shiloh
Senior Member
Posts: 723
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Post by shiloh on Nov 17, 2010 17:13:26 GMT -5
Re: Jeff Thayer should replace Barry Barkley « Reply #57 on Nov 13, 2010, 5:48am »
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Nov 13, 2010, 1:26am, alexander wrote: I feel your pain, Pianoman, and I believe you regarding your being lied about. I see that currently happening (lying/gossip) in certain situations as well- and it is a despicable and cowardly practice that some insecure professing friends and workers engage in.
Its not only a despicable and cowardly practice, but its totally opposed to the example and teaching of Jesus and the apostles.
Why do people do this? _____________ Yet I have to admit that I also did this many times in my younger professing days. I was so overzealous and always craving worker approval. Worker approval to me was as important as approval from God. I have ratted on certain friends to the workers. Yes, I hang my head in shame for doing it. I felt the need to tattle about people's meeting attendance. I wonder if any got a worker talk or excommunication over anything I said???
They do it just like I did it. Been there and done that. I am sorry I did it. I often gossiped about weaker saints. I was busting my butt trying to do my best and resented the slackers in the fellowship.
Its not only a despicable and cowardly practice, but its totally opposed to the example and teaching of Jesus and the apostles.
Why do people do this?
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Post by Linford Bledsoe on Nov 17, 2010 17:20:35 GMT -5
Shiloh..........Why do people do this?
Because they are not spiritual people.
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Post by ts on Nov 17, 2010 20:17:10 GMT -5
Shiloh..........Why do people do this? Because they are not spiritual people. Are people who are not spiritual also not saved? What is the difference? See, that is another problem with all these little euphemisms for salvation. "professing", "spiritual", etc... There are many ways that the workers and friends can IMPLY that a person is not saved but not come right out and "be judgmental." They would not be so unclever as to do that. So we are left with statements like, "I will not be so unspiritual as to judge another man's soul like you are doing, you unspiritual outsider. No wonder you left with a spirit like that."
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Post by emy on Nov 18, 2010 0:29:16 GMT -5
Shiloh..........Why do people do this? Because they are not spiritual people. Amen TS: Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. You decide.
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Post by blankets on Nov 18, 2010 6:57:03 GMT -5
The blue is either a misunderstanding or a lie or a joke. I'll go with it being a lie. I find asking people "what do you mean?" better than stating "you lie" when it comes to things of opinion or things of experience. hmmm. blankets
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Post by kencoolidge on Nov 18, 2010 9:18:37 GMT -5
Shiloh..........Why do people do this? Because they are not spiritual people. Are people who are not spiritual also not saved? What is the difference? See, that is another problem with all these little euphemisms for salvation. "professing", "spiritual", etc... There are many ways that the workers and friends can IMPLY that a person is not saved but not come right out and "be judgmental." They would not be so unclever as to do that. So we are left with statements like, "I will not be so unspiritual as to judge another man's soul like you are doing, you unspiritual outsider. No wonder you left with a spirit like that." Shiloh..........Why do people do this? Because they are not spiritual people. Report Post - Report to Mod - Link to Post - Back to Top Logged ts Royal Member member is offline Joined: Jul 2010 Gender: Male Posts: 1,582 Re: Jeff Thayer should replace Barry Barkley « Reply #64 Yesterday at 20:17 » -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Yesterday at 17:20, Linford Bledsoe wrote:Shiloh..........Why do people do this? Because they are not spiritual people. Are people who are not spiritual also not saved? What is the difference? See, that is another problem with all these little euphemisms for salvation. "professing", "spiritual", etc... There are many ways that the workers and friends can IMPLY that a person is not saved but not come right out and "be judgmental." They would not be so unclever as to do that. So we are left with statements like, "I will not be so unspiritual as to judge another man's soul like you are doing, you unspiritual outsider. No wonder you left with a spirit like that." Report Post - Report to Mod - Link to Post - Back to Top Logged -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- A video - Emotional Support Training in the Work - www.youtube.com/watch?v=JhlWddAXSRASpeaking out against vague doctrine and abuse of power www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAaWvVFERVA&feature=related emy Royal Member member is offline Joined: Jun 2008 Gender: Female Posts: 3,187 Location: USA Re: Jeff Thayer should replace Barry Barkley « Reply #65 Today at 0:29 » -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Yesterday at 17:20, Linford Bledsoe wrote:Shiloh..........Why do people do this? Because they are not spiritual people. Amen TS: Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. You decide.
