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Post by littlegirllost on Jan 17, 2009 16:28:33 GMT -5
In John 13:34,35 Jesus talks of a new commandment, that we love one another as he loves us. In verse 35 he says: by this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.
First let me tell you that I am not a professing member, just someone who attends meetings. I have searched for years for a group of believers like this and I thought I had found them but now I'm not so sure. I am very confused and not sure which direction to turn.
John 13:34,35 keeps running through my mind. The meeting where I attend does not show this love that Jesus talks of. It just isn't there! Now I know this doesn't mean that all meetings are alike and I'm sure that Jesus Love is among others in their meetings. There are two people in our meeting that have showed genuine love and concern and I am very thankful for them. I also know that I cannot base my decision of to stay or not to stay on others behaviors.
Why would one want to attend such a meeting where there is no love? It seems that deceit and unhappiness looms over those that attend here.
How do I know for sure that this is the "TRUTH"?? I want it to be so very badly as I have searched for so long.....
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Post by Brick on Jan 17, 2009 19:46:18 GMT -5
Jesus is the Truth. He is also the way.
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Post by littlegirllost on Jan 17, 2009 21:02:36 GMT -5
very well said. thanks brick...
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shushy
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Post by shushy on Jan 17, 2009 22:03:16 GMT -5
littlegirlost, Hi, I know I need to keep looking at Jesus Christ. He is our example. I understand where you are at because I was in the same place. In the end the Lord gave me scriptures to cling to as I took that first step into a world I hadnt experienced before away from the security of the church I had known since a child. Even though those days were traumatic and painful a few yrs later I found love in another church. We can trust God to lead us. We cannot trust man. All the best.
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Post by ronhall on Jan 17, 2009 22:20:38 GMT -5
Many places in the Bible stories indicate that all was not well in the earthly kingdom. Even among the disciples of Christ there were rivalries to determine who might be the greatest, who might sit at the right and left hand side of Jesus in heaven, etc.
So is it any wonder that things haven't changed much?
How about the words of Jesus: Mat 7:21 "Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven."
In fact the act of showing love to an enemy, or perhaps to someone who doesn't show love in return produces the most blessing.
This is a lesson I need desperately to work into my life's experience.
Ron
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Post by wvmountainman on Jan 20, 2009 14:28:47 GMT -5
littlelostgirl,
I feel your hurt and disappointment. A few months ago when traveling north my wife and I stopped in a village so she could attend Sun. morning meeting. (I personally didn't care) But anyway we attended their meeting and as we were getting back on the interstate my wife asked if I felt something strange in that meeting. She went on to state the fact that there was absolutely no love floating around the room. I thought it was a strange statement, but let her ramble on and on about how the tension was very obvious between the saints. Maybe it is a woman thing, but she also noticed that lots of them pulled into a nice looking restaurant but nobody invited us to lunch with them. I of course paid no attention to that either.
Another thing my wife noticed that was really out of place was the way the elders wife looked, not her extravagant dress code, but the look on her face and the meanness in her eyes. She was like a mountain lion ready to defend her cubs or pounce on her prey. Really strange behavior for the elders wife.
The entire meeting was all geared toward the heart, meaning that all but two spoke of keeping a pure clean heart, a heart that is soft, kind, pliable, and willing for God. But the one that my wife mostly reminds me about is the middle-age gentlemen that spoke of how he just wanted to continue being a good example to everyone in the world. Never heard any statement like that before. Pride does go before the fall, and his gentleman is in a whirlwind.
The two that spoke of different topics, well the old man spoke about God's mercy, and a middle aged woman had the best message that I have heard in a long time. It was short, to the point, and I will never forget it. Her testimony was all geared toward an intimate relationship with God. She had a pencil in her hand and spoke about the uses of the pencil, she then broke the pencil and talked about how in her walk with God she had to become broken and humble in order for Him to begin his work in her life. She didn't know where she was going to be led by God, but she was willing for His guidance and instruction. Would like to go back to that little village just to find out who she is, and if she is in the work now. She sure needs to be.
