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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2014 14:11:59 GMT -5
I believe the first generation of professing saints probably did. They were raised in mainstream churches and kept some of the childhood teachings right on up to the end. Among my family, I remember so many who lacked peace as they approached the end. I have seen people laughing and talking in the nursing homes. My dear relatives wanted to be alone. They were happy when the workers or friends came in but didn't try to make friends in the nursing home. The TV would have kept them company but they didn't want to be seen watching TV. The workers or friends might come into the room and see them watching the idol.
I have heard of workers who were afraid that they hadn't done enough. I have seen accounts of worker's last days where the worker felt like he or she could have done more for the Kingdom.
It is hard to believe in a works based doctrine and have peace at the end. There are exceptions to the rule as some professing families have sensible views about God's love and mercy. Some feared they might be lost because it had been years since they were able to be at a meeting. I am thankful some in Truth can have peace when they near the end of life. I am saddened that some don't know the love of God at the end of life.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2014 15:20:36 GMT -5
i've never met one of the friends that wasn't at peace when they were dying, yet...i'm at peace right now so if i were to end up on my death bed i would be content with that...
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2014 15:46:28 GMT -5
Good. I think this is something that will die out soon. The WW II and Korean war Generations seems fixed on trying to earn salvation based upon their dedication to the group. Many felt they couldn't be good enough or do enough to be accepted.I think other works based groups go through the same "unsure about my salvation" phase. And these are good people who have NOTHING to worry about.
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Post by ellie on Jun 4, 2014 6:55:57 GMT -5
I was pleasantly surprised to hear one worker comment on how good it was to see the peace and assurance of some specific older folk.
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Post by Greg on Jun 4, 2014 7:17:08 GMT -5
One overseer was asked about why worldly people have such a peace in their dying. The response was "the dead only know peace."
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Post by Deleted on Jun 4, 2014 7:29:26 GMT -5
I wished professing folks in nursing homes could spend the time watching TV, playing bingo or listening to gospel music in the conference room. T be unable to move and have nothing to do would be BORING! I remember visiting some older saints and noticing how they would sit around with the lights turned off. The last days can be good days if we are engaged in something we enjoy. As long as we aren't in pain and have a sound mind, we don't have to spend the last days in isolation.
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Post by Greg on Jun 4, 2014 12:18:50 GMT -5
One overseer was asked about why worldly people have such a peace in their dying. The response was "the dead only know peace." i can't tell...did he mean that as a shot at "worldly" people or was he saying he actually thought that all dead people would have peace after death? I think he meant it as a shot to the so-called worldly. I'll elaborate on what I understood, the "worldly" would be dead to Christ.
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Post by dmmichgood on Jun 4, 2014 13:16:34 GMT -5
One overseer was asked about why worldly people have such a peace in their dying. The response was "the dead only know peace." Both the question and answer was rather a broad brush to paint all people who are dying. As I nurse I can tell you "peace" when dying is on a continuum like about everything else in life.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 4, 2014 14:02:16 GMT -5
Why do obits love to say "Mr. Smith died peacefully surrounded by his friends and family". I am more thinking about the days leading up to the final moment.
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Post by Scott Ross on Jun 6, 2014 10:07:16 GMT -5
Why do obits love to say "Mr. Smith died peacefully surrounded by his friends and family". I am more thinking about the days leading up to the final moment. Because it sounds much better than saying that "Mr Smith was screaming incoherently when he died, worrying that Valiant Thor was coming to get him."
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Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2014 10:20:29 GMT -5
Most people are usually incoherent just before death especially cancer patients.
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Post by rational on Jun 6, 2014 10:47:19 GMT -5
I wished professing folks in nursing homes could spend the time watching TV, playing bingo or listening to gospel music in the conference room. T be unable to move and have nothing to do would be BORING! I remember visiting some older saints and noticing how they would sit around with the lights turned off. The last days can be good days if we are engaged in something we enjoy. As long as we aren't in pain and have a sound mind, we don't have to spend the last days in isolation. Some people's minds are active enough to keep them entertained without external input.
