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Post by StAnne on May 16, 2014 22:48:43 GMT -5
No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him. John 1:18
and
Not that anyone has seen the Father, except the One who is from God; He has seen the Father. John 6:46 We do not have all of the answers to the mysteries of God - but what we do know for sure is that Enoch and Elijah received an early grace in the manner of their departure from this realm. When John the apostle was on the island of Patmos (95 A.D.) he saw God the Father sitting on his throne, and God the Son/Jesus sitting on his own throne Rev. 5. Moses saw the back of God in the Old Testament. Abraham and Sarah saw, talked and ate with God the Son in Gen. 18-19.Nathan, I am not arguing the point one way or the other - you may see a neutral stance when I said we do not have all of the answers to the mysteries of God. It seems that Pope Saint John Paul II's opinion agrees with your opinion. So here's a Dave Armstrong link that you may find interesting: socrates58.blogspot.com/2005/01/are-catholics-permitted-to-believe.htmlThis POV expresses my opinion on the matter ... Valentine Long, O.F.M., in his book, The Mother of God (Franciscan Herald Press, 1976), further clarifies the issue for us:
Whether any human bodies but those of Mary and her divine Son are already in heaven, does not fall within the confines of doctrine. There may be others. But the faithful are not obliged to believe there are. The Church allows the possibility ...
socrates58.blogspot.com/2005/01/are-catholics-permitted-to-believe.html
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Post by StAnne on May 18, 2014 20:01:06 GMT -5
In addition to the Pope's prayer that I have previously posted it is interesting what Pope Pius XII wrote when the Roman Catholic Church officially declared Mary "Queen of Heaven" in 1954.A brief background for those who haven't been reflecting on it as you say you have been ...I have been reflecting these past few weeks on what Marian theology as developed by the Catholic Church actually means for a person of that denomination. Perhaps St Anne might like to comment.For Catholics in general - the main difference is that Catholics should have been taught - and therefore should understand that we are not to confuse the worship due God with the honor we give to Mary.
It comes more naturally to Catholics because many have grown up in the Church and understand prayer to the Communion of Saints - asking (which is what prayer is) the Saints to intercede for us in prayer. It doesn't make sense to me why I would pray to, or venerate, a good woman or man, who by her own admission needed a Saviour. No-one who has ever walked on earth, except God in the form of His Son, has ever been sinless. ...Do you ask any on earth to pray with you for a particular intention - for someone who is ill, for instance? For traveling safety?
Then why not ask the Saints to pray with you for that intention - the Body of Christ is ONE body - our God is a God of the living - not a God of the dead - their bodies are at rest but their souls are alive in the presence of God. (Rev 6:9-10)
The Church Triumphant
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Post by StAnne on May 18, 2014 22:52:23 GMT -5
I have been reflecting these past few weeks on what Marian theology as developed by the Catholic Church actually means for a person of that denomination. Perhaps St Anne might like to comment. It doesn't make sense to me why I would pray to, or venerate, a good woman or man, who by her own admission needed a Saviour. No-one who has ever walked on earth, except God in the form of His Son, has ever been sinless. Even though I respect Mary greatly I can't see why (or why she would want me to) I should cast myself down at her throne, venerate her or seek her intercession, (as the RCC implores) when she herself knew that all adulation, veneration and honour should go to Christ and God alone? Not sure what you mean by 'cast myself down at her throne' - but because Bert also mentioned his friend who 'prostrates herself' before a statue - this is too good not to share ...
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Post by StAnne on May 18, 2014 23:15:07 GMT -5
I have been reflecting these past few weeks on what Marian theology as developed by the Catholic Church actually means for a person of that denomination. Perhaps St Anne might like to comment. ... Even though I respect Mary greatly I can't see why (or why she would want me to) I should cast myself down at her throne, venerate her or seek her intercession, (as the RCC implores) when she herself knew that all adulation, veneration and honour should go to Christ and God alone? She was cognizant of the grace and blessings bestowed upon her because of the One she would carry and give human flesh. Because of that - she was Immaculately Conceived - holy and consecrated (set apart) for God's purposes. Do you only respect her or do you also call her blessed - as did the angel of God? And Elizabeth. And in the sixth month, the angel Gabriel was sent from God into a city of Galilee, called Nazareth
And the angel ... said unto her: Hail, full of grace, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women.
Fear not, Mary, for thou hast found grace with God
The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the most High shall overshadow thee.
And therefore also the Holy which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.
And Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Ghost: And she cried out with a loud voice, and said:
Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb.
And whence is this to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?
For behold as soon as the voice of thy salutation sounded in my ears, the infant in my womb leaped for joy.
And blessed art thou that hast believed, because those things shall be accomplished that were spoken to thee by the Lord.
And Mary said:
My soul doth magnify the Lord
my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour
... from henceforth all generations shall call me blessed (Luke 1)
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