My point is this, we were outsiders to this group and we felt no love. If you feel that this meeting style is what you desire or have searched for your whole life, don't let others in your group influence your going to meeting. Maybe you are what they need. Just like that lady I spoke about, that group needs her to pull them out of their problems. Some may not be willing for the change and I don't know your entire situation, but no fellowship is perfect. Every meeting has problems. Don't let the lack of love stop you. You become the individual that brings the love. Be an example for your group. Don't give up or quit being who God wants you to be.
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Post by littlegirllost on Jan 20, 2009 17:17:39 GMT -5
Thanks ever so much Mountain Man. Your words are just what I needed to hear! The Lord provides for us what we need, when we need it doesn't he?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2009 11:30:43 GMT -5
Interesting post wvmountainman.
Meetings can certainly get into a downward spiral. All it takes is the influence of a few people without love, particularly those who are in a leadership-type of position and the meeting goes cold.
However, by just a few who can ruin a meeting, so can just a few turn it around the other way. I've seen that happen too.
I see it as the 80/20 law where in any situation, including group dynamics, 20% control the 80%. So, in a meeting of 15 people, it just takes 3 who are full of love to change the whole thing.
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Post by wvmountainman on Jan 21, 2009 11:44:10 GMT -5
That's a good saying too. When God is first, it's a pretty secure position.
The 80/20 law is called Pareto's Law. It's easy to misapply and my application may not be perfectly correct, but the general principle seems to work. For example from Wikipedia:
"Microsoft also noted that by fixing the top 20% of the most reported bugs, 80% of the users would not encounter any bugs.[10]"
However, sometimes the fellowship follows this law too much like Microsoft and gets rid of the "bugs" so that the rest don't encounter any "bugs".
I prefer the way I look at it though. I suppose it's a little like the leaven concept that Jesus used. You just have to have a little of the good leaven to change the whole thing.
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Post by littlegirllost on Jan 21, 2009 13:47:36 GMT -5
Thanks everyone for your posts. I'm just trying to digest everything and pray on what I'm supposed to be doing. Please pray that the Lord shows me the"TRUE" way.
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Post by degem on Jan 21, 2009 13:54:32 GMT -5
I have been and am including you in my prayers,littlegirllost, as many others are. Here is a sincerely meant loving hug for you! Gem
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Post by roseginger on Feb 7, 2009 5:20:32 GMT -5
littlegirllost, please don't let these people get ahold of you. I was raised in this and it is in real bondage and judgement. Find a bible based church that teaches the entire bible and doesn't condemn people who aren't following their workers. That is why they treated you the way they did. They do not love thier neighbor, only people that go to thier meetings. I am no scholar, but from experience ( my entire childhood) can tell you they are dangerous as a whole. They are not consistent in their teaching and don't really have any guidelines from one country to another. I am desperatly praying that my family will see this, but they are brainwashed and heading for disaster. I don't have the finesse that alot of the others have and I apologize for that. This is very serious to me. Salvation is very important and not to be tossed around. Please consider the bible and compare it to what they teach. Two different things.
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Post by melissa on Feb 7, 2009 9:05:14 GMT -5
Much in a meeting or social gathering of any kind depends on one's own atitude. If you are overflowing with love, gratitude and praise this is what you will receive from the meeting. If on the other hand you are full of suspicion, meanness of spirit and criticism, you will experience and sense lack of love. We get what we give and nothing comes for free no matter what we go in for in life.
Whatever you decide to do, wherever you go be a giver. Take a generous view, be nonjudgmental, be happy. We reap what we sow.
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Post by melissa on Feb 7, 2009 9:15:36 GMT -5
In John 13:34,35 Jesus talks of a new commandment, that we love one another as he loves us. In verse 35 he says: by this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another. First let me tell you that I am not a professing member, just someone who attends meetings. I have searched for years for a group of believers like this and I thought I had found them but now I'm not so sure. I am very confused and not sure which direction to turn. John 13:34,35 keeps running through my mind. The meeting where I attend does not show this love that Jesus talks of. How long have you been listening in meeting? Have you had experience of members OUTSIDE of meeting? What kind of evidence of love are you seeking? WHAT YOU ARE SEEKING determines what you will RECEIVE.