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Post by sharonw on Nov 18, 2010 9:36:04 GMT -5
Shiloh..........Why do people do this? Because they are not spiritual people. Amen TS: Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. You decide. It seems even though mankind may be "born again" that still does not keep him/her from being such a donkey toward others and about others! It seems that IF we think being born again keeps us from offending others and actually sinning ourselves, then perhaps we do not know what born again is! i've wondered just how many people ARE born again? It seems that those who think they're born again are just as offensive as those who have NO idea about being born again and sometimes more offensive! Self righteousness reeks sometimes!
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Post by Linford Bledsoe on Nov 18, 2010 10:03:47 GMT -5
Amen TS: Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. You decide. It seems even though mankind may be "born again" that still does not keep him/her from being such a donkey toward others and about others! It seems that IF we think being born again keeps us from offending others and actually sinning ourselves, then perhaps we do not know what born again is! i've wondered just how many people ARE born again? It seems that those who think they're born again are just as offensive as those who have NO idea about being born again and sometimes more offensive! Self righteousness reeks sometimes! Sure sounds that way!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 18, 2010 10:28:57 GMT -5
It seems even though mankind may be "born again" that still does not keep him/her from being such a donkey toward others and about others! It seems that IF we think being born again keeps us from offending others and actually sinning ourselves, then perhaps we do not know what born again is! i've wondered just how many people ARE born again? It seems that those who think they're born again are just as offensive as those who have NO idea about being born again and sometimes more offensive! Self righteousness reeks sometimes! Sure sounds that way! ;D
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Post by quizzer on Nov 18, 2010 10:44:54 GMT -5
My thoughts on why F&W lie and gossip is because they are afraid of losing their place in the 2x2s. They had to work "so hard" to get the attention and recognition of being a "better saint" that how dare others "slack off" and still get attention!!!
This competition amoung the 2x2s to become "better saints" does kill the Holy Spirit's work to help us become Christians. How can we care for one another when we're trying to beat each other into the ground to get ahead?
Just my thoughts, and I welcome yours, quizzer
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Post by reply on Nov 18, 2010 10:52:39 GMT -5
The blue is either a misunderstanding or a lie or a joke. I'll go with it being a lie. I find asking people "what do you mean?" better than stating "you lie" when it comes to things of opinion or things of experience. hmmm. blankets I am sorry. I know Nathan's opinion and experience. Have you read his website? I should have written 'I find asking people "what do you mean" better than"you lie" when it comes to things of opinion or things of experience of people I do not know.' Blankets, do you share Nathan's belief that the workers are a continuation of the twelve apostle ministry? Nathan knows of the married apostle ministry that would go where people had not heard of Jesus and preach the gospel and then turn the new converts (the church) over to bishops/elders/local leaders and the Holy Spirit. Nathan knows that the workers stem from the Faith Mission connection and that they (the workers) require "be not married" for their ministry and that they stay in place (as a ministry) to oversee and rule over the people who they have converted to their church. Nathan knows that he has comdemned people and churches for having a carnal (in his words) beginning date or a formation that is of man directly and not Jesus directly. In my opinion, Nathan needs to lie to his own self and to others so that he can live with his condemnation of others. He needs to justify that his and others' acceptance of the workers' ministry is a mark of accepting Jesus into one's life. Now, if somehow all of Nathan's condemnation of other churches and ministries and his exclusivism to the workers' ministry and church is simply a misunderstanding, then I would apologise to him. Oh, and Nathan has already said that I can call his stated conviction on the workers' church as a lie. I am free to believe what I do. The blue is either a misunderstanding or a lie or a joke. I'll go with it being a lie. ~~ No lie... have proof to back it up. but you have the right to believe it is a lie. Modification: Added In my opinion.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 18, 2010 11:42:37 GMT -5
My thoughts on why F&W lie and gossip is because they are afraid of losing their place in the 2x2s. They had to work "so hard" to get the attention and recognition of being a "better saint" that how dare others "slack off" and still get attention!!! This competition amoung the 2x2s to become "better saints" does kill the Holy Spirit's work to help us become Christians. How can we care for one another when we're trying to beat each other into the ground to get ahead? Just my thoughts, and I welcome yours, quizzer I am thankful that I've managed to attend a variety of meetings on both sides of the US where this sort of competition was not in evidence. However, I have no doubts that it happens when people forget the command of Jesus: to love one another as he loved us. We should focus instead on helping each other across the finish line--after all, last I checked, there is room for all of us in Heaven.
