to convince me to stay or go back. I'm a big believer in freedom of expression so I think Admin should probably err in that direction and let things go wherever it's going to go. I too find very little on TMB worth my time to read anymore, and rarely post anymore, preferring to give my time to other things I find more satisfying. The atmosphere of TMB reminds me of the time we decided to create TLC, five years ago, back in Aug 2009. Pretty dead and monopolized by a few frequent posters. Fixit's comment was right on target also: Folks who want to discuss 2x2 church issues don't always want to debate the existence of God. I wouldnt be surprised if he also leaves... I notice hberry and jondough aren't posting much anymore either... FWIW, I have been told by some of the "missing people" that the very ones inquiring about the missing TLCers edit: TMBers are the reason they are no longer coming here. TMB is not doing anything for them anymore, and they have better ways to spend their time. They move on... Time for a reality check: "I have seen the enemy, and it is me." PS Not talking about you STR/Sharon! CK edited to correct TLCers to TMBers Thank you for the update on Ram! He is one of several whom I've missed....earlier this summer I almost quit, but came back with the thought in mind that IF I could help any NOT to quit, then I'd put up with it! As someone mentioned in something like your "they have better ways to spend their time. They move on..."that this is just part and parcel of the 2x2ers exiting the fellowship....a need to keep in touch one way or another, a need to say what one feels or what one has gone through due to the 2x2s and when growth within us does move us on....... I'm sure that in the past, we've had a course of time when a certain flavor of posting kept control, then that waxed and waned away....and so it is so now with a couple trying to hold onto the fact of the reality of their God and His great kindnesses in the face of complete doubt of such, then the tables switch again...so that's life in the fast lane, eh? I understand Clearday's decision in the light of his explanation to you...I had sensed a great difference in his posting of emotional, intellectual changes/growth and as he would be the one who knows best for himself, I say I pray him blessed with success and peace and love! As to Edgar! I hate that he is gone, primarily because of our Vietnamese folks, but of course, he is apt to keep in touch with them via email...etc! And too, I pray peace, love and success for Edgar! Thanks again, Cherie....you do a wonderful job of keeping anything of the 2x2 situations straightened out for the rest of us.....I'm sure you have a certain pleasure in knowing that there are many of us that appreciate you and your efforts. May you, too, know peace, love and success!
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Post by sharingtheriches on Aug 21, 2014 9:10:23 GMT -5
Well if I'm the reason good people are leaving, I know how to fix that. Don't leave, please, Snow.I second DMG, Snow! You've added something into the mix that should have been considered there always! And that is "love"...we can't be honest moral citizens without love...either giving it or receiving it! Sometimes it's easier to give love then it is to receive it....so I've been told!
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Post by sharingtheriches on Aug 21, 2014 9:18:42 GMT -5
I'm fine with those who have made their choice to leave. I'm not so fine with them "blaming" it on "those inquiring about missing members." That takes in STR, Snow, Yknot, Dennis, Fixit, Faune and other believers. It seems to me, that as Emy says, and inquiry relating to those we miss shouldn't be considered a reason for such diatribe as blaming anyone for the failing of TMB! I started this thread because I sincerely miss both men, as well as I miss Ram, Jondough, and others I am failing to recall their name but had appreciated their posts even when I totally disagreed with them. When I disagree with someone/something is when I get the brakes put on, and I then usually study that disagreement closer and many times I come away from that and see what the person may have been saying and agree that they have had a point or more, even if I continue doggedly in what I believe on the issue! We have gotten to "know" in part these longterm posters on TMB and it's like part of the family has left to go to another country, so far away, that we're suffering loss......IMO
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Post by sharingtheriches on Aug 21, 2014 9:31:00 GMT -5
Agreed, very sad. I think of many precious people, like the ones from Vietnam, who have been greatly helped in not feeling so alone in their hard experiences, by finding a forum like this where they could share their journey and find encouragement. Maybe the ship has sailed, I dunno, but maybe it just needs a little time in harbour, and then can be useful and a help to those in need. Keep the lower lights burning....some poor fainting struggling seaman....... thanks for all those who have helped me here. Alvin Kroeker Alvin,I agree with you and thanks for putting it into easy words to understand.....the Vietnam issue is still much alive and likely to get worse before it gets better with the advent of the return of American/Canadian overseers! Thus with Edgar leaving has caused me a great concern...though honestly he has more opportunities to correspond with them then the TMB, it's just that we won't be privy to the questions and helps he may bring to those dear Vietnamese folks! This is perhaps the biggest reason I held on to staying here myself, this summer....a deep love and concern for a suffering people in all their simplistic lives and some even very poor being over run by workers who want to live like they're back in the US instead of making themselves "poor to the 'poor" Or as Paul wrote that he was everything to all people! Happy to the happy, sad to the sad, rich to the rich, poor to the poor. He also wrote that he did not take a thing from a church of folks of questionable financial ability, apparently...so he was poor to the poor....though other churches bore his needs while he worked with the poor church! And Clearday had become well versed in the CSA issues all around the world within the 2x2s that I hate to see him leave...perhaps we might see a note from him on the WINGS site?
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Post by faune on Aug 21, 2014 11:02:41 GMT -5
I'm fine with those who have made their choice to leave. I'm not so fine with them "blaming" it on "those inquiring about missing members." That takes in STR, Snow, Yknot, Dennis, Fixit, Faune and other believers. Emy ~ I believe that was a direct statement made by Cherie herself and I personally doubt either Clearday or Edgar included us as the reason for their leaving TMB from talking with them both on Facebook? Perhaps there are some ex-members who frequent TLC who shared that opinion, which I thought might have been the reason for Cherie's slip-up in words earlier, which motivated me to address her about it?