Meetings are for giving praise and adoration to the Saviour. They are for sharing inspiration and insights gained in prayer and from Bible meditation.
To find love or the lack thereof you need to know people in their daily living. IMOIt just isn't there! Now I know this doesn't mean that all meetings are alike and I'm sure that Jesus Love is among others in their meetings. There are two people in our meeting that have showed genuine love and concern and I am very thankful for them. I also know that I cannot base my decision of to stay or not to stay on others behaviors. Why would one want to attend such a meeting where there is no love? It seems that deceit and unhappiness looms over those that attend here. Here you have made your judgment clear. You judge the people to be deceitful and unhappy. If you have proof of this theirin is your answer to your own question.
Sometimes it is clear that we are what we see in others, though. How do I know for sure that this is the "TRUTH"?? I want it to be so very badly as I have searched for so long.....
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Post by lin on Feb 7, 2009 11:09:49 GMT -5
littlegirllost There is no way anyone can make your decision for you. That is between you and God.If you feel that you have been led to this by God,then it is the right thing to do. If you have been led to this just by influence of others,then others can influence you.In our meeting we have love,but it is something that has to be maintained. Love in a meeting doesn't just happen,only God can put it there.
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Post by wvmountainman on Feb 7, 2009 20:07:13 GMT -5
Love in a meeting doesn't just happen,only God can put it there
Very well said Lin. I think this is the primary problem with littlelostgirl's meeting. However, we can all read between the lines and see that there is more, much more going on in this meeting than no love. Just what is it that has caused this group to loose the love? More than likely it is something that has begun to fester years ago and now has came to a head. Maybe the group does not even know they are in trouble.
littlelostgirl, I hope you continue to seek God, whether in meeting or on you own. Find someone to study the bible with you, who is just as eager to grow spiritually.
I study on Tuesday evenings with 3 other men, not in the "Truth". We meet in my basement and have a room set up just for this study. We are digging into Paul's journeys and mapping out his trips. We have maps with all different colors of markings on them for each journey hung on the walls. A round table that we are using for our current study and my wife knows not to touch a thing. ha. We have various bible versions, concordances, etc.. This along with studying Paul's writings has helped me tremendously put things into perspective and has really helped me grow spiritually and have true inner peace and joy in my life. I just hope you continue to grow with God and find yourself some study-buddies!
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Post by Scott Ross on Feb 24, 2011 9:15:09 GMT -5
I noticed it was littlegirllost's birthday, so pulled up one of the threads she posted on. Wonder how she is doing, or whether she reads here still. I wonder also how wvmountainman's bible study went with those other guys. I know that our men's bible study at church has sure been great for me. There are usually only 5-8 of us that show up, and not all are members of our church. We have some GREAT fellowship together for sure. Scott
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Post by alexander on Feb 24, 2011 9:59:17 GMT -5
littlelostgirl, I feel your hurt and disappointment. A few months ago when traveling north my wife and I stopped in a village so she could attend Sun. morning meeting. (I personally didn't care) But anyway we attended their meeting and as we were getting back on the interstate my wife asked if I felt something strange in that meeting. She went on to state the fact that there was absolutely no love floating around the room. I thought it was a strange statement, but let her ramble on and on about how the tension was very obvious between the saints. Maybe it is a woman thing, but she also noticed that lots of them pulled into a nice looking restaurant but nobody invited us to lunch with them. I of course paid no attention to that either. Another thing my wife noticed that was really out of place was the way the elders wife looked, not her extravagant dress code, but the look on her face and the meanness in her eyes. She was like a mountain lion ready to defend her cubs or pounce on her prey. Really