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Post by emy on Nov 18, 2010 15:37:51 GMT -5
TS: Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. You decide. Were you saying something to me?
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Post by kencoolidge on Nov 18, 2010 16:54:20 GMT -5
TS: Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. You decide. Emy No for the general reader. I am convinced from your posts you have already decided. ken Were you saying something to me?
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Post by blankets on Nov 18, 2010 17:32:26 GMT -5
hmmm. blankets I am sorry. I know Nathan's opinion and experience. Have you read his website? I should have written 'I find asking people "what do you mean" better than"you lie" when it comes to things of opinion or things of experience of people I do not know.' Blankets, do you share Nathan's belief that the workers are a continuation of the twelve apostle ministry? Nathan knows of the married apostle ministry that would go where people had not heard of Jesus and preach the gospel and then turn the new converts (the church) over to bishops/elders/local leaders and the Holy Spirit. Nathan knows that the workers stem from the Faith Mission connection and that they (the workers) require "be not married" for their ministry and that they stay in place (as a ministry) to oversee and rule over the people who they have converted to their church. Nathan knows that he has comdemned people and churches for having a carnal (in his words) beginning date or a formation that is of man directly and not Jesus directly. In my opinion, Nathan needs to lie to his own self and to others so that he can live with his condemnation of others. He needs to justify that his and others' acceptance of the workers' ministry is a mark of accepting Jesus into one's life. Now, if somehow all of Nathan's condemnation of other churches and ministries and his exclusivism to the workers' ministry and church is simply a misunderstanding, then I would apologise to him. Oh, and Nathan has already said that I can call his stated conviction on the workers' church as a lie. I am free to believe what I do. ~~ No lie... have proof to back it up. but you have the right to believe it is a lie. Modification: Added In my opinion.[/quote] Understood...but as Nathan declares on his website, he believes that the 2x2 origins are a continuation of the apostles Jesus sent...and that part of that line was the Vaudois people. Is something still a lie, I wonder, if somebody believes in their heart that it is true? It's something I haven't thought about before, really. Do I share Nathan's belief that it's a continuation? I'm not so sure about the Vaudois...although I will say there are alot of parallels in their beliefs and actions to what we in the 2x2 fellowship believe...but yes, I definitely believe that it's a continuation of the ministry that Jesus sent. For me, it doesn't matter whether there was an unbroken line, or not...it's enough that I can compare with the Bible and that it (the fellowship) stands up to thorough examining with the scriptures. blankets
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 18, 2010 17:53:00 GMT -5
Blankets, LIE: 1. A falsehood uttered or acted for the purpose of deception; an intentional violation of truth; an untruth spoken with the intention to deceive. [1913 Webster]
The proper notion of a lie is an endeavoring to deceive another by signifying that to him as true, which we ourselves think not to be so. --S. Clarke. [1913 Webster]
It is willful deceit that makes a lie. A man may act a lie, as by pointing his finger in a wrong direction when a traveler inquires of him his road. --Paley. [1913 Webster]
I don't for believe Nathan is "endeavoring to deceive" by any measure, but obviously some do.
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Post by blankets on Nov 18, 2010 18:51:39 GMT -5
Blankets, LIE: 1. A falsehood uttered or acted for the purpose of deception; an intentional violation of truth; an untruth spoken with the intention to deceive. [1913 Webster] The proper notion of a lie is an endeavoring to deceive another by signifying that to him as true, which we ourselves think not to be so. --S. Clarke. [1913 Webster] It is willful deceit that makes a lie. A man may act a lie, as by pointing his finger in a wrong direction when a traveler inquires of him his road. --Paley. [1913 Webster] I don't for believe Nathan is "endeavoring to deceive" by any measure, but obviously some do. Thanks for clearing that up, Hberry
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