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Post by rational on Jun 6, 2014 10:49:08 GMT -5
Why do obits love to say "Mr. Smith died peacefully surrounded by his friends and family". I am more thinking about the days leading up to the final moment. Because it sounds much better than saying that "Mr Smith was screaming incoherently when he died, worrying that Valiant Thor was coming to get him." Valiant Thor reads here and you may well get a visit before it is time for you to shuffle off that mortal coil!
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Post by rational on Jun 6, 2014 10:50:01 GMT -5
Why do obits love to say "Mr. Smith died peacefully surrounded by his friends and family". I am more thinking about the days leading up to the final moment. I am thinking drugs.
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Post by Gene on Jun 6, 2014 20:44:55 GMT -5
Because it sounds much better than saying that "Mr Smith was screaming incoherently when he died, worrying that Valiant Thor was coming to get him." Valiant Thor reads here and you may well get a visit before it is time for you to shuffle off that mortal coil! Oh my gosh! Do you suppose NB is actually VT? !?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2014 20:52:27 GMT -5
I wished professing folks in nursing homes could spend the time watching TV, playing bingo or listening to gospel music in the conference room. T be unable to move and have nothing to do would be BORING! I remember visiting some older saints and noticing how they would sit around with the lights turned off. The last days can be good days if we are engaged in something we enjoy. As long as we aren't in pain and have a sound mind, we don't have to spend the last days in isolation. Some people's minds are active enough to keep them entertained without external input. That would be me!
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Post by dmmichgood on Jun 7, 2014 0:18:09 GMT -5
Valiant Thor reads here and you may well get a visit before it is time for you to shuffle off that mortal coil! Oh my gosh! Do you suppose NB is actually VT? !? Who is this imposter, NB?
How dare HE!
I AM Valiant Thor! "I am Valiant Thor! Do not try to escape me. Pleading is futile and so are your prayers. There is one thing that you must not do. Do not say my name, do not say my name, do not say my name, my name, -in vain!"(tune of "O come all ye faithful")
PS: My apology to "I am the Grither"
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Post by BobWilliston on Jun 7, 2014 1:33:12 GMT -5
Why do obits love to say "Mr. Smith died peacefully surrounded by his friends and family". I am more thinking about the days leading up to the final moment. Well, not everyone dies screaming and choking, I suppose.
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Post by BobWilliston on Jun 7, 2014 1:35:39 GMT -5
Is there someone delusional on this board?
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Post by jondough on Jun 7, 2014 8:51:34 GMT -5
Not to hijack this thread, so this is just a quick question Nathan....no cut and paste answers please.
I know Leo didn't teach you about VT....or any other F&W.
1. What made you begin to believe in VT and Aliens? Was it from watching YouTube videos?
2. When did you start believing the above?
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Post by eyedeetentee on Jun 7, 2014 9:52:29 GMT -5
I guess, when people are taught to believe all things spoken by one group and to believe that a god is directing them in all things, they no longer use their brains. People on death beds are typically under the influence of some sort of mind-altering drug. All of them, whether believers of religion or not, whether cultists or not, slip from life to death peacefully. I've even heard of non-truthers dying while doing what they enjoy - falling over dead. No long drawn out ordeal, which is what is expected of all those who don't follow the 'one true way'. Can you believe it?? Non-truthers dying peacefully and without drugs! Egad! I've even heard tell of atheists dying peacefully. Gasp!
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Post by jondough on Jun 7, 2014 10:50:54 GMT -5
I guess, when people are taught to believe all things spoken by one group and to believe that a god is directing them in all things, they no longer use their brains. People on death beds are typically under the influence of some sort of mind-altering drug. All of them, whether believers of religion or not, whether cultists or not, slip from life to death peacefully. I've even heard of non-truthers dying while doing what they enjoy - falling over dead. No long drawn out ordeal, which is what is expected of all those who don't follow the 'one true way'. Can you believe it?? Non-truthers dying peacefully and without drugs! Egad! I've even heard tell of atheists dying peacefully. Gasp! I was believing you until you said the one about the Atheist.