strange behavior for the elders wife. The entire meeting was all geared toward the heart, meaning that all but two spoke of keeping a pure clean heart, a heart that is soft, kind, pliable, and willing for God. But the one that my wife mostly reminds me about is the middle-age gentlemen that spoke of how he just wanted to continue being a good example to everyone in the world. Never heard any statement like that before. Pride does go before the fall, and his gentleman is in a whirlwind. The two that spoke of different topics, well the old man spoke about God's mercy, and a middle aged woman had the best message that I have heard in a long time. It was short, to the point, and I will never forget it. Her testimony was all geared toward an intimate relationship with God. She had a pencil in her hand and spoke about the uses of the pencil, she then broke the pencil and talked about how in her walk with God she had to become broken and humble in order for Him to begin his work in her life. She didn't know where she was going to be led by God, but she was willing for His guidance and instruction. Would like to go back to that little village just to find out who she is, and if she is in the work now. She sure needs to be. My point is this, we were outsiders to this group and we felt no love. If you feel that this meeting style is what you desire or have searched for your whole life, don't let others in your group influence your going to meeting. Maybe you are what they need. Just like that lady I spoke about, that group needs her to pull them out of their problems. Some may not be willing for the change and I don't know your entire situation, but no fellowship is perfect. Every meeting has problems. Don't let the lack of love stop you. You become the individual that brings the love. Be an example for your group. Don't give up or quit being who God wants you to be. Thanks, wvmountainman. I know what you mean. My wife, kids, and I all attended the best Sunday morning meeting on the planet (if I can say so). It was led by a divorced man, who is also the father of one of the overseers. His wife was a former worker from a long time ago. A fellow with a PhD met there with his young family. And a truck driver and his wife. The meeting was in the home of a retired nurse who was like a grandmother to all. When we arrived to the little meeting, which was way out in the country- it took almost everyone an hour to get there, everyone was all smiles! Every Sunday morning. And the meeting and the spirit was very open and strong there. And the testimonies were honest and open and not limited to canned or self-effacing testimonies. I especially liked the "grandmother" of the meeting's testimony one Sunday, it was right after convention. She said that one professing man at convention was bragging about how he had sold a used car with new tires on it. However, before the buyer came to pick up the car, the man put older, used tires back onto the car. She said that this kind of behavior shouldn't even be named once among the saints. And we could all say "amen". But it was the LOVE of God dwelling within those friends that drew us to drive 60 miles to that meeting every Sunday. It was a real blessing. But then we moved. And the new meeting was much bigger, and the people were prettier and richer, and we were met with frowns and sneers every Sunday morning. My wife left that meeting in tears every Sunday. It was horrible. So we moved to another meeting, and our new meeting again is filled with love and smiles. And for that, I am really glad, or else I wouldn't be professing. Kind regards, Alexander
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Post by alexander on Feb 24, 2011 10:00:40 GMT -5
Much in a meeting or social gathering of any kind depends on one's own atitude. If you are overflowing with love, gratitude and praise this is what you will receive from the meeting. If on the other hand you are full of suspicion, meanness of spirit and criticism, you will experience and sense lack of love. We get what we give and nothing comes for free no matter what we go in for in life. Whatever you decide to do, wherever you go be a giver. Take a generous view, be nonjudgmental, be happy. We reap what we sow. Not always true. Your advice is a slight, over generalization, but I agree, you are mostly right. Most of the time we see what we want to see. But sometimes, when you see an innocent getting beaten, they really are getting beaten.
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Post by eyedeetentee on Feb 24, 2011 13:40:45 GMT -5
What's love got to do, got to do with it? What's love but a sweet old fashioned notion?