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Post by CherieKropp on Aug 21, 2014 11:50:29 GMT -5
Clarday emailed me: If anyone ever wants to get in touch with me, feel free to give them my email address off-board.
And I'm always looking for casual readers of my blog! mindmuser.wordpress.com/
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Post by faune on Aug 21, 2014 13:10:30 GMT -5
Clarday emailed me: If anyone ever wants to get in touch with me, feel free to give them my email address off-board.
And I'm always looking for casual readers of my blog! mindmuser.wordpress.com/
Cherie ~ Thanks for that link to Clearday's blog. I added it to my Favorite Bar for future reference.
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Post by warriorwalrus on Aug 21, 2014 17:48:02 GMT -5
I changed my name because I feel like I am a different person now, and the fact that I posted a lot of zealous things without a lot of wisdom etc. That being said I used to post as Davinci. For the last 7 years I kinda moved away from home, graduated, and left the 2x2's. Now I have trained to be a "false prophet" (according to the workers and several "friends"), in other words I went to bible college for 4 years and am now back in the world and have started my own business in digital media.
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Post by xna on Aug 21, 2014 17:59:27 GMT -5
I changed my name because I feel like I am a different person now, and the fact that I posted a lot of zealous things without a lot of wisdom etc. That being said I used to post as Davinci. For the last 7 years I kinda moved away from home, graduated, and left the 2x2's. Now I have trained to be a "false prophet" (according to the workers and several "friends"), in other words I went to bible college for 4 years and am now back in the world and have started my own business in digital media. For those willing to keep learning, I find you can become "different people" as life progresses. Good luck with your business.
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Post by faune on Aug 21, 2014 20:37:26 GMT -5
Who remembers the good old days when spiderman and the like were on here... Edgar was there, Snow might have been. Good times! I first joined back then, and have returned about 7 years later to see what is up. I also noticed there may be a new board, or one I am unaware of... TLC? Anyone care to tell me what is up with that one?Warriorwalrus ~ I can't say because I was banned from TLC two years ago due to my POV along with some others who didn't fit well on that private and exclusive board. It's more like a private club where you need a referral from a member to even be considered for membership along with strict adherence to a number of rules in place to keep "the peace of the board." Also, I heard that you get 3 strikes and you're out for good. So, if accepted, you better behave and not rock the boat in anyway with Admin. or you will be sent packing.
Honestly, it probably would remind you of the 2x2's all over again in many ways? If you miss the F&W's, it might be a place worth considering to bring back memories left behind? You just have to find a member who would personally recommend you and vouch for your character and then pass Admin's hoops to get on board?
Here's a post describing TLC back in March 2014.
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Post by faune on Aug 21, 2014 20:43:29 GMT -5
I changed my name because I feel like I am a different person now, and the fact that I posted a lot of zealous things without a lot of wisdom etc. That being said I used to post as Davinci. For the last 7 years I kinda moved away from home, graduated, and left the 2x2's. Now I have trained to be a "false prophet" (according to the workers and several "friends"), in other words I went to bible college for 4 years and am now back in the world and have started my own business in digital media. For those willing to keep learning, I find you can become "different people" as life progresses. Good luck with your business. Xna ~ I agree. Anything is possible for those willing to keep learning and allow their new knowledge to transform their lives.
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Post by Jesse_Lackman on Aug 23, 2014 17:27:52 GMT -5
And must we put up with someone twisting our comments, which CD did that apparently some of you still can't see? Were we supposed just let them stand as he had twisted them as if they were in indeed what we had said?
Yes I don't think very many saw that no matter how many times it was explained. It's so interesting to read what CD wrote to Cherie "my tolerance for wasted time and hostile nonsense has dropped precipitously.....so that particular situation of a huge waste of time in a hostile setting was merely a catalyst." That is exactly how I feel because of the times CD (and others) attributed positions to me I never actually held and ideas I never had. Those false positions and misrepresentations were relentlessly defended as if they were the truth. What made that cross the line to hostile for me was the utter refusal to admit the misrepresentations - so there wasn't ever any remorse or apology for doing it. To the end they acted as if their imagination of my position was The Only Possible Truthful and Correct Representation. I harbor no ill will or resentment, that is easy for me to do because in spite of the false positions and misrepresentations attributed to me I know the real truth of the matter. I'd suppose it's the same for you DMG - you too know the real truth of the matter. Other's imaginations and misrepresentations will never change the real truth of the matter.
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Post by rational on Aug 23, 2014 18:26:00 GMT -5
And must we put up with someone twisting our comments, which CD did that apparently some of you still can't see? Were we supposed just let them stand as he had twisted them as if they were in indeed what we had said?
Yes I don't think very many saw that no matter how many times it was explained. It's so interesting to read what CD wrote to Cherie "my tolerance for wasted time and hostile nonsense has dropped precipitously.....so that particular situation of a huge waste of time in a hostile setting was merely a catalyst." That is exactly how I feel because of the times CD (and others) attributed positions to me I never actually held and ideas I never had. Those false positions and misrepresentations were relentlessly defended as if they were the truth. What made that cross the line to hostile for me was the utter refusal to admit the misrepresentations - so there wasn't ever any remorse or apology for doing it. To the end they acted as if their imagination of my position was The Only Possible Truthful and Correct Representation. I harbor no ill will or resentment, that is easy for me to do because in spite of the false positions and misrepresentations attributed to me I know the real truth of the matter. I'd suppose it's the same for you DMG - you too know the real truth of the matter. Other's imaginations and misrepresentations will never change the real truth of the matter. :) Exactly. And it was not the only time.
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