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Post by jondough on Jun 7, 2014 10:52:10 GMT -5
Not to hijack this thread, so this is just a quick question Nathan....no cut and paste answers please. I know Leo didn't teach you about VT....or any other F&W. 1. What made you begin to believe in VT and Aliens? Was it from watching YouTube videos? 2. When did you start believing the above? ~~ I have read about the existence of angels from the Bible for 35 yrs. I read and heard about the aliens/fallen angels since 1980s. I saw a website on UFOs Aliens technology link in a Vietnamese newspaper about two years ago. I did some looking into it...
The life and death of Phil Schneider 1996. VERY interesting Documented WWII history with the Germans and More .... Over 2,527,162 Viewers!
~~ Reptilians/Serpent race live underground for Hundreds, Thousands, millions of years. Firefight with tall greys in 1979 Dulce, New Mexico underground bases against the Tall greys aliens. Cities, tunnels, bases underground and seas around the world. Different races from other worlds live underground (15:00) Life of Phil Schneider and his father (34:00). Phil has an IQ of 163. ET Joint minds control programs with Military governments underground bases. (57:00) Organizations runs the world system: Religious, education, financial institutions, global elites, Military Industrial complex, control press, Intelligent groups NSA, CIA, FBI, etc... (59:16) Details of Phil's murder (1:12)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=XzWGsO0F3b8
I heard about Valiant Thor, an angel of God working, visiting the Pentagon in 1930s, from Phil Schneider youtube videos on the Internet. He lived and was murdered in 1996 Wilsonville/Portland, by the dark force within the gov't who did not want him to continue speaking about his experience with Aliens contacts, Aliens (treaties and abductions), UFO's, the One World Government, Black Budgets, Underground Mountain Bases, CIA involvement in civilian murders and drugs, Stealth technology, the Philadelphia Experiment, Operation Crossroads (Bikini Island A-bomb experiments), 100 US Special forces Vs. Tall greys Dulce Fire Fight in Dulce, New Mexico underground bases 1979, the Oklahoma bombing, the World Trade Center bombing, missing children, Gunderson Freight Cars, the opening of concentration camps and Marshal Law/UN involvement, man-made viruses and earthquakes started by the gov't, etc.
President Jimmy Carter ordered the Attacked on Dulce, New Mexico underground bases against the Tall greys/US scientists experiment/creating Hybrid race, Super Soldiers in 1979.
Camelot: Kerry Cassidy interview in 2013 with Captain Mark Richards firefight with the tall greys in Ducle, New Mexico 1979. He confessed that the US governments have worked with many heavenly being races. The aliens within the Vatican.
The Air Force Intelligence Officer that reportedly was the man who met with the Aliens at Holloman (Air Force Base) in 1964, was the legendary 'Dutchman,' Ellis Loyd Richards, Jr. - the same man who would reportedly order the attack on Dulce/New Mexico firefight with the tall greys in 1979, and whose son, Captain Mark Richards, would lead the human attack on the facility."---E.D.H. Earth Defense Head quarter's www.youtube.com/watch?v=5bPhG3WP2xM
I believe in Aliens/fallen angels, and Valiant Thor about two years ago, 2012. Uncle Leo Stancliff died in 2005.
Thanks Nathan, I was just curious.
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Post by What Hat on Jun 7, 2014 10:57:35 GMT -5
I wished professing folks in nursing homes could spend the time watching TV, playing bingo or listening to gospel music in the conference room. T be unable to move and have nothing to do would be BORING! I remember visiting some older saints and noticing how they would sit around with the lights turned off. The last days can be good days if we are engaged in something we enjoy. As long as we aren't in pain and have a sound mind, we don't have to spend the last days in isolation. I really recommend reading "A Day in the Life of Ivan Denisovitch" which is a very enlightening commentary on what we actually *need* to sustain our spirit.