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Post by lilwolfmisty on Feb 24, 2011 22:56:40 GMT -5
I know what you are saying littlegirllost when I was small I went to a meeting filled with love! The elder was my grandpa but he was very kind and caring to all in the community. When he passed away he filled the funeral home and then some, just because of his example in the community not just to the "friends" this was in OR. When I was almost a teenager we moved to WA in where the "friends" had no love for each other, there was gossip and backstabbing and pride of place and show all things I detest now! Then I moved again to MT where love ruled and I was blissfully happy to go to meeting, then moved again back to WA it wasn't any better than the first time so I simply dropped off attendance, then I moved again to a different town in WA state, and got to a place where I went some, but it just didn't feel right (only 3 families even tried to help or get to know me), I even had an elder come to my place when I was living with a man(my ex had went to prison) and shake the dirt off of his shoes and refuse to come into my house because I was "living in sin" This hurt me deeply! My grandpa as elder and Shepard of the sheep would NEVER EVER have done such a thing no matter how much he disagreed with a persons lifestyle or choices. So for a couple of years I went around blindly I always knew God was with me that never changed but I lost my faith in people being able to follow him, then I went to jail. In jail I attended their little services just to get out of the cell at the beginning then I saw how hard these women worked to bring the gospel to the downtrodden and drug users dregs of the society and I started reading my bible cover to cover. It took me 6 months and lots of alone time (17 hours a day confined to your bunk) when I came out I was a changed person. I learned there were inspiring songs besides the hymns old and new and I realized how naive I had been. I ended up homeless in Seattle with my male friend and we started staying in a parking lot at Seattle Unity the first time I attended a service just to see what a "worldly" Church was like I was freaked out because everyone in the HUGE congregation probably about as many as at a special meeting were hugging each other and welcoming new people and then at the end we all joined hands in a big circle and sang "Let there be Peace" It was so different but at that first service the pastor said that if you were new you should give any church a try 3 times before you decided if it was for you and I did and I am still going to Unity. I am back in MT and I still go to meetings occasionally and I enjoy the fellowship of the people I have loved, but I love my new church home too. I love the 80/20 thought and the thought that we can be a love light no matter where we are. I guess what it comes down to is we go where God leads us where we can do the most good, but the other message is that we don't have to put up with people out right abusing us mentally, physically or verbally and if that is happening we need to pray about it and move on to another meeting, another church or another study gathering wherever we feel led, but we must always keep Christ first in our lives then the rest will fall into place
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Post by ts on Feb 24, 2011 23:11:20 GMT -5
I know what you are saying littlegirllost when I was small I went to a meeting filled with love! The elder was my grandpa but he was very kind and caring to all in the community. When he passed away he filled the funeral home and then some, just because of his example in the community not just to the "friends" this was in OR. When I was almost a teenager we moved to WA in where the "friends" had no love for each other, there was gossip and backstabbing and pride of place and show all things I detest now! Then I moved again to MT where love ruled and I was blissfully happy to go to meeting, then moved again back to WA it wasn't any better than the first time so I simply dropped off attendance, then I moved again to a different town in WA state, and got to a place where I went some, but it just didn't feel right (only 3 families even tried to help or get to know me), I even had an elder come to my place when I was living with a man(my ex had went to prison) and shake the dirt off of his shoes and refuse to come into my house because I was "living in sin" This hurt me deeply! My grandpa as elder and Shepard of the sheep would NEVER EVER have done such a thing no matter how much he disagreed with a persons lifestyle or choices. So for a couple of years I went around blindly I always knew God was with me that never changed but I lost my faith in people being able to follow him, then I went to jail. In jail I attended their little services just to get out of the cell at the beginning then I saw how hard these women worked to bring the gospel to the downtrodden and drug users dregs of the society and I started reading my bible cover to cover. It took me 6 months and lots of alone time (17 hours a day confined to your bunk) when I came out I was a changed person. I learned there were inspiring songs besides the hymns old and new and I realized how naive I had been. I ended up homeless in Seattle with my male friend and we started staying in a parking lot at Seattle Unity the first time I attended a service just to see what a "worldly" Church was like I was freaked out because everyone in the HUGE congregation probably about as many as at a special meeting were hugging each other and welcoming new people and then at the end we all joined hands in a big circle and sang "Let there be Peace" It was so different but at that first service the pastor said that if you were new you should give any church a try 3 times before you decided if it was for you and I did and I am still going to Unity. I am back in MT and I still go to meetings occasionally and I enjoy the fellowship of the people I have loved, but I love my new church home too. I love the 80/20 thought and the thought that we can be a love light no matter where we are. I guess what it comes down to is we go where God leads us where we can do the most good, but the other message is that we don't have to put up with people out right abusing us mentally, physically or verbally and if that is happening we need to pray about it and move on to another meeting, another church or another study gathering wherever we feel led, but we must always keep Christ first in our lives then the rest will fall into place What a wonderfully moving testimony. Thank you so much for sharing.
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Post by faune on Feb 26, 2011 21:22:59 GMT -5
In John 13:34,35 Jesus talks of a new commandment, that we love one another as he loves us. In verse 35 he says: by this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another. First let me tell you that I am not a professing member, just someone who attends meetings. I have searched for years for a group of believers like this and I thought I had found them but now I'm not so sure. I am very confused and not sure which direction to turn. John 13:34,35 keeps running through my mind. The meeting where I attend does not show this love that Jesus talks of. How long have you been listening in meeting? Have you had experience of members OUTSIDE of meeting? What kind of evidence of love are you seeking? WHAT YOU ARE SEEKING determines what you will RECEIVE.
Meetings are for giving praise and adoration to the Saviour. They are for sharing inspiration and insights gained in prayer and from Bible meditation.
To find love or the lack thereof you need to know people in their daily living. IMOIt just isn't there! Now I know this doesn't mean that all meetings are alike and I'm sure that Jesus Love is among others in their meetings. There are two people in our meeting that have showed genuine love and concern and I am very thankful for them. I also know that I cannot base my decision of to stay or not to stay on others behaviors. Why would one want to attend such a meeting where there is no love? It seems that deceit and unhappiness looms over those that attend here. Here you have made your judgment clear. You judge the people to be deceitful and unhappy. If you have proof of this theirin is your answer to your own question.
Sometimes it is clear that we are what we see in others, though. How do I know for sure that this is the "TRUTH"?? I want it to be so very badly as I have searched for so long..... My friendly advice to you is to "keep seaching" until you do find a church home where the love of God can be felt and experienced. I was in this group for 30 years and tried to no avail to show love to some of these people who radiated no warmth. After some years I realized I was wasting my time in a fellowship that was more about appearances than spirituality. I left over 15 years ago and eventually God led me to a church I call home, because the love is there and the Bible is correctly taught. The 2x2's church doctrine does not have Christian roots; it's founder, William Irvine, was opposed to everything that stood for Christianity, that is why they are so much against outside churches. Do your research on line of the 2x2's and I'm sure you will come to the reality of the truth about this fellowship and have no doubt about the need to move on in your search for real Christian fellowship and teaching. My prayers are with you, "littlelostgirl."
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Post by faune on Feb 26, 2011 21:28:09 GMT -5
littlelostgirl, I feel your hurt and disappointment. A few months ago when traveling north my wife and I stopped in a village so she could attend Sun. morning meeting. (I personally didn't care) But anyway we attended their meeting and as we were getting back on the interstate my wife asked if I felt something strange in that meeting. She went on to state the fact that there was absolutely no love floating around the room. I thought it was a strange statement, but let her ramble on and on about how the tension was very obvious between the saints. Maybe it is a woman thing, but she also noticed that lots of them pulled into a nice looking restaurant but nobody invited us to lunch with them. I of course paid no attention to that either. Another thing my wife noticed that was really out of place was the way the elders wife looked, not her extravagant dress code, but the look on her face and the meanness in her eyes. She was like a mountain lion ready to defend her cubs or pounce on her prey. Really strange behavior for the elders wife. The entire meeting was all geared toward the heart, meaning that all but two spoke of keeping a pure clean heart, a heart that is soft, kind, pliable, and willing for God. But the one that my wife mostly reminds me about is the middle-age gentlemen that spoke of how he just wanted to continue being a good example to everyone in the world. Never heard any statement like that before. Pride does go before the fall, and his gentleman is in a whirlwind. The two that spoke of different topics, well the old man spoke about God's mercy, and a middle aged woman had the best message that I have heard in a long time. It was short, to the point, and I will never forget it. Her testimony was all geared toward an intimate relationship with God. She had a pencil in her hand and spoke about the uses of the pencil, she then broke the pencil and talked about how in her walk with God she had to become broken and humble in order for Him to begin his work in her life. She didn't know where she was going to be led by God, but she was willing for His guidance and instruction. Would like to go back to that little village just to find out who she is, and if she is in the work now. She sure needs to be. My point is this, we were outsiders to this group and we felt no love. If you feel that this meeting style is what you desire or have searched for your whole