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Post by faune on Jun 7, 2014 11:01:11 GMT -5
Oh my gosh! Do you suppose NB is actually VT? !? Who is this imposter, NB?
How dare HE!
I AM Valiant Thor! "I am Valiant Thor! Do not try to escape me. Pleading is futile and so are your prayers. There is one thing that you must not do. Do not say my name, do not say my name, do not say my name, my name, -in vain!"(tune of "O come all ye faithful")
PS: My apology to "I am the Grither"
Dmmichgood ~ Glad to see you have such a sharp mind and wit at your age ~ there may be hope for the rest of us trailing behind you, if we keep our faculties in good shape from daily usage? BTW, I had to check on line to learn more about the Grither to see if he was anything like Valiant Thor.
www.mythicalcreaturesguide.com/page/Grither
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Post by What Hat on Jun 7, 2014 11:02:07 GMT -5
Valiant Thor reads here and you may well get a visit before it is time for you to shuffle off that mortal coil! Oh my gosh! Do you suppose NB is actually VT? !? New Brunswick is Vermont? Almost the same thing except the latter has Ben & Jerry's.
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Post by faune on Jun 7, 2014 11:29:21 GMT -5
I wished professing folks in nursing homes could spend the time watching TV, playing bingo or listening to gospel music in the conference room. T be unable to move and have nothing to do would be BORING! I remember visiting some older saints and noticing how they would sit around with the lights turned off. The last days can be good days if we are engaged in something we enjoy. As long as we aren't in pain and have a sound mind, we don't have to spend the last days in isolation. Walker ~ With the 2x2 ban on TV, radio, and inspirational outside literature over the years, I wouldn't be surprised if they weren't a bit depressed with nothing entertaining or comforting to challenge their mind? Although some of these bans have been lifted in recent years, it's a real shame how much people are deprived of interaction with their world due to their religious beliefs! Such isolation is not healthy and perhaps would be more detrimental to one's mental health than anything else? Makes me wonder if such isolation isn't one of the reasons why so many friends and workers suffer from depression and anxiety within the 2x2's?
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Post by What Hat on Jun 7, 2014 16:23:55 GMT -5
I wished professing folks in nursing homes could spend the time watching TV, playing bingo or listening to gospel music in the conference room. T be unable to move and have nothing to do would be BORING! I remember visiting some older saints and noticing how they would sit around with the lights turned off. The last days can be good days if we are engaged in something we enjoy. As long as we aren't in pain and have a sound mind, we don't have to spend the last days in isolation. Walker ~ With the 2x2 ban on TV, radio, and inspirational outside literature over the years, I wouldn't be surprised if they weren't a bit depressed with nothing entertaining or comforting to challenge their mind? Although some of these bans have been lifted in recent years, it's a real shame how much people are deprived of interaction with their world due to their religious beliefs! Such isolation is not healthy and perhaps would be more detrimental to one's mental health than anything else? Makes me wonder if such isolation isn't one of the reasons why so many friends and workers suffer from depression and anxiety within the 2x2's? It really depends on the temperament of the person. However, I would say that most of the friends I know are more aware of what's going on in the world than the average, at least as far as newsworthy events and politics are concerned. I've learned this in surprising ways at times. For example, my wife and I went to see Barbara Colorossa give a talk when our kids were still in school. We didn't discuss this with any of the friends; seemed like the kind of thing they would stay away from. There were probably 10 couples from our area at her talk. The same thing happened when I went with a business associate to see Preston Manning give a speech. Quite a number of the friends were there. I could go on with a number of other things. However, reclusiveness can be addictive, and I wouldn't be surprised if some friends might yield to that. But so do "worldly" folks.
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