life, don't let others in your group influence your going to meeting. Maybe you are what they need. Just like that lady I spoke about, that group needs her to pull them out of their problems. Some may not be willing for the change and I don't know your entire situation, but no fellowship is perfect. Every meeting has problems. Don't let the lack of love stop you. You become the individual that brings the love. Be an example for your group. Don't give up or quit being who God wants you to be. Wvmountainman, I feel your wife's experience was more like an epiphany -- an eye opener concerning the reality within the faith. There may be a few who do show love, but the majority show judgment and indifference, especially the workers, from my own exposure over 30 years within the 2x2's. I guess I was a slow learner for staying around where I wasn't appreciated, but I learned my lesson well. You need to follow your gut reaction, because that is usually the Holy Spirit trying to reason with your conscience concerning what is real and what is not. Your wife's intuition I would trust over indoctrination by the 2x2's over the years.
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Post by faune on Feb 26, 2011 21:40:59 GMT -5
I know what you are saying littlegirllost when I was small I went to a meeting filled with love! The elder was my grandpa but he was very kind and caring to all in the community. When he passed away he filled the funeral home and then some, just because of his example in the community not just to the "friends" this was in OR. When I was almost a teenager we moved to WA in where the "friends" had no love for each other, there was gossip and backstabbing and pride of place and show all things I detest now! Then I moved again to MT where love ruled and I was blissfully happy to go to meeting, then moved again back to WA it wasn't any better than the first time so I simply dropped off attendance, then I moved again to a different town in WA state, and got to a place where I went some, but it just didn't feel right (only 3 families even tried to help or get to know me), I even had an elder come to my place when I was living with a man(my ex had went to prison) and shake the dirt off of his shoes and refuse to come into my house because I was "living in sin" This hurt me deeply! My grandpa as elder and Shepard of the sheep would NEVER EVER have done such a thing no matter how much he disagreed with a persons lifestyle or choices. So for a couple of years I went around blindly I always knew God was with me that never changed but I lost my faith in people being able to follow him, then I went to jail. In jail I attended their little services just to get out of the cell at the beginning then I saw how hard these women worked to bring the gospel to the downtrodden and drug users dregs of the society and I started reading my bible cover to cover. It took me 6 months and lots of alone time (17 hours a day confined to your bunk) when I came out I was a changed person. I learned there were inspiring songs besides the hymns old and new and I realized how naive I had been. I ended up homeless in Seattle with my male friend and we started staying in a parking lot at Seattle Unity the first time I attended a service just to see what a "worldly" Church was like I was freaked out because everyone in the HUGE congregation probably about as many as at a special meeting were hugging each other and welcoming new people and then at the end we all joined hands in a big circle and sang "Let there be Peace" It was so different but at that first service the pastor said that if you were new you should give any church a try 3 times before you decided if it was for you and I did and I am still going to Unity. I am back in MT and I still go to meetings occasionally and I enjoy the fellowship of the people I have loved, but I love my new church home too. I love the 80/20 thought and the thought that we can be a love light no matter where we are. I guess what it comes down to is we go where God leads us where we can do the most good, but the other message is that we don't have to put up with people out right abusing us mentally, physically or verbally and if that is happening we need to pray about it and move on to another meeting, another church or another study gathering wherever we feel led, but we must always keep Christ first in our lives then the rest will fall into place I enjoyed your final conclusion about not standing for abuse in any fashion, and moving on to where we are appreciated and celebrated -- not put down or shunned. That type of environment is a downer no matter how you look at it and will destroy your self esteem if you stay around long enough. God never met for any of us to be "miserable" in our form of worship -- if we are feeling that way -- then something is definitely wrong. When we move on to another fellowship, we find out usually that our "gut feeling" was right all along. I sincerely believe that "gut feeling" is our inner conscience trying to get our attention that all is not well and we need to keep searching for God's Truth. Eventually we all come to the same place of realizing that God's will is found in Jesus -- the Way, the Truth, and the Life! Any other method of worship that does not put Him first, is to be shunned, because it only leads us down the wrong path to God.
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Post by faune on Feb 26, 2011 21:45:04 GMT -5
littlegirllost, please don't let these people get ahold of you. I was raised in this and it is in real bondage and judgement. Find a bible based church that teaches the entire bible and doesn't condemn people who aren't following their workers. That is why they treated you the way they did. They do not love thier neighbor, only people that go to thier meetings. I am no scholar, but from experience ( my entire childhood) can tell you they are dangerous as a whole. They are not consistent in their teaching and don't really have any guidelines from one country to another. I am desperatly praying that my family will see this, but they are brainwashed and heading for disaster. I don't have the finesse that alot of the others have and I apologize for that. This is very serious to me. Salvation is very important and not to be tossed around. Please consider the bible and compare it to what they teach. Two different things. Roseginger, I hear you! Great advice from someone else who has been there and taken that "wrong turn" down the "Working Your Way to Salvation Road." What the 2x2's teach and what the Bible actually teaches are two different things entirely!
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Post by faune on Feb 26, 2011 21:50:34 GMT -5
Love in a meeting doesn't just happen,only God can put it thereVery well said Lin. I think this is the primary problem with littlelostgirl's meeting. However, we can all read between the lines and see that there is more, much more going on in this meeting than no love. Just what is it that has caused this group to loose the love? More than likely it is something that has begun to fester years ago and now has came to a head. Maybe the group does not even know they are in trouble. littlelostgirl, I hope you continue to seek God, whether in meeting or on you own. Find someone to study the bible with you, who is just as eager to grow spiritually. I study on Tuesday evenings with 3 other men, not in the "Truth". We meet in my basement and have a room set up just for this study. We are digging into Paul's journeys and mapping out his trips. We have maps with all different colors of markings on them for each journey hung on the walls. A round table that we are using for our current study and my wife knows not to touch a thing. ha. We have various bible versions, concordances, etc.. This along with studying Paul's writings has helped me tremendously put things into perspective and has really helped me grow spiritually and have true inner peace and joy in my life. I just hope you continue to grow with God and find yourself some study-buddies! Wvmountainman, when I first left the fellowship, I started out for about six months in a study group at work during lunch hour which was the best thing I ever experienced. I learned a lot and it helped the walls to gradually come down that the 2x2's brainwashing had re-enforced over the years. I found there were really hearty Christians on the outside that showed Christ's love and you could relate to them without intimidation. That was a marvelous revelation for me and helped me to venture into a church setting later on that fed my soul and taught me real Christian doctrine -- something missing in the Truthers because of their "core beliefs" being centered in everything but the Gospel Truth!
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Post by faune on Feb 26, 2011 21:59:10 GMT -5
TS, I believe the correct Bible rendition is that "a little of the bad leaven" corrupts the whole lump. The right spirit does not thrive in a hostile environment -- it will eventually taint your own spirit if you hang around long enough trying to change things. I know from experience and stayed way beyond my comfort zone! However, back in Connecticut, I did attend a Sunday morning meeting that was definitely more loving in their dealings with others in the fellowship. I thought that was the case wherever you went according to the workers, but found out sadly it was not. You can count your blessings if you are in a meeting that shows love and concern over indifference. What is in people's heart will eventually show itself, and if love is missing, that will be obvious over a brief period of time. You can't fake Christian love, it's either there or it's not there and it can be felt in meeting from the